The need for Afghan mountains

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Anyhow, it is just a poll to see what the consumer wants. Please keep that in mind when replying.

Grtz

And it is my opinion that BIS took the right course of action in continuing to use a fictional location and realistic but fictional conflict. It might also be because I enjoy the beautiful scenery of an eastern European setting... much more than less scenic desert/middle east settings.

[Black² 10]

I would like an Middle Eastern map though.

[p75 10]

And it is my opinion that BIS took the right course of action in continuing to use a fictional location and realistic but fictional conflict. It might also be because I enjoy the beautiful scenery of an eastern European setting... much more than less scenic desert/middle east settings.

No, problem, mate, we are all entitled to our opinions, I and many for that miss an Afghanistan like terrain. Maybe all the recent war footage poisened my brain :D

The longer this poll runs, the more I'm conviced BIS should release different modules including a desert and snow map.

Grtz

[TimRiceSE 10]

Surely its better if BIS worked on the engine, and the community made units/vehicles/maps?

[p75 10]

Surely its better if BIS worked on the engine, and the community made units/vehicles/maps?

Besides some performance issues, I don't see much problems with actual engine. I would like see BIS release VBS 2 quality addons.

[EricM 0]

I would like see BIS release VBS 2 quality addons

Arma 2 units seem of higher visueal quality than VBS2. VBS2 isn't going for eye candy, it has no normal mapping and pretty standard textures.

I'm conviced BIS should release different modules including a desert and snow map.

The more the merrier. The questions are : which one first ? when ? a what cost ?

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Surely its better if BIS worked on the engine, and the community made units/vehicles/maps?

I'd prefer to see BIS getting the tools to a state where they can be released to the community.

[TimRiceSE 10]

yeah... that'd be a prerequesite for the community making things....

[Balgorg 10]

You dont need Bis to make a desert, many of the Arma 1 maps can be made to work just fine, if only someone could fix the roads, cos the new AI can't navigate the old roads for some reason?

Couple of deserts for you.......

[arr 10]

You dont need Bis to make a desert, many of the Arma 1 maps can be made to work just fine, if only someone could fix the roads, cos the new AI can't navigate the old roads for some reason?

Couple of deserts for you.......

They don't work without some files from Arma 1 and not everybody has Arma 1.

[akd42 10]

Those are mid nighties conflicts. Nothing really current is it? As to Georgia, that is some small terrorist work shoot a guard or police men or two).( In my view a placement in an Afghanistan like setting would have made much more sense. And if you think how VBS 2 is promoted you may think they would have the brain to do the same for ARMA 2. Different target group? Too realistic?

For the entire month of August 2008, Coalition military forces suffered 49 KIAs in Afghanistan. Over the course of 9 days during that same month...

...Georgia suffered 374 military/police KIA

...South Ossetia militia lost 140 KIA.

...Russia lost 64 KIA.

[dunedain 48]

For the entire month of August 2008, Coalition military forces suffered 49 KIAs in Afghanistan. [...]

What about Afghans and talibans casualties ?

Just don't compare Russian 9 days blitskrieg in Georgia with a war which began 8 years ago with 1,266 KIA Coalition side so far .. near 5000 Afghan security forces dead, almost 23 000 talibans killed, there is no comparison ..

Edited August 1, 2009 by dunedain

[b00ce 160]

I want a second Afghan Russian war where the US officially intervenes, instead of sending money the Afghans' way. It would be possible with the factions all ready available. :D

[chris64 0]

I want a second Afghan Russian war where the US officially intervenes, instead of sending money the Afghans' way. It would be possible with the factions all ready available. :D

For a moment I thought you were talking about real life and I was like :eek:

But to be honest given time the community will create a map for just about any terrain

on Earth, I remember from OFP the winter maps, desert maps, jungle maps, city maps...

Edited July 31, 2009 by chris64

[maturin 12]

Are you trying to compare Russian "blitskrieg" in Georgia with a war which began 8 years ago with 1,266 KIA Coalition side so far ? ..

The weeklong war in Georgia was more intense than a month in Afghanistan. What's to compare?

[hoak 0]

I just don't get it; for less then the price of most 'AAA' disposable titles, you get more content, features, realism, engine capability, tools, toys and mod support then any five of those 'AAA' titles -- BI is obviously very busy delivering what they know, and supporting it across a wide range of PC hardware, and you want more from them?

I'm fine with BI sticking to what they know; they do it very well, they give you an enormous boat load of bang-for-your-buck, extensive support, tools and toys to make or add any scenario in any theater you care to. I think asking for more content in the full context of what you're getting, for what you've paid is ridiculous.

:butbut:

Edited August 1, 2009 by Hoak

[OstiasMoscas 10]

I've been browsing this thread a little now, and it seems like a lot you thinks that Afganistan = desert.

That's not the case. There are green areas too, and don't forget about some of those massive poppy fields..

I'm all for an Afghanistan mod, as long as it's not just a desert map.

[maturin 12]

Chernarus is patterned after a part of the world which is remarkably diverse and compact. There are a lot of terrain features in an extremely small area. In fact, those volcanic hills look abrupt and strange in real life.

