Radiosound + Mouse Lag Problem

[okarr 10]

i got the same thing. but what it is weird is that it suddenly started, or i didnt notice it before.

now the game feels really sluggish.

could this be the copy protection somehow kicking in ? yes, i am using an original copy !! but the thing is with a copy protection that deterioates the game how do i know this is not it happening??

/tinfoil

[SANGEKi 10]

No this has nothing to do with FADE.

I mean it would be possible for FADE (or something like it) to do something like that but in this case, no.

We're strictly talking about a design issue in the game.

Other things like extremely low performance can of course exacerbate the problem... sorry, feature.

[{sf} astra 0]

Exactly same problem here, argh9R - it's just a pain.

This "wannabe-reality-features" since ArmA1 are just killing the game.

No balance between realistic and fun like it used to be in OFP.

And, I know, even if it's called simulation - it's still just a game.

It seems many people forget about that.

For me this and the bad sound behaviors (eax, openAL) are the worst parts of ArmA.

[bekster 0]

Sad to read they didnt remove that mouse lag in Arma2... hated it in arma and wont buy arma2 now! I can live with bugs an errors, but not with this absolutely unintuitive aiming / weapon handling!!

There are way better methods to simulate weapon-weight! But an actual movement-LAG is just totally unrealistic... I cant believe anybody really thinks this is a feature?!

[Steinfisch 10]

@argh9R

I've been angry about this mouse behaviour too (already in ArmA 1). But I'm afraid this is the purpose. They want to say to you: "this is not a normal Arcade Shooter and you need skill to use these weapons". But for me they carry this to exces.

If you are healthy, not drunken and older than 16 you can hold a weapon and aim without those oscillations. The most of us did it already in real life.

You will not get a satisfactory feedback concerning this.

P.S. The same problem is the extreme oversteer of the cars. Sometimes you feel like on ice. Especially the keyboard strokes have an extreme hysteresis.

Edited June 11, 2009 by Steinfisch

[DZR_Mikhail 14]

Terrible lag!

I played arma1 and it was just perfect. Amazing response between the mouse and the cursor on the screen (as in any game nowadays)))). But when I launched arma2 I first thought I need to upgrade terribly... But Everything else was smooth and shiny except almost 0.5 second response time of mouse and the game...

Guyz, it's not a feature or any kind of realistic simulation... it's a strange problem in the engine. To test this lag I turn my mouse very quickly to the right and when my hand with mouse is already at the new position the cursor on the screen only starts moving! Same speed, same smoothness... but for unknown reason delayed for some noticable milliseconds.

Nothing of this ever happened on my PC in any game including arma1... May be in STALKER with a very high ping at MP match it occurred... But it's a ping! And here we have empty editor at Utes on the lowest settings possible...

The only solution I'll try is the Vsync off. May be this will do the miracle .

[argh9R 10]

Thank you guys for your feedback! No I know I'm not the only one with these "problems" (should I still call them "problems"? ;) )

There's no solution, I can't live with it. NO Bis worker seems to care, so...

....selling ArmAII for 35€ online version! PM :D

[galzohar 31]

At first, I thought the mouselag was an acceleration-based system meant for realistic aiming, and they just implemented it badly. Then I watched some gameplay videos on youtube and noticed the mouse moves a lot smoother for them, and realized that the unbearable mouselag is simply caused by my horrible PC (combined with an game that isn't optimized). If this was a feature, it wouldn't have been behaving so significantly different on different computers.

[SANGEKi 10]

The problem will be worse on slow systems but what we're talking about is a universal thing.

The game is unplayable for me because of the controls not because of performance.

I can (depending on settings) get reasonably great FPS on my Core i7 4.2GHz, GTX280.

It's just how the game was designed.

It's not about how fast the game will react to mouse movement.

It isn't broken in the way that the controls just don't react.

The whole design is just plain wrong and 9000 FPS won't help either.

You can't very well "see" the problem in videos either since it's mostly about how it feels rather than not being able to aim or anything.

