Artillery in Arma, how to use?

[Sc@tterbrain 0]

As a former Marine Corps Artillery-man....I had high hopes for the arty factor of the game. Pretty dissapointing....

EDIT - Nice work Balschiow! I will have to give this a try.

I thank you for your service Marine!

As someone with real knowledge of this stuff maybe you can tell us a better way to target using the artillary.

Assuming with some work or a mod that it can be done, what is a practicle/realistic way to target the artillary for longer distances? Using the targeting sight with elevation, clicking on the map where you want your fire to fall, or the CTI (mortar) style of grid coordinates?

I too would love to have some "real" arty support. Maybe I can talk some people smarter than me into helping me make it happen.

[Messiah 2]

although its a shame to 'have' to revert to it, but I'm hopeful CoC will return to bring us an Armed Assault rendition of their Unified Artilery.

[Marines 0]

As a former Marine Corps Artillery-man....I had high hopes for the arty factor of the game. Pretty dissapointing....

EDIT - Nice work Balschiow! I will have to give this a try.

I thank you for your service Marine!  

As someone with real knowledge of this stuff maybe you can tell us a better way to target using the artillary.

Assuming with some work or a mod that it can be done, what is a practicle/realistic way to target the artillary for longer distances?  Using the targeting sight with elevation, clicking on the map where you want your fire to fall, or the CTI (mortar) style of grid coordinates?

I too would love to have some "real" arty support.  Maybe I can talk some people smarter than me into helping me make it happen.

I don't think I can't really help you in this manner.

The arty in the game is used as a direct fire only weapon at present, and I've yet to properly toy with it. If it was to be properly modded, then you'd have to take into account the FO's and FDC aspects. Then you grid coords and dispersal of said fire. Not too mention the round that is to be used...ICM, DPICM, RAP, etc.

At present, I don't even know where to begin.

[Balschoiw 0]

Mapclick artillery :

Mr Murray´s Artillery Download

Quote[/b] ]a very very simple yet brilliant solution - amazed that it hadn't been thought of before.

I have thought about making good use of "lifelike" spotting and engaging targets for FDF mod and to my knowledge I have been the only one who had this solution in a FDF mission. In FDF mod there were periscope battlefield goggles and I placed the spotters in tree-nests, trenches, etc.

I like it because it doesn´t automatically make you a target via script but the enemy spotter actually has to see you and the artillery is not that precise as if it´s scripted due to dependance on AI skill settings.

I guess the thread should be moved to Mission Editing ?

[Sturmwolf 0]

CoC unified arty with a better interface is what im missing in arma. it was just perfect.

its not done in ofp or arma when you create arty fully realistic, because the rest of the game isnt fully realistic, either. Its very important to keep everything on the same level in order to keep it balanced.

CoC not only managed to do this in a imho perfect way, they also made it very configurable depending on the grade of arcadeness/simulationess of the mission itself due to very easy use of the game logics etc.

Just a better interface, which should be easily possible with arma.

[Messiah 2]

UA 1.1 had a brilliant interface... not sure what you found so troublesome or bad about it?

Balschoiw - your method should work wonders for pretty much anything then... have you tested the abilities of missile artilery with this method?

will go play with our MLRS now in flashpoint and see if it works.

[Marines 0]

CoC unified arty with a better interface is what im missing in arma. it was just perfect.

its not done in ofp or arma when you create arty fully realistic, because the rest of the game isnt fully realistic, either. Its very important to keep everything on the same level in order to keep it balanced.

CoC not only managed to do this in a imho perfect way, they also made it very configurable depending on the grade of arcadeness/simulationess of the mission itself due to very easy use of the game logics etc.

Just a better interface, which should be easily possible with arma.

Correct.

I'd like to see a semi-seamless interface regarding arty. CoC did a excellent job with OFPs' artillery mod. I just hope that they can improve upon that with ArmA.

[Sturmwolf 0]

messiah i found it very uncomfortable givin all the command via the action menu, as it is actually needed for other things. furthermore, in ofp action menu and command menu were completely divided, but now in arma you sometimes cant use the action menu while the command menu is active. i find this extremely annoying at times, and it furthermore id like a window like the equipment one in arma, not just a text-only one. Of course that worked well and so on, but somehow it didnt feel good, u know. i also like keeping action menu clear for actions like boarding verhicles or so...its for spontaneous actions, not these long-time thingys like callin in arty.

[Messiah 2]

no, you misread... I said 1.1 - everything is now done via dialogues, i.e. a proper interface with text and buttons.... reserve judgement till you've tried it

Pic

I agree that the first method was rather cluttered and horrible to use, and CoC answered their critics with this new interface. Superbly easy to use, even for people like me who refused to sit through the training missions.

[Guest]

Ok I have tested artillery with forward observer. It works pretty well and artillery engages targets that are 1.5 to 2km away.

It´s unscripted. I will upload a template this evening if anyone wants to have it.

It´s basically very easy to set up. Place empty d30 artillery on a hilllike structure, place a game logic there. Setpos the artillery to the gamelogic, moveingunner one soldier, moveincargo the other ones.