It's a good use of real estate. While Afghanistan certainly isn't all desert, it is one of those places in the world that has BIG scenery. Everything seems to be on a massive scale, far apart. Imagine playing in one of those screenshots. Snipers-only and lots of running.

So while Afghanistan doesn't fit the stereotypical view of the middle east and would be a very interesting setting if done well, I prefer the more 'cluttered' region in Arma 2.

[JackandBlood 10]

I'm reading a book Not a Good Day to Die. Its about Operation Anaconda, the effort by US special forces and a portion of the 10th Mountain and 101 Airborne to eliminate A large Al Qaida(sp) force in the dreaded valley of the Shahikot. A place where Afgan fighters dominated Soviet forces during their run at Afganistan. Its fucking epic, and recreating portions of that operation would make for some awesome gameplay.

Imagine this. They (APO command) actually successfully infiltrated the Shahikot valley, dodging patrols, sneaking past encampments, etc, with three recce teams (3-5) soldiers each, Delta and ST6 operators. One of the recce teams was almost compromised, when an enemy patrol tracked and started following their snow prints. The delta Operators were just about to squeeze the trigger and be forced to abort mission when a blizzard hit and the patrol decided, fuck this, lets get inside.

They set up key observation posts where they directed AC-130 firepower at key Al Qaida anti-aircraft positions (Dshksm perfectly setup that they would annihilate the Chinnocks(sp) the Rakksassans were going to insert with. )

Oh and for map makers, Anaconda occured in the harsh Afgan winter where in the Shahikot it routinely dropped below freezing, and it was a snowy, blizzard prone landscape, not the dusty desert that alot of people visualize about Afganistan. And cravasses and defilaids and caves a plenty. I mean all their UAV reconnaissance revealed no positions or encampments. But later the enemy force was estimated at 500+ , with mortars, Dshkms, Tons of RPGs, hell, one operator commented that some com equipment they found "was better than ours". THis is going in the mods section tool.

[Fiya 10]

Are you kidding me? I love this scenario. I think it is alot more than that Afghan scenario. This is also a bit of a 'future war/possible' war aswell. While the Afghan conflict has been around for far too long already. Who says that the Afghan war needs to be done over more Chenarus content or anything else for that matter.

I'm totally and completely against making Arma 2 (Or 3) the Afghan scenario. (Although a winter Afghanistan would be interesting.) I enjoy the almost equalness of the 'East' and 'West' troops that we have now. Afghan would set us back again. Americans aren't the only ones in the world after all, I would enjoy playing as someone else sometimes. Also its nice when the game isn't completely biased towards Americans. It would be crazy to not have them as the "MAIN CHARACTER" in a Arma game.

Arma 1 had a Middle Eastern theme, while not the terrain of Afghanistan, it had mountains, desert, forest and fields. It didn't have the vertical terrain of Afghanistan, but it had alot of the other stuff. That's as much Middle East as I want now. Way to much Middle East (Afghanistan isn't different enough for me) conflict stuff out now... Just because the American soldiers are fighting there doesn't mean we all want to be.

If we are going to have a real change of scene/scenario. Why not have something more original. (Some random suggestions to follow)

If you want that deserty feel. How about Iran, I would rather have that than the old 'US vs crappy insurgents' thing. I don't find it all that interesting though.

Also, MANY MANY more were killed in Africa, does that mean we need to have an African war expansion, or mod for Arma 2. Don't be a fool, but I would rather have that than another Middle East or Afghan game.

One I think might be interesting... Involving the Sino-Indian War. A 'fantasy' situation in which India goes to war with China over Tibet. (Or some such) Could be a religious or cultural/historical dispute, (I think that would be interesting. Also Tibet has extremely harsh winters, which could be another option) Tibet would be similar to Afghanistan in ways. (Could have territory from China and/or India aswell.) I like the territory/scenario of Tibet alot more than Afghanistan. Could be another uprising story aswell. (True Tibetans uprising against China again, eventually getting the support of India) It could play out similiar to OFP :Resistance if you so wanted. Lots of opportunity their with a big change in scenery/scenario.

Something else with China could also be good, as they are becoming very powerful. If a 'fantasy' future war were to break out I could see them being a part in it.

South America? Fantasy/future conflict involving oil. (Or whatever you want really... Resources, land, politics, kittens, etc.) Us and China perhaps, could be others or anyone. A global vie for *insert here*. More of a stretch though. That kind of terrain would be cool. Crazy vertical and Jungle?

Isreal-Egypt opening up large scale again, something like that. Use your imagination.

Something in Indonesia, again "Use your imagination".

...Some opinions and random suggestions. I would rather have something new, instead of a reconfiguration of what we have had alot of.

Oh and is it just me? Or is p75 very arrogant with a scent of ignorance aswell? :P (I only mean in the way he expresses his opinions of course.)

Cynically yours,

Fiya

Edited August 2, 2009 by Fiya

[JackandBlood 10]

Dude, if I learned anything surprising from the book its that the Al Qaida and remnants of the Taliban are VERY formidable opponents. CIA and NSA failed to get any substantial intelligences about the Shahikot force because they used code.

