Why Does Everyone get so up tight on these forums?

[Bald_Maggot 0]

Ive scanned these forums for quite some while now, and the one thing that im constantly aware of is how wound up people get over silly things.

I thought the idea of a public forum was to share ideas for the greater good, it seems to me that some people just havent grasped this aspect yet.

Strangely the one thing that i just cannot stand is the fact that some people get so rediculously defensive of ArmA when someone passes up a respectable question.

Yes ArmA is a good game, but that doesnt mean that it is finished. All these comments are peoples ideas and if proposed with a little respect and common sense, should be replied to with as much grace.

Please people lets act more like a community, more like how it was back in the good old days of OFP:R, im sure that way things will be a lot more productive.

[OrLoK 20]

Come here and say that!

No, seriously, I think that alot of angst is present on this board as there are so many who feel so passionatly about OFP/VBS/Arma etc that they sometimes get a bit heated.

Plus we have a wide renage of age groups/nationalites, and thats can cause difficulties and just sometimes things don't come over too well when written down.

I think most here are fairly decent and level headed tho.

Rgds

LoK

[dwringer 45]

Well, I think most people are just overly apt to try and protect people from the Mods, who frequently close topics they view to be inappropriate. Whether non-moderators are really supposed to be MAKING such judgements is something else entirely, but perhaps this is why some people immediately jump on anyone saying things that might be construed as trolling/flamebaiting [i.e. certain complaints against ArmA/BIS]

I'm not offering any judgements of my own here, and discussion of moderation is to be taken up in a different topic, I forget which forum in which it's located.

EDIT: plus, everything said in the post above

[Bald_Maggot 0]

Come here and say that!

Hehe, i think thats one of the reasons that forums can often end up in a flame war (of course i knew that you were joking!

I think its funny how some people are actually serious though when they say things like that, I mean free thinking often florishes here because people are sitting many miles from each other hiding behind thier computer screens and acting like tough guys.

I wonder if the future holds anything that would reprise empty internet threats.....maybe a interesting futuristic novel  

But i spose you are right, i just wish that the "OPF" community spirit was back to how it used to be thats all  

[seba1976 98]

Ive scanned these forums for quite some while now, and the one thing that im constantly aware of is how wound up people get over silly things.

I thought the idea of a public forum was to share ideas for the greater good, it seems to me that some people just havent grasped this aspect yet.

Strangely the one thing that i just cannot stand is the fact that some people get so rediculously defensive of ArmA when someone passes up a respectable question.

Yes ArmA is a good game, but that doesnt mean that it is finished.  All these comments are peoples ideas and if proposed with a little respect and common sense, should be replied to with as much grace.

Please people lets act more like a community, more like how it was back in the good old days of OFP:R, im sure that way things will be a lot more productive.

As I've said, ArmA is tearing the OFP community apart. And that's because target audience for OFP came from two different places: the gaming community, and the simmers community. But now it's time to separate men from children, so go gamers and play BF! Absolutly just kidding   I'm for a more OFP-like experience in ArmA, and do not like most of the changes, but I understand many people are enjoying the more difficult ArmA over their experiences with OFP. I guess you can't have it all the time. The community is getting some trouble to stay together nevertheless. What joined us together was OFP, now we're talking of a different game/sim.

[OrLoK 20]

Hello,

Forums and people change over time, and a place that was once restful can become quite the opposite and then return to normaility again.

In any online community there will be people who rub you up the wrong way and one can easily annoy others with just thier style of writing.

The best thing, in my humble opionion, is if some one leaps at you because of something you've posted, is to just ignore them if they rant.

Let the mods sort it out, if its against board rules and worry about real life.

some people get too involved, some people just like a good argument, some like to have fun, some people are just arses.

Im not sure which catagory i fall into, and frankly id rather not know

Rgds

LoK

[Placebo 28]

Ive scanned these forums for quite some while now, and the one thing that im constantly aware of is how wound up people get over silly things.

Welcome to the internet

[shataan 1]

"Yes ArmA is a good game, but that doesnt mean that it is finished."