Now create a third unit, remove all it´s weapons and add a binocular, have the unit select the binocs and put it´s skill up high. Move the unit to the region you want to control, far away from the artillery.

Disable AI move on the unit.

Now increase it´s rank and group the other 2 soldiers to the spotter. The unit will report enemies and assign targets for the artillery. The artillery will engage.

Compared to FDF the artillery sounds are misssing, so there is no sound of incoming shells. Something that could be fixed by BIS if they want to.

Else it works just as it is supposed to.

With this easy method you can have unscripted artillery that detects enemies on long ranges and engages them. I always liked this method as it is more realistic than scripted artillery. You take out the spotter and the artillery is blind

Excuse me, this is definitely an advanced way of describing it.

Could you give the exact terms for the procedure please?

Thanks!

[Balschoiw 0]

I will setup a template and put it online tonight when I´m at home.

Quote[/b] ]Balschoiw - your method should work wonders for pretty much anything then... have you tested the abilities of missile artilery with this method?

No , I just used it with FDF artillery and this morning with Arma D30´s.

[Messiah 2]

just tested it out - works really well, except of course even at 1500 when the enemy armour is engaged, it shoots back

works with missile based arty as well, so those Zil trucks should work with this method too

[Balschoiw 0]

Do I get the Oscar now ?

[scubaman3D 0]

Do I get the Oscar now ?

I will nominate you if you upload a template to the procedure you described

[WhoCares 0]

Do I get the Oscar now ?  

Maybe if you made a Biki article out of it

[Balschoiw 0]

Ok template ready. I will write a little readme and add it.

I need someone to host the mission template though.

Anyone willing to host it ?

[Paco454 0]

The guys over at http://www.armed-assault-zone.com/news.php might host it for you. In the meantime you can always use http://www.megaupload.com/ and then post the link here.

PACO454

[Average Joe 0]

Sure Thing Balschoiw, pm sent.

[Balschoiw 0]

Ok here you go. Grab the template here

Unzip to .../Arma other profiles/yourname/missions folder and read the txt file.

Have fun.

[Soldat32 0]

Just wait for COC Artillery to be ported over from OFP.:O)

[Balschoiw 0]

Very contributing.

[max power 21]

LOL. 105 mm artillery shouldn't penetrate tank armour. Artillery cannons don't fire HEAT rounds. What are they hoping to penetrate? The ground?

I fat lot of good a stream of molten copper would do on the street/ in the mud. Artillery fires a lot of different shells, but I don't think HEAT is a common one.

Well I guess your partly right. The M119A1 105mm Lightweight Towed Howitzer is not designed to be a tank killer. Most rounds are HE/Framgmentation and anti-personel (primarily used against personnel and materiel targets).

However your way off on the "molten copper" thing. Cluster bombs do use an explosive shaped charge (a formed molten copper jet slug) as the primary antiarmor weapon. These can be the of the type dropped by aircraft or delivered by surface artillery or rockets (including155mm and 203mm artillery projectiles and Multiple-Launch Rocket System rockets)

Spend a few mins searching on google and you can learn alot.

anyway...........

Thank You Balschiow! Your post was great! Your instructions were most helpful. I will go and give that a try immediately!

Thanks again for the assist!

There are also strix rounds, SADARM and other terminal homing shells... and this makes me wrong how? I was referring to a shell with a HEAT warhead, following a ballistic arc to the (typically 100 yard) target area. Suffice it to say, HEAT rounds would be a waste of ammo. You're talking about some submunition delivery vehicles. Were you seeking to show off your incredible catalogue of artillery knowledge or did you just feel like you needed to try to one up someone? You're not even commenting on what I was talking about- I suppose that makes you TOTALLY wrong.

[scubaman3D 0]

This method is limited by line of sight. If the artillery can't directly "see" the target, they won't fire.

Mr Murray's arty is not line of sight. I was shelling Ramadi from Sirani last night, which is several thousand meters away, over mountains and such - which wais all scripted, of course...

[frederf 0]

Are the 105mm guns in game predictable enough in their trajectory to make a firing table for them? As in, will two shots at 42 deg elevation both land within 10m of each other every time?

Also I know there are limits to how long ArmA will continue tracking a shell in flight (20 seconds?) because a several km long shot could take that much time or more to land.

WGL used a system that, I think, had an invisible AI gunner for the mortar and you had a GUI interface that basically allowed you to have him hold very exact azimuth and elevation before firing (and a lot of math and pretty graphics to make it easier for the firer). Just wondering if the same could be applied easily to the 105mm (155mm?) guns in game.

Nothing as fancy as what WGL had for starters, just a way to manually input exact azimuth and elevation (in mill-incriments) without having to use the mouse (which would never be that precise). After that all you'd need is a piece of paper that gives you elevation vs range number and you're most the way there for human fired indirect 105/155mm.

The guns in game are less vehicles for spontaneous use than 3D art for when you want very scripted artillery actions (which is fine). What I did find amusing was how in that video that showed an artillery strike using the ArmA unit, how ineffective the rounds were to unprotected infantry (some less than 20' away! More work for modders?

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]This method is limited by line of sight. If the artillery can't directly "see" the target, they won't fire.

Not true. The only one who has to see the units is the spotter if you´re talking about my template.