The cursor movement itself is just fine in the parameters that they set for the game... those parameters are what is the (huge) problem for some of us.

Edited June 11, 2009 by SANGEKi

[rowdied 44]

Hello,

ARMA II feels like mouseaccleration + a serious mouse lag. Its nearly impossible to aim proper. In the menu the mouse seems to be okay. (Attention: I know that ARMAII is a realistic war-simulation. I know that BIS wanted to simulate the weight of the weapons. I know that there's a floating mode. Nevertheless I cannot imagine that this mouselag is a part of a good simulation. Thus I think its a problem of the game.) I Installed the game at serveral PCs of friends. = Same Problem. Forums said ARMA I had the same problem. Do you experience the same or do you simply don't have a problem and accept this as normal?

In an other forum I've read that it helps to set the DPI of the mouse to the maximum. I've tried it, but it wont work.

Others said the problem is the low fps-rate. I don't think so. I have very good fps and i also tried to set the graphicssettings to lowest and resolution 1024. My FPS were high and i had the same mouselag.

When do you get this mouse lag? I have a logitech mx510 and experience no lag whatsoever. Head bob, vysnc and floating zone are off.

The only lag I get is when I run for 20 yds and then try to aim, much like orig ghost recon. I have to wait for my breathing to subside before I can aim properly.

Is this what your problem is? I'm not trying to be difficult but I have arma2 on 3 different machines and arma1 on 7 all with different settings and cheap mice and have not seen this lag some talk about.

Also does this happen with both iron sights and scoped ones?

There are problems in arma2 like arma1 when going in scoped view the fps go down. I believe durgs veg fix helped with this alot until BIS released 1.14.

Spinning around for me produces no lag or delay either. Maybe I have the bugged version, bad joke.

My 2 systems

1. Q9550 @ 3.4

winxp 32

2 gig 1066 ram

gtx 260 (192sp) 896 ram

186.08 drivers

logitech mx 510 muse

2. Q6600 @ 3.2

winxp 32

2 gig 800 ram

8800gt 1 g ram

186.08 drivers

crappy MS and keyboard bundle

[galzohar 31]

When I move my mouse, it takes ~0.2s before the weapon starts moving. When I stop moving it, it takes about 0.2s to stop. The weapon movement patterns this issue creates is easily visible to someone who would just watch, which is why I can see they don't get it (at least not nearly as bad) in the videos. That is, I can't aim for !#$@, and they can. In my case of very under-performing computer, it's very easy to see how serious the mouse lag issue is, and that also shows it's most likely a performance issue or at least performance-related, which is wrong.

[bekster 0]

With my old system that i bought when Arma1 came out i had average to good fps (30-50) with everything on high... with mouse lag! Everything on very low, lower resolution, looking into the sky, still the exact same mouse lag! So for me it was not a performence issue.

And even if it was related to performence I dont get why they implemented that "feature"?! There are not many players who can play arma2 with 100+ fps... I would say BIS should at least give those players who HAVE bad mouse lag the option to disable this mouse smoothing "feature"! It wasnt in OFP and correct me if I'm wrong but isnt arma2 basicly the same engine? So it shouldnt be a problem to remove the mouse lag...

[funkee 0]

Sorry Mr Fenix you obviously accidenly posted this in this thread. No problem :)

I lol'd here too. :D maybe he was just dozy... ;) nevermind. well argh9R, I understand you fine. there is a huge mouse lag in ArmA1, that sometimes (especially with the AI presence) makes the game almost unplayble, even if you have 100+ fps. it makes movement and aiming very hard and nasty. I dont know this is poor AI algorithms or lack of internet optimisation, but definitely something is wrong with ArmA engine. I haven't played ArmA2 (not released yet in my country), but I really hope the problem was resolved. if not, there is only 1 way... OFP2DR :) (sorry Maruk, live is brutal ;))

Edited June 11, 2009 by funkee

[argh9R 10]

Hello again! I'm really happy for your responses!

At first I will take a point to rowdied's post:

The only lag I get is when I run for 20 yds and then try to aim, much like orig ghost recon. I have to wait for my breathing to subside before I can aim properly.