I think the game not being finished really goes without saying. No one I know of updates their games as much as BIS does. It is constant. Rightly so when you consider HOW intensive the game is in so many areas. It really is amazing how much work BIS does in the patch/fixes area.

[jerryhopper 285]

i think there is a whole new type of audience right now.

[xnodunitx 0]

Indeed. A game/sim such as this may never truly be completed.

As for the updates..lets just say bf2 had a good share of them..that aside (no that was not meant as a flame), BIS has a much more adverse amount of things up update and fix/correct and so on.

I can't honestly blame some of the community for getting upset, I myself am honestly tired of seeing the threads of VBS2 compared to Armed Assault.

Earlier on the "average gamer" segment tried to in a way, ask the community to make Armed Assault like the average fps, smaller enviroments but more of them, and so on, throwing one of the major aspects of the engine into the waste bin, obviously not many of us are going to do this.

Some time in early releases there were a few people practicly demanding a jump button, now I don't know about the rest of you but I do not trust an average gamer who has access to a jump button, we all know what that leads to.

Another would be some of their own hostility, such as when a user shows modded content and a new member act..well..aggressive, saying things such as "WtF?! why wasn't this in original Armed Assault?!" as if they think they are entitled to such. And yet we respond in kind or atleast to a medium that does not show much anger towards them.

Another would be how they want things dumbed down to make it easier for them, obviously a sim/half sim cannot be called a sim if it is like every other FPS, and thats just what some of them are trying to make it.

Another example would be threads made about how the game is unrealistic or so on, when infact this is not due to the engine but user error.

Now don't get me wrong, I welcome new people and hope they enjoy the experience, but at the same time I would expect them to not want to deteriorate the game just as I would not ask them to do theirs.

So all in all, enjoy the game, if you have trouble with commanding them please practice before making a thread about it, if you have trouble piloting a helicopter please practice before making a thread about it, please use the search button, enjoy your time, ask questions if you need them and if they truly require help of another, (no getting used to characters movement does not count) , have a safe and pleasant stay.

[max power 21]

Indeed. A game/sim such as this may never truly be completed.

As for the updates..lets just say bf2 had a good share of them..that aside (no that was not meant as a flame), BIS has a much more adverse amount of things up update and fix/correct and so on.

I can't honestly blame some of the community for getting upset, I myself am honestly tired of seeing the threads of VBS2 compared to Armed Assault.

Earlier on the "average gamer" segment tried to in a way, ask the community to make Armed Assault like the average fps, smaller enviroments but more of them, and so on, throwing one of the major aspects of the engine into the waste bin, obviously not many of us are going to do this.

Some time in early releases there were a few people practicly demanding a jump button, now I don't know about the rest of you but I do not trust an average gamer who has access to a jump button, we all know what that leads to.

Another would be some of their own hostility, such as when a user shows modded content and a new member act..well..aggressive, saying things such as "WtF?! why wasn't this in original Armed Assault?!" as if they think they are entitled to such. And yet we respond in kind or atleast to a medium that does not show much anger towards them.

Another would be how they want things dumbed down to make it easier for them, obviously a sim/half sim cannot be called a sim if it is like every other FPS, and thats just what some of them are trying to make it.

Another example would be threads made about how the game is unrealistic or so on, when infact this is not due to the engine but user error.

Now don't get me wrong, I welcome new people and hope they enjoy the experience, but at the same time I would expect them to not want to deteriorate the game just as I would not ask them to do theirs.

So all in all, enjoy the game, if you have trouble with commanding them please practice before making a thread about it, if you have trouble piloting a helicopter please practice before making a thread about it, please use the search button, enjoy your time, ask questions if you need them and if they truly require help of another, (no getting used to characters movement does not count) , have a safe and pleasant stay.

+ 1 !

Excellent post.

[baddo 0]

The most basic problem I have noticed here is that people read from other peoples' posts something they did not write into them.

