Heal system/Revive

[tomcat_ 0]

The below is an extract from Arma2 preview in IGN

Quote[/b] ]One of the most interesting design decisions yet to fully implemented is one that could alienate as many fans as it may aims to entice. It's a mechanic that aims to keep players alive a little longer than might have been possible in previous games, but is much more interesting than a traditional cure-all medikit that brings you up to full health:

"In previous games there were very limited ways to heal injured troops and so very often you simply died" remembers Spanel. "That wasn't unrealistic, but it was very tough on gameplay sometimes. So this time if you get shot, you may be given timely first-aid by the other team members and can keep going." Those fearing ArmA is going all LEGO Star Wars can rest easy that injured soldiers will have to be physically dragged out of direct fire, or the incoming fire suppressed - and quickly - if the injury is to be effectively treated.

"We needed something like this" he says. "It's not perfectly realistic but it's very close. What I like most about the first aid system is that it really makes the team work in a more coherent way. It's necessary to stay close together because you will die if there is no-one to help you. In previous titles quite often the team was a bunch of individuals running and shooting - this time it's really essential to work together."

In RTY servers we have experimented a lot with revive script from Norrin, and all our missions are revive. I'm a firm believer that revive promotes teamwork especially between players that are not part of a squad and just happened to exist in a server.

However, our experience in our public server with revive missions, has sown that the revive itself does not promote teamwork unless combined with a few more things:

1. Not being able to respawn after being unconscious and waiting to be healed/revived or not being able to disconnect and reconnect using JIP. Otherwise you will still see "a bunch of individuals running and shooting" and then just respawning or disconnecting and reconnecting

2. Being able to JIP close to group/leader. The healing system is meant to promote teamwork and teamwork most of the times commands for the team to stay together. There is no point joining in a game where you have to travel a lot to join the team and then you are risking of dieing without anyone being able to help you.

In my opinion the combination of JIP close to leader and the no respawn/reconnect after being unconscious really promotes teamwork and it's a good balance between realism and fun.

Let me be clear, this is not a thread saying if the healing system is good or not. This is more like suggestions to make the healing system better as it has been described so far by BIS. Who knows, these elements might have been already implemented in Arma2.

In general i think the heal/revive, time to be healed, respawn or not, and disconnecting and reconnecting should be a server side option or mission side option.

This way everyone is satisfied and each person can pick and chose what he/she likes.

[.kju 3245]

This is up to the server admin (lock server) or the mission designer

(how to handle JIP players and respawn) or not?

[tomcat_ 0]

it is up to the mission maker for respawn and JIP...however if you say that u disable JIP then new players that want to come into the server they cannot...

[POTS 0]

BIS's revive system seems a little bit differen't than the one in arma. I'm just hoping that being shot in the head and maybe a 90% chance in the chest kill you. Shot in the legs 5% chance of violent bleeding till death. And have it so if your shot in the legs you cant walk. Then make it so if your shot in the arms you can walk but cannot lift your gun depending on arm shot (assuming your right handed).

[.kju 3245]

well you can "disable" JIP as a server admin or as a mission maker.

as mission maker you can handle JIP player in whatever way

you want it

[tomcat_ 0]

well you can "disable" JIP as a server admin or as a mission maker.

as mission maker you can handle JIP player in whatever way

you want it

yeap...but you still need to be able to let new players into the game...so in my experience in order to promote teamwork you need to have JIP but prevent players from disconnecting and reconnecting or respawning...

[.kju 3245]

right but you can detect this behavior with scripts and punish

the player in whatever way the mission designer wants?!

[mcpxxl 2]

Was done in Norrins script

If you reconnect you can decide how many live the player gets.

In our Version you would get only 3 lives instead of the choosen one.

Also you can decide where and if he can choose his spawnpoint.

[tomcat_ 0]

it was done in norrin's script...as the revive/heal was there as well...

my suggestion is to be done in game engine with options rather than using scripts...

[.kju 3245]

less flexibility is not a good thing

of course it could be made, but no worth the effort

while mission making should be available even to beginners,

JIP handling is not simple topic and a decent mission maker

can use existing implementations to handle the JIP event

in whatever way he wants to

[CarlGustaffa 4]

As long as we get an engine supported revive system that doesn't cause lag and desyncs, everything else can be handled by the mission designer. Although Norrins revive isn't engine supported, you can still do a lot of teamwork oriented reawrds and punishments with it. In my Domination, the following takes place:

1. You have a VERY limited amount of lives.

2. If you are revived you don't loose a life.

3. If you respawn, you loose a life.

4. Bonus life set to 4. When you have revived 4, you gain an extra life.

5. Minus a life for team killing, accidental or not.

6. Everyone can revive, not just the medic. Makes sure the mission can be played without one.

7. However, you start with only 20% health after being revived. Your aiming sucks and you need to seek a medic (or ambulance or MASH).

8. Optionally, you can set a rejoin punishment so that he only starts with 3 lives when rejoining the server. But I prefer not to. Anyone rejoining often will be noted and threatened to be kicked/banned if he doesn't act up better.

These actions results in the close team keeping their lives, maybe even increasing. The rambo players will deplete their numbers of lives quickly and have to rejoin and loose their scores (hidden anyway, but). We are a bit plagued with players that steal our equipment (we use quite some time on logistics), drive it to the sea, and just log off. Those are more problematic and embarrasing than the occational rambo.

[dentist guba 0]

i guess the revive thing could help in MP, would discourage the rambo's and the like if they had to sit out because of people not reviving them due to their behaviour. Also, if the AI use it the ridiculous kill rates of players would be solved.

[Uziyahu--IDF 0]

I'd like to see blood pressure and adrenaline's ability to keep a person going.

Random implementation of pain effects.

Temporary unconsciousness.

Ability to fight while bleeding or partially disabled.

And most of all, soldiers sometimes howling bloody murder until someone gives them something for the pain!

I want to be psychologically DISTURBED by a war sim.