Is this what your problem is?

No, that is not my problem. It's always there..

What you describe sounds like -for once- a gamefeature :D

Also does this happen with both iron sights and scoped ones?

Yes, every weapon I use in every mode I use it.

There are problems in arma2 like arma1 when going in scoped view the fps go down.

The lagproblem is defenetly not fps-dependend. I tested it. (Statement for my PC)

Spinning around for me produces no lag or delay either. Maybe I have the bugged version, bad joke.

I would loooveee to test play with your system! :)

bekster:

With my old system that i bought when Arma1 came out i had average to good fps (30-50) with everything on high... with mouse lag! Everything on very low, lower resolution, looking into the sky, still the exact same mouse lag! So for me it was not a performence issue.

Altough you refer to ArmAI thats EXACTLY what I expirence in ArmAII :)

I tested it the same way.

Steinfisch: Klingt deutsch :D

If you are healthy, not drunken and older than 16 you can hold a weapon and aim without those oscillations. The most of us did it already in real life.

You will not get a satisfactory feedback concerning this.

Exactly my opinion. We won't get a feedback, thats for sure :( (BIS where are you)

SANGEKi:

The problem will be worse on slow systems but what we're talking about is a universal thing.

The game is unplayable for me because of the controls not because of performance.

I can (depending on settings) get reasonably great FPS on my Core i7 4.2GHz, GTX280.

Your system is very good. Another point for our theory that it's not fps dependent. galzohar said the mouselag gets worse if fps are low. Thats right I expirenced it, too.

Its not getting better with high fps but it's getting worse with low fps. Fantastic!

Bekster's idea is great:

.. I would say BIS should at least give those players who HAVE bad mouse lag the option to disable this mouse smoothing "feature"!

Another question I already asked in my first post: Is it possible to mod the mouse?

[thepiespy 2]

i also experienced this problem when i played at a friend's house, at first i thought it was just low fps but we found the game was running fine. It was irritating trying to hit anything. While limiting such things to heavy weapons such as 50 cals and grenade launchers on vehicles in turrets and pintle mounts would be great, putting that kind of lag on something like a carbine seems overkill.

[argh9R 10]

Very good, another player with this problem! BTW I invited a friend of mine who planned to buy the game (we wanted to play coop and build an armaII clan)

After he tested it, he refused to buy it! The radiosounds sound like a cheap navigationsystem. BTW someone posted it's a game with an open world an thus I don't have to complain about the bad radiosounds. But seriously, my navigationsystem has an open world, to (Europe.... .::........ ?? ?? :....) and it's working WAYYYY better than armaII radio sounds :D

ENEMY... leftIN... brrrigorottiiii

[Placebo 28]

Do you want to get the mouslag addressed or do you want to whinge about radio communications? Make your mind up because if it's the former I'll close the thread as it's not a troubleshooting issue it belongs here.

[argh9R 10]

I want to discuss the mouselag. No more about radiocommunication. Only mouselag. I am sorry. Thank you :)

[Placebo 28]

Welcome you and thanks.

So back to your mouse, without googling I'm assuming it's a USB mouse? Not sure if this is feasible for you but have you tried some crappy generic PS2 mouse just to check firstly the issue is with the mouse and not something wrong with the system/configuration itself?

[rowdied 44]

argh9R,

Do you use any mouse pointer programs like intelli mouse or such?

Oh I have USB and PS/2 mice on my comps and don't experience this lag.

I hope you find a solution because this sucks for you guys.

On a side note, I played a quick multiplayer mission tonight and was able to lead a guerilla along the tree line as he ran. I shot him after about 20 yds just to test and see if I could keep his same running pace and if I get some kind of hiccup or delay while doing this. Nope.

Do you guys experience any hiccup or delay when trying to lead an enemy say between 100-400ms?

---------- Post added at 09:22 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:17 AM ----------

argh9R,

check this post below yours by Moosenoodles on vsynch;

Here you go Yield, its here in the profile you make with Ati tray tools, just go back to manage profile and select the right tab you should see it.