All fighting over something that even doesn't exist

I am sure there are many, many other people too who feel that many of their posts have been misread or misunderstood, thus leading to completely unnecessary personal attacks and ridiculation. What can we do about it? I try to do my best to write in a style that cannot be misunderstood. Sometimes it is enough, sometimes it is not enough. I try to do my best to understand what others mean. Sometimes it is enough, sometimes it is not enough.

One thing that adds to this problem is the fact that this is an international forum. I am sure the people who can use their native language have much easier time to read and write posts in English. They should be aware of this and be careful when they read posts that were written by people whoms native language is not English. Text can also have "colour". Often it unintentionally happens so that the colour we think our post has is not the same colour the native English speakers see. Please forgive us that.

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

hehe, then you can call me a rainbow writer and reader.

[4 IN 1 0]

some ppl didnt get the game

some ppl who did get the game cant run it

some ppl who did get the game and can run it have bugs

some ppl who did get the game and can run it and have less bugs cant run it max out

all these ppl start up the blame game to a hostility level and some ppl who did get the game and can run it and have less bugs and can run it smoothly with higher setting get tired of all the ppl above

thats how you got this kind of community

it only take 2 years being in customer service business to understand how hard to please everyone (and how asshole some of them are), so i didnt throw this kind of hostility towards BIS, it doesnt mean that i am trying to defend them, there are things that BI leave broken and they need to fix it, but shouting at them wont make things better.

[Col.Flanders 0]

Because all are want them to fix trackIR ironsight look and make a helo turn better but do nothing and never fix!

Hehe...yeah, I tend to go with the "welcome to the internet" sentiment myself. You see heated arguments happen all over the place online. Also, although there are emoticons for us to try and convey as sense of tone or emotion, often it's not enough and people misconstrue somebody's post as being something it isn't. Of course you also get the "I'm a tough guy" factor, since bad behaviour has few repercussions online...possibly a ban at most. In the real world you could be staring down the barrel of a beatdown!

[4 IN 1 0]

thats why when things start heating up i get out of that place ASAP, who wants to get themself a bullet in the head?

oh and try to set a small center dead zone in you TIR so that it wont affect by your slight movement, set everything to lower to make the in game movement close to your normal self, it may sounds like a work around but there is little mean to change it now

[Col.Flanders 0]

4in1 ... I DON'T WANT TO SET UP A DEADZONE! A deadzone doen't work for me - it makes me feel like I'm a robot! Why does EVERYONE tell me to set up a #$%^& deadzone!!?? Go set up your own deadzone...start by digging a shallow 6x2 hole in the ground!

hehe... Sorry, was just trying to illustrate my point in previous post without highjacking the thread.

Hope my emoticons are emitting the emotions I was truly trying to convey there.

[majoris 10]

Forums aren't the same as they used to be. It's like being watched by secret police or something, afraid the mods and other people are going to harass you for whatever opinion you have on anything.

[stobbsy 0]

"Yes ArmA is a good game, but that doesnt mean that it is finished."

 I think the game not being finished really goes without saying. No one I know of updates their games as much as BIS does. It is constant.  Rightly so when you consider HOW intensive the game is in so many areas.  It really is amazing how much work BIS does in the patch/fixes area.

Thing is people who are paying good money EXPECT a finished game or at least one that is decently playable with a few bugs not a half finished game. Its like a computer company telling you they will sell you a computer, but when you get it all you get is an empty case with nothing in it, people wouldnt stand for it.

What people get frustrated at is that BIS have had 3 or so years to develop Armed Assault, yet we are still seeing the same bugs and problems we had in Operation Flashpoint. As well as performance issues with much more powerful computers that ofp ever had.

Of course they have had other things in development like VBS1, but I would say Armed Assault is just really a better version of that so things they have learnt in VBS1 should be in Armed Assault. To be honest I dont see 3 years or so development in Armed Assault over Operation Flashpoint Resistance.

