Walking On Moving Vehicles

[robert(uk) 0]

Walking on moving vehicles is even supported in BF1942. Is it quite difficult to implement it into simulators?

This is what I am wondering. Maybe someone here with some knowledge could explain the differences for those that don't know...

[Commando84 0]

impressive map gnat! Hope we can do cti on it sometime

with your ships and all in armed assault

[ryankaplan 1]

it is a real shame, but it has repeatedly said that this isnt implemented. Maybe BIS imagined that this feature would be exploited like in (cant remember the name of the game actually), where players would jump on the gunpods of an OH6 helicopter and stay on it while the pilot flies at full speed.

If so, this could have been easily (i guess) solved by creating another sort of 'stucksurface LOD' which allows players to walk about in while the vehicle is moving. Aircraft carrier addons for example would have lots of these, since they are meant to be moving most of the time, especially when a plane is taking off.

Or, it could just be that they dont have time...

This and being able to shoot from vehicles, are the sort of things i'd be willing to delay arma for another month for. They are generally hardcoded, while other things can always be fixed with patches and so on.

[franze 196]

Or, it could just be that they dont have time...

This and being able to shoot from vehicles, are the sort of things i'd be willing to delay arma for another month for.

Exactly my thoughts. Features we want (emphasis on "want" ), if possible, should be done, even at the cost of time. It absolutely sucks to be frozen solid while in the back of a truck when there's a enemy squad blasting away at you, pointing and laughing with glee, for if you try to jump out now you die from velocity!

By the same token, it sucks to land on a aircraft carrier and then it sails out from under you right after you touch down.

[-TL- 0]

Maybe BIS imagined that this feature would be exploited like in (cant remember the name of the game actually), where players would jump on the gunpods of an OH6 helicopter and stay on it while the pilot flies at full speed.

Maybe you were thinking of Joint Operations?

You can even keep cars on top of these things...

I'd call that taking the ability to walk on moving vehicles a bit too far...

[franze 196]

Maybe you were thinking of Joint Operations?

You can even keep cars on top of these things...

I'd call that taking the ability to walk on moving vehicles a bit too far...

Last time I played JO, it took a lot of work to get to those hard-to-reach places!

But you must admit that being able to walk around the decks of a moving carrier without falling off would be a great benefit. It won't be the end of the world without it, but it's still a limitation that comes back to remind us: it's just a game.

[BraTTy 0]

Good points from everyone,thanx

Good point that AC Carrier doesn't need to move,in most games with small maps I'd say NO

But in OFP the fact that the ocean is endless and your carrier could be 150 meters off the coast.Or even beyond the planes flight range which is the whole purpose of a carrier.

In OFP I planned on making the carrier part of the map if I had to but I'd rather it not be that way.

The serious gamer and pilot that I am ,once I know where that carrier is located it is in jeopardy for that map and any other time I played that same mission,I would only perfect my attack run.

Like I said, I already know that YOU CAN ALREADY walk on moving vehicles in OFP (provided it has a roadway)

On my KAGA tests,I can get the KAGA going, walk around on the deck of the carrier,pull out weapons.

But if I stop walking while the carrier is in motion I fall thru.Like I said earlier I believe it has to do with keeping the object active.

I am a little rusty and its been a while but from what i remember.

I can also land and take off a plane while the carrier is moving,I think I remember that I also can stop moving the plane ,its when I get outta the plane that It falls thru from what I remember.

Im sure I could solve the walking on moving (platforms) vehicles.Guess I'll see when ARMA comes

[Pierrot 0]

Quote[/b] ]But if I stop walking while the carrier is in motion I fall thru.Like I said earlier I believe it has to do with keeping the object active.

Really? So how about shaking people on the deck with scripts? Keep him shaking a bit and he will never fall down even though he stops moving.

[BraTTy 0]

I've tried most things to keep the soldier active...

anims in limbo,anim settings,forced anims,setpos soldier with moving carrier (hard to start walking again)

hurting him (shooting then healing quickly) sorta works a little

I've tried most things and I am pretty creative

But hey you also gave me some awesome ideas,like when the carrier gets bombed to make the deck shake too

I so much want to recreate the pacific theatre in OFP

However the tailgunner dilema was most devastating, but all is well in ARMA

[UNN 0]

Quote[/b] ]I so much want to recreate the pacific theatre in OFP

Yeah, me to. Along with the other theatres of WWII. But in the absence (time will tell) of sufficient addons, of a suitable type and quantity. I have resigned myself to working on the basic mission ideas, with modern units.

Hopefully, when the time comes. It will just be a case of replacing everything with it's WWII equivalent.

[robert(uk) 0]

I certainly hope that someone will make a WW2 Pacific Theatre mod. I look forward to fighting on the islands, and then going carrier hunting, if they can move that is...

[KaRRiLLioN 0]

I'd really like to see this feature for sure. I do wonder why it can't be implemented in Arma, seeing as how older games have it built in. I agree in JO and BF some of it can be ridiculous, like people standing on the hoods of jeeps that are moving at top speed, but I'm willing to sacrifice a little realism on that front if it means I could stand up in a chinook that's moving, go to the back and fire at jeeps below. BAS's implementation was ok, but clipping was still a problem as I'd often end up falling through the chopper.

Something tells me that with fixed clipping issues, that won't be as much of a problem.

But naval units, IMHO are VERY important to broadening the already massive scope of OFP/Arma. In RTS I implemented a naval factory and we patched together some good units, battleships and whatnot. With multiple turrets in Arma, I can't wait. Still, I'd REALLY like to see operational carriers instead of having to hack around with Geo-LOD's and land-LOD's etc. When the Nimitz first came out, it took forever for me to patch holes in that thing with scripts. I gave up on the Kutznetov--thank goodness Gnat didn't. That curve in the hull was a PITA to get right.

I tested using moveable carriers for RTS. Basically they didn't move by sailing but could be redeployed. Each team would be able to build aircraft from their own carrier. The only problems I ran into were most islands didn't have enough water to make it worthwhile and redeploying the carrier in MP could sometimes glitch. So I ended up taking it out after running a few tests. Since the blasted carriers have to be placed in segments, lag could cause some freaky effects.

Having done tons of scripting, mission building, addon modelling, island making--well just about everything you can do to create stuff for OFP, my wish list is pretty long. I think Arma has taken care of most of it, multi-turrets being a big one. I wish this was implemented, but if it's not I won't cry...too much.

I just can't wait to see the first Arma naval battle with multi-turreted battleships!

[hardrock 1]

I do wonder why it can't be implemented in Arma, seeing as how older games have it built in.

And I do wonder why so many in this topic are asking this question.

OFP was released 2001, why does no new game have all the features OFP had?

Still, this is not the most important argument. Some of you seem to think that implementing movable units on vehicle would be a simple programming hack, that the developers just don't do because they don't want to.

But programming that wouldn't be so easy. You could implement it so that units just keep on their spot on a vehicle, no matter if the vehicle is moving, how fast or in which direction. But would that fit to OFP? No, OFP is a simulation and no