I get 130 frames looking at sky and ground now if need to claw back any fps while big battles going on till it dies down lol. Generally though getting anywhere between 45 and 80, with avg of 55 in most places at this time. I messed around with flip que size(ati) pre render frames aheas(nv) on my card to 0 lol I got no mouse lag using that and got no texture transitions when say running towards a village and the buildings stayed full hi res textures. Frames stayed aroun 40-45.

Was rather suprised, but gonna check out the other end of the scale now with flip que 5 and see if my bandwidth crawls like a maimed soldier hehe. Love tweaking most fun eh.

Specs: E6600@3.2ghz:Ati XfX4870 1Gb (Cat9.6):4gb Ocz Ram@1000mhz:Enermax Galaxy Psu:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[bekster 0]

I can only speak for Arma1 now, but seems like its still the same in Arma2:

I used a PS/2 mouse and use now a USB mouse, makes no difference in mouse lag for me!

@rowdied: there is no hiccup for me, its just that every mouse-movement is delayed. So if you keep moving the mouse when leading a target its ..ok, but if the target slows down/speeds up/changes direction, there is a delay in your mouse movement. (On top of your natural delay/reaktion time)

[rowdied 44]

I can only speak for Arma1 now, but seems like its still the same in Arma2:

I used a PS/2 mouse and use now a USB mouse, makes no difference in mouse lag for me!

@rowdied: there is no hiccup for me, its just that every mouse-movement is delayed. So if you keep moving the mouse when leading a target its ..ok, but if the target slows down/speeds up/changes direction, there is a delay in your mouse movement. (On top of your natural delay/reaktion time)

Ok, I don't get that at all in any of my computers for arma and arma2.

It's funny how some games work no matter what on some systems and not on others, like t34 vs tiger on my Q9550 crashes constantly and on my old amd fx60 7600gt card smooth as silk.

Do you use any mouse pointer programs? And When you access the menu in arma and arma2 does the mouse pointer hesitate over just the menu gui?

I had this problem and when I turned off force triple buffering this hesitation went away. I used riva tuner to do that for my gtx 260 card.

I also want to add, I put all my systems together myself from scratch ie/ cpu into motherboard into case etc... so I don't have any useless compaq ,HP, dell...extra software on the hard drive.

[Placebo 28]

Not sure if this is even relevant.....

But I use a Logitech wireless optical mouse and in Windows 7 it's just installed as "HID Compliant Mouse", I don't use the Logitech software as it seems pointless for a mouse, and I've not had any problems in ArmA2, beta or final.

[vento 10]

Hello.

Like most people here I think the mouse lag is ruinning the game.

I saw that maybe, it was a "realism feature", but I can't believe it... As we know, mouselag is very related to framerate, but framerate in Arma is never constant.

I could at least understand the concept of this so-called feature, if the lag effect was constant !

But when you have to adapt to controls that varies from bad to barely playable (in comparison of modern FPS)...

[Alex72 1]

Remove the floating zone if you didnt. Sorry didnt read it all - got little time. but with it i cant hit anything.

Also i can confirm in ArmA1 i have that creamy feeling and its harder then other games. It feels like its accelerating and then when you stop to aim it de-accelerating - and its that acc/de-acc that makes it hard to stop on target. I have however over time get used to it and im very good at shooting on target now (ask anyone DM'ing me). Its like a lot of things in these series. Flying helicopters really good take some time to master as well as aiming. So even though it feels bad now - stick with it and practise a lot. What you also should do and something that also can take some time is get the settings down right. ArmA1 took me some time to get that best FPS all over and better feel of the aim. Do the tweaks recommended on ARMAHOLIC to get better overall FPS as well.

So dont give up just yet mate. Try to read up on improving performance and practise shooting a lot. Also remember that BIS indeed work on optimizing the game a lot. ArmA1 got a huge performance overhaul through patches and im sure the same will happen for ARMA2. Maybe even the mouse will see an improvement. Who knows. But true is that you get better with time and practise. I did. ;)

Regards

Alex