[4 IN 1 0]

i dont scare by mods, as i stick to the fourm rules as much as possible(sometime a bit over the line but not a big deal), and know whats too much and whats not, and sure as hell i dont want to see 100 single new topic about the same thing, cut it down to 1 post with 99 replys are much cleaner/ bandwidth friendly

@stobbsy

would you plz stop the "oh they have got X years" bullcrap?

[OrLoK 20]

hello

Perhaps the reason we get so angsty in these forums is because we have no life outside them?

I for one spend far too much time here.

I would get more involved in real life but there's far to many bugs.

Oh and we've mention the mods 3 times... careful once more and they may appear!

rgds

LoK

[DieAngel 0]

Well i have to say i am a bit disapointed too but i bear it.

okay i say it.

Considering how much money BIS will be making with the sales of arma i was expecting that arma would be like vbs2 i have hardly seen one , maybe two features that are out of the reach of gamers.

If both share the base code it makes me wonder.

IS ARMA intentionally cripled to the profit of vbs2?

A bit like Microsoft make a shitty home edition from their full featured ultimate editions?

Now i might be wrong, i honestly hope i am wrong but , lets look at it, that "military training system" has a lot of things WE would like, so if its the same code base, why not giving it to us! It's not for what it will cost now that function X and Y IS developed already.

-The plane/copter commands are crippled so the gas controls only make sense for a keyboard.

-The tracers look unrealistic at best

-The AT4 is re loadable ??

-The 2D editor was fair enough for OFP, but we get no improvements (like the 3D editor) which would be a godsend to align objects, build complex sceneries and tweak missions.

-The after action review, while not exactly geared to players would be great for co-op players to analyze where they failed and why in a mission.

-The deployable tire traps and barb wire coals could offer great tactical possibilities (and open the concept to mod other similar "plant & extend" devices)

-The scope range finders are not working properly (why putting one if it can't be used?)

-The talons and UAVs would be great tactical devices (and could even spawn nex game modes)

-What about the chinook, it was already in OFP, why removing it from Arma and keep it in vbs2 ?

rant off

I really hope this post might be of any use but i doubt it will get noticed.

[Dallas 9]

I noticed it - I too wish ArmA was more like VBS2, that VBS2's price were more like ArmA's price and that I didn't have to sign a 4 year contract with the USMC, ADF or UKF to train with it, before they shipped me off to war.  

[INNOCENT&CLUELESS 0]

VBS2 is not much better then ArmA, just the extra tools. For us only the ingame editor and for serious squads the AAR are nice.

Since they use the same engine, they must have the same bugs or BI/BIA decided to maintain 2 almost similar engines.

[xnodunitx 0]

"Yes ArmA is a good game, but that doesnt mean that it is finished."

I think the game not being finished really goes without saying. No one I know of updates their games as much as BIS does. It is constant. Rightly so when you consider HOW intensive the game is in so many areas. It really is amazing how much work BIS does in the patch/fixes area.

Thing is people who are paying good money EXPECT a finished game or at least one that is decently playable with a few bugs not a half finished game. Its like a computer company telling you they will sell you a computer, but when you get it all you get is an empty case with nothing in it, people wouldnt stand for it.

What people get frustrated at is that BIS have had 3 or so years to develop Armed Assault, yet we are still seeing the same bugs and problems we had in Operation Flashpoint. As well as performance issues with much more powerful computers that ofp ever had.

Of course they have had other things in development like VBS1, but I would say Armed Assault is just really a better version of that so things they have learnt in VBS1 should be in Armed Assault. To be honest I dont see 3 years or so development in Armed Assault over Operation Flashpoint Resistance.

I'm afraid some of the information in your post usually warrants a harassing from the community, so I'll help you to understand this before any of the err...jerk types come in and yell at you for it.

(Please pardon my offtopicness for this little history lesson, but it is rather important so we don't have to have the same problems over and over)

Although BIS did have three years, that is not the time it took to produce Armed Assault or enhance the engine, infact the operation did not take place until early 2005, the images however appeared to be that of OFP:E, but don't be fooled, Armed Assault looked very similar to OFP:E in early stages.