UAVs, satelite, spy plane, whatever found no enemy positions, it was only by the amazing skills of the Delta and ST6 Recces teams that they figured out this is a much larger and more competent force than predicted. As of where i'm in the book (i left it at a friends house, then he went to Chicago so I still at 70%), the enemy forces put two Apaches out of commission, caused serious casualties in the 101st Rakkassans by pinning them in a tactically unsound spot with mortars. (And they showed up with so many mortars, none spotted by UAV recon that you gotta give them credit for their stealthy logistics system).

As a cliffhanger, (God I gotta get that book back), it seems a Seal team, too consumed by their need to be a part of the action than make sound tactical decisions, inserted into a ridiculously hot LZ, and the enemy forces downed a Chinnock. Ya, not Black Hawk Down, fucking 40+ capacity Chinnock down.

Thats where I left off. But my message is clear, dont underestimate these guys, and the scenario would make for very challenging missions and a great SP campaign that would test the player to the limit of his command ability, its not the cakewalk so many people seem to think it is.

---------- Post added at 03:44 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:24 AM ----------

"US vs crappy insurgents'"... please dont disrespect our fallen by suggesting Al Qaida and other violent Islamic organizations are simple and easy.

And if it so suits you, you can play as the Australian SAS, they were in Operation Anaconda too.

[Callsign 128]

If i was to choose anything like this i'd rather see an afghanistan in 5 years time, whereby the afghan national army is more equipped, fighting a resurgent Taliban invading from the Pakistani tribal areas. Perhaps you could have Brit and Aussie SF helping out with perhaps no US because of hostile political opinion back in the US. In this way Russia could be asked to help out, and as no afghans would want them back thats where the situation might go critical. How about that for an interestingly complicated situation?

UK, Aussies and Russia as Blufor

ANA as Independant

Taliban as Opfor

Nationalist anti-Russian militia/group as insurgents

[Fiya 10]

Dude, if I learned anything surprising from the book its that the Al Qaida and remnants of the Taliban are VERY formidable opponents. CIA and NSA failed to get any substantial intelligences about the Shahikot force because they used code.

UAVs, satelite, spy plane, whatever found no enemy positions, it was only by the amazing skills of the Delta and ST6 Recces teams that they figured out this is a much larger and more competent force than predicted. As of where i'm in the book (i left it at a friends house, then he went to Chicago so I still at 70%), the enemy forces put two Apaches out of commission, caused serious casualties in the 101st Rakkassans by pinning them in a tactically unsound spot with mortars. (And they showed up with so many mortars, none spotted by UAV recon that you gotta give them credit for their stealthy logistics system).

As a cliffhanger, (God I gotta get that book back), it seems a Seal team, too consumed by their need to be a part of the action than make sound tactical decisions, inserted into a ridiculously hot LZ, and the enemy forces downed a Chinnock. Ya, not Black Hawk Down, fucking 40+ capacity Chinnock down.

Thats where I left off. But my message is clear, dont underestimate these guys, and the scenario would make for very challenging missions and a great SP campaign that would test the player to the limit of his command ability, its not the cakewalk so many people seem to think it is.

---------- Post added at 03:44 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:24 AM ----------

"US vs crappy insurgents'"... please dont disrespect our fallen by suggesting Al Qaida and other violent Islamic organizations are simple and easy.

And if it so suits you, you can play as the Australian SAS, they were in Operation Anaconda too.

Don't talk to me about disrespect, your taking it completely out of context yourself. I'm talking about the scenario, I don't want another terribly biased game. (Obviously biased toward the Americans.) The insurgents WILL BE crappy in comparison to the US equipment, support, etc. Don't try and play it up. I would rather play AA if I just wanted to 'kill some insurgents.' Which I don't, I want some substance. Something more than that.

If i was to choose anything like this i'd rather see an afghanistan in 5 years time, whereby the afghan national army is more equipped, fighting a resurgent Taliban invading from the Pakistani tribal areas. Perhaps you could have Brit and Aussie SF helping out with perhaps no US because of hostile political opinion back in the US. In this way Russia could be asked to help out, and as no afghans would want them back thats where the situation might go critical. How about that for an interestingly complicated situation?

UK, Aussies and Russia as Blufor

ANA as Independant

Taliban as Opfor

Nationalist anti-Russian militia/group as insurgents

I like this alot more than the stereotypical scenario. Perhaps a game where US isn't the "MAIN CHARACTER". *shockedface* If the need to play is Afghanistan is that dire.

[{G&L}ACF{SCOTDG} 10]

A lot of games are based on the fact that Russia used to be communist and was the villain, and so on and as if we are still in the cold war even though we know it ended in 1991 with the demise of the communist soviet union i would have loved if russia was on the blufor side and the campaign was based on some Russian SF unit instead of another AMERICAN one no offence its still good:p, maybe even it could be centered around russians going back into afganistan:)

[PhelanKA7 10]

Someone has probably already said this, but for the record and in response to the OP. I think the logic behind using the Russians and having a European campaign is very simple:

Taliban and al-Qaida don't have tanks/airplanes.