'Cipher' - full dynamic [SP & MP/Coop] with unlimited replayability

[WallyJas 10]

Hey Wiper,

I have finally had a chance to play 1.36 and I must say the chopper insertion is the best yet, it's very smooth and feels realistic. The enemy AI are soooo good, better than any other SP mission I have played. I also love it that sometimes the rally point with the vehicle and cache is a decent walk away, not right next to the insertion point. Oh, I also love the high sun setting ..... thanks. :)

Can I suggest a couple more improvements please? I am not sure what others feel, but this my wish list:

1 - When being inserted with a task force for me it seems too much, there are too many in the squad. In your briefing you say that a larger force cannot be used for fear of detection, I think a smaller squad of say 3 or 4 extra AI players would be more than adequate.

2 - Also, the team seem slightly overpowered with regards to their weapon loadout. I mean we have an AA and an AT in the squad. This hardly makes the Hind or the APC's a threat. I think it would be make the gameplay tougher and make the player use his head more by taking away the direct attack weapons and replacing them with some support based weapons instead. If we are an SF team I would have thought we would want to be travelling light and fast in order to get access to the suitcase. To make it more plausible you could add it to the briefing that radio contact is only to be used if absolutely necessary, and if necessary then support would be available.

3 - At the rally point, your briefing talks about a 'forward team' are ready with transport and a weapons. Can I suggest that we change the 'forward team' to one or two 'local informants or resistance fighters'? They could bring along a civilian truck (or better yet an offroad pickup with four positions in it) for the team to use and then leave you to it, instead of joining the team and increasing the numbers.

4 - Also, it would be great to change the weapons cache back to a friendly base with a hanger and supply tent etc, and then fly to the AO rather than change weapons once we are there ...... but I know you not keen on that idea. :)

5 - I know it's a big ask, but I feel it is lacking in every ARMA2 mission that I have played so far, this one included. Is it possible to add much more civilian activity? I believe that something simple like more cars driving along roads between villages etc would be a big extra for missions like this. Is it possible to add more of this?

Thanks again for creating an awesome mission, I love it to bits .... and would love to see the ideas I suggested above implemented too ..... yes I know I am cheeky! :) :) :)

Cheers,

Wal

Edited October 2, 2009 by WallyJas

[wiper 0]

Hi Wal,

..... yes I know I am cheeky! :) :) :)

lol np, I'm fine with it :)

hm..

1) smaller squad yes, why not, but needs to be an option I'd say, particularely for MP

2) Tricky. The default loadout by now (1 LAW, 1 AA) is a result of several player/user requests. Personally I'd give the player way less heavy weapons too. On the other hand 1 LAW and 1 AA also can easily miss and without additional backup the subsequent chaos would be perfectly settled.

However, while I find your suggestions appealing they also smack of even more options at the same time.

3) Same here. Options for vehicles come to mind, again...

4) Yea good point. Maybe just install a small base with optional (random ) vehicles and supply at the next airport... and combine with 3) ?

5) twofold issue: even more civilian vehicles isnt hard at all to add in Cipher. I'm very cautious with this though as, due to its random nature, that might quickly end up in really chaotic situations if 3+ civilian vehicles bunch up in a village and will get even worse if that happens right in the middle of a tense fire fight...

However, all in all I do like these ideas and I'd very much like to see how others think about it... :)

[galzohar 31]

I don't really see much point in having a helo insertion just so you can get in a truck. IMO Just skip useless parts of the mission that do nothing but effectively act as a cutscene, or at least make it an option.

Also, as I already said, I still think it's better to keep weapon selection to one place - either briefing (which seems to be working properly, although a bit laggy) or in the truck. In the briefing makes more sense, but in the truck avoids lag. Anyway, if weapon selection is done in the briefing, the truck should contain only ammo for maximum realism.

Having to gear people twice, once in the briefing and once in the truck, is a real annoyance.

[keet 10]

Anyone having issues with single-player save games?

Maybe its the new beta or maybe its cipher 136 but anyway... I save often, and once it gets to the point where you have to overwrite your saves it seems like it is not always working unless you overwrite the most recent save.

Anyone else see anything like this?

Anyway... loving the mission as usual. I love the helo insertion and the truck and the loadouts.

If some say it is easy you can always walk or have your team gear up without the weapons.

I play spec op more often( love feeling outnumbered b.e.l.) but I do agree with a smaller unit size in task force (4-5 man team would be great) or better yet give a series of options for team size.

By the way, I love options and the amount you have given us so far at startup is great, I love that, thanks so much.

The time you have to wait for the suitcase to download is awesome, I was involved in an intense firefight the second I started downloading and broke off only to lose the code and had to redownload. It was so intense.

additional civies would be good. I understand yourconcerns for bunching up in towns but I think of that as human nature with the civies panicing and trying to escape, causing some mass chaos, the sort of hysteria that you do not plan for but must improvise to overcome.

Anyhow, the mission is top rate, the best there is IMO. All I could ask for is more options for stuff, I love options :yay:

Great job and thank you again for making this and so regularly updating and most of all, thanks for so many great missions. I play late at night and every day after I am like an old man telling war stories when I go to work, retelling legendary battle stories that my co-workers love to hear. Pretty soon I'll have half the company playing this game based on my excitement of telling these stories alone.

Keep up the great work!!!

[WallyJas 10]

2) Tricky. The default loadout by now (1 LAW, 1 AA) is a result of several player/user requests. Personally I'd give the player way less heavy weapons too. On the other hand 1 LAW and 1 AA also can easily miss and without additional backup the subsequent chaos would be perfectly settled. However, while I find your suggestions appealing they also smack of even more options at the same time.

I see your point, that just cause the AI team members have the gear does not mean that they will always be successful using it. My main thoughts are that would an SF squad doing this type of mission be carrying AA and AT? Surely that's the type of weaponry a larger squad would use.

I don't really see much point in having a helo insertion just so you can get in a truck.

For me the helo insertion is all about setting the scene and giving the player time to get a feel for the mission. If the mission started at the rally point with the truck I think alot of immersion would be lost. Keep the helo insertion and make it longer I say. :)

Also, as I already said, I still think it's better to keep weapon selection to one place - the briefing makes more sense.

I reckon this is the way to go. Gear up back at a friendly base and then helo insert into the mission. It would certainly be much more realistic to gear up at a base rather than from a truck on the side of the road.

Edited October 3, 2009 by WallyJas

[zeep 3]

I only play Spec Ops and so far i haven't felt the need for anything else. One thing i'd like to try, if possible, is Spec Ops with just 1 AI teammember. That way i get to keep my exiting outnumbered mission feel and have support of 1 AI!

The mission is different all the time and i anxiously await new missions by Wiper! Randomisation is a huuuge plus for me.

[WallyJas 10]

Same here Zeep, I love playing solo but would love to have one or two AI to support and help spot. :)

[Greg 0]

I suppose you could always execute a few of your AI team members at the start of the mission, but then you have to make up some excuse for the brass. Easier if they are civies, you can just drop a spade next to them and accuse them of planting IEDs. :O

[draeath 10]

This is awesome!

The only change I would make... for SpecOps, respawning (along with a new bike). At least an option for it, anyways.

A wider selection of gear as well (I miss my vanilla M16A2).

---------- Post added at 12:37 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:36 AM ----------

I only play Spec Ops and so far i haven't felt the need for anything else. One thing i'd like to try, if possible, is Spec Ops with just 1 AI teammember. That way i get to keep my exiting outnumbered mission feel and have support of 1 AI!

The mission is different all the time and i anxiously await new missions by Wiper! Randomisation is a huuuge plus for me.

Run it as a multiplayer LAN, then you can enable/disable individual AIs. (as well, you can change other parameters such as viewdistance, enemy strength, time of day, etc)

[wiper 0]

(I miss my vanilla M16A2)

included ;)

New version uploaded, get it on first page.

As suggested options for team size in SP and different player vehicles are available now.

v1.37

• added: SP options for team size.
  
• added: options for player vehicles.
  
• added: supply depot randomly somewhere near the approach path.
  
• improved: options dialog.
  
• fixed: wrong daylight emphasis notations in the briefing hints.
  
• fixed: insertion markers misplaced for JIP’ing players.
  

Have fun !

[zeep 3]

Just what i need on a rainy day. Nice additions!

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

Awesome Wiper, trying it now.

[Greg 0]

How can so much goodness be packed into 500kb? :)

Good work Wiper, I think that's as close to pleasing everyone as you will get.

[Punisher5555 0]

Thanks for the supply depot. I was capturing the truck you usually see along the way. Did you know even the civilian large trucks that randomly pop in various villages have ammo in them too?

[WallyJas 10]

I am the same as the others Wiper, the extra options are fantastic. You are extremely generous with your time (I know it takes you many many hours to do these updates) and I for one really appreciate your work. :)

I especially like the 'medium armed vehicles' option, it feels great being chopper inserted to meet up with a bunch of mates to patrol in Hummers. They got some good firepower but geez they sure are bullet magnets! It makes a very different mission from sneaking around on foot.

The civilian truck is a nice touch, I would love to see a covered version of it so that it feels like we are hiding in it, rather than being out in the open for all to see. Also instead of the 'light armed vehicles' (which aren't that different from the Hummers) can you put in unarmed offroad jeeps? I am thinking that instead of using a truck, sometimes it might be nice to sneak around in smaller vehicles in a convoy. Either that or you reduce the options for vehicles to two options (civilian and armed) and then you do some random thing where sometimes a truck would appear and sometimes unarmed offroad jeeps.

I know it is alot more coding but it would be great to have USFOR team mates meeting us when we choose the 'medium armed' vehicles option (cause they would be the only ones using Hummers) and then to have Militia or Insurgents meet us when we choose the truck or unarmed offroad jeep option. Then it would be like they are meeting us to help us out against the Russian General.

My only other wish would be to see more civilians on the road, driving from town to town. I think it adds much more to the feeling of the mission than to have a sterile and what seems to be a semi deserted map with just a handful of civilians around the place.

Keep up the awesome work Wiper, like others have said before there is no need to play any other missions, this is like an SP and Campaign mission all rolled into one. It is easily THE best mission to date. :)

Thanks for all your efforts.

Wal

PS: Will Cipher be able to be ported over to Op Arrowhead when it is released? :) :) :)

[Greg 0]

Thanks for the supply depot. I was capturing the truck you usually see along the way. Did you know even the civilian large trucks that randomly pop in various villages have ammo in them too?

I was pilfering them from time to time. They certainly have ammo, but no other weapons, in particular, no RPG launchers. I occasionally used these civi/militia trucks as escape vehicles with a larger squad also.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

Why do the OPFOR sometimes ride around in civilian vehicles? I'm not complaining, but I'm not sure if this is a bug or feature.

PS: Will Cipher be able to be ported over to Op Arrowhead when it is released?

I don't think anybody can say for sure, but I'd imagine in could be ported with relative ease and very little work.

[Greg 0]

Why do the OPFOR sometimes ride around in civilian vehicles? I'm not complaining, but I'm not sure if this is a bug or feature...

That was a new feature added some versions back, and some pages back in this thread. Enemies can patrol in civilian vehicles, which adds to the tension.

[WallyJas 10]

Oooohhh I like that :)

[Greg 0]

Little bit of feedback on tonight's game:

1) When I accessed the briefcase, it said 'out of range' or something like that, but still did the countdown. When count down was finished, I think it did say 'download complete' but it did not say 'all done' or show task completed. Confused, I walked away, then later came back, did the whole process a 2nd time, much closer, for the complete objective.

If possible, don't let the count down start or finish if the player is out of range, just because it is confusing. Certainly if the player walks away mid transfer, it does say 'aborted' or similar which is good.

2) The extraction chopper crashed, just clipping some trees in a forest nearby while turning shortly after takeoff. There was an enemy in a forest nearby but I don't think we were taking fire nor do I think the pilot was killed.

When replaying the ending from a save game, the chopper did complete the extraction though it started firing rockets at some enemies in a forest nearby, during the exit cut scene, which was way cool!

In hind sight, it is possible the first crashing pilot was distracted by enemies in the nearby forest and was maneuvering the chopper for an attack. In which case, it was kind of my fault for endangering the pilot and crew by calling for extraction at a hot LZ.

[wiper 0]

Yea, the chopper AI is still "messy" particularly when attacking. Hopefully BIS manages to patch it soon, its looking good for 1.05 though:

http://dev-heaven.net/issues/show/4284

It shouldnt be possible to start the countdown as long as no connection is established. Looks like a bug, will take a look into that.

Did you encounter that issue playing SP, server or client ?

As ever, thanks for the report Greg :)

[Greg 0]

...Did you encounter that issue playing SP, server or client ?

That was a SP game. The count down definitely occurred and progressed to completion, though the full objective was not met. I recall the 'out of range' text was still on screen while the counter or other action was carried out.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

What is "HCS" in the "Communication" sub menu?

[wiper 0]

What is "HCS" in the "Communication" sub menu?

HCS=Hybrid Command System, originally designed by Mr_Centipede this mod was included after its supporters and fans wanted to see it included in Cipher. It's an expanded version of BIS' High Commad module and a great addition, particularely in MP, for custom splitting and subsequent rejoining of teams. The only drawback it has afaik is that the split groups cant rejoin once after the "High Commander" is dead.

[JuggernautOfWar 1]

Alright so I tried to split my group and nothing happened. Am I stupid or what?