Also images of "Game2" were released on the same date, and one can tell that the models seen in the images are not Codemasters due to how the humvee looked exactly the same in later Armed Assault images, the early game2 soldiers looked just like the ones from OFP:E and there were several other variables.

Now wether or not it was simply confusion between OFP:E and Armed Assault we'll never know, but here is what was originally promised in its early years.

# Compatible with community created content

# Large selection of playable military and civilian gear and vehicles

# Fight for freedom in a new storyline

# Map covering over 100 sq. km, in extreme detail

# Comprehensive multiplayer support with join in progress

# Customizable game with built-in mission editor

Obviously there have been improvements, such as the 400x400km island rather than 100.

It wasn't until four months later that Armed Assault began to shape up, images of better soldiers, the blackhawk and abrams that we see today, only it was not the same. Normal maps were only seen on the soldier models, much like OFP:E, HDR was none existant, the overall enviroment looked more like OFP.

Three months after, more progress came, new T-72, new OH-6, However normal maps were still only on infantry models and the terrain. (same month not long after, more game2 images released with an Armed Assault article)

It wasn't till early 2006 that Armed Assault really began to shape up, showing normal maps on vehicles, darker and more lively lighting on the enviroment,the blackhawk in her first glory shot.

Two months (fourth month) later is what really sparked it all, showing off Armed Assault's new infantry model, their better, more lively and populated enviroment (however vegetation seemed to have lighting issues still, and there was no sky) along with the long time back and forth questioning of the "render?" two T-72's with the BMP-2 ( http://ofp.gamepark.cz/news/pics3/ArmA_hires_06.jpg )

Same month William Porter's blog came into act, it wasn't until May that Armed Assault began to show similarities what it shows today, but it still had a share of errors we all pointed out, such as the famous grass alpha texture. This was also back when South Sahrani soldiers wore Tri-color BDU instead of Chocolate Chip scheme.

In August however was the magic hour, when Armed Assault showed a hint of its true potential, better enviromental lighting, (it wasn't always an overcast day), the first sighting of the thorough grass detail on the ground being more just a simple green pixel, smoke effects and other things, by this time the community was prett much reeling..

During that month several images were released, the community became more and more unbearing, we wanted the game, but it wasn't ready, so I guess BIS decided to play the good guys and give us something to occupy our han- eyes with while we waited.

Three months later, the German edition goes gold.

So you see, they didn't have nor take three years to develop this, the project was probably a thought, but nothing more. Near two years at most.

Onto next poster..DieAngel

Yes Armed Assault is a dumbed down version, the problem, and reason many of us get upset when views such as this are expressed is because it is rather self centered.

Armed Assault is a civilian game, VBS2 is a military simulator, designed specificly for the military, as stated by other users, they do not have the eyecandy, I checked up on this and found it to be rather true. VBs2 is supposed to have more features and be more feasable because it is a military sim, why would they show interest in it if it weren't realistic and flexible.

As for the cargo helicopter, that is a CH-46 Sea Knight, a USMC helicopter, not the CH-47 Army helicopter.

Again, you can buy the 40$ type or you can buy the over 1,000$ type, if it makes you happy them more power to you. I would rather expect a lot of differences with that kind of pricetag though.

As for the things you stated, many can be done by the community, not quite as professionally or GPU/CPU light but its possible nontheless. Heck a spike trap could just be a deployed kind of "weapon" in a way, all it has to do is damage the tires, that wouldn't be too hard to do, if we have talented scripters and modellers who can create a building and have each brick able to be blasted off seperatly, then I don't doubt thats possible.

There are many things that are possible that many have not yet considered, some of us just need to stop thinking in the box and start thinking outside, thinking inside is not what got OFP to be what it is today.

And heck who knows, things will be even more possible once proper tools are out, its not just a textured vehicle or something as simple as that, chances are the center of gravity for helicopters is a defined point in a memory LOD, weight and mass can be modified at various parts to effect vehicle speed, agility and overall performance, but now I'm going further off topic, I hope I have helped shed some light on a few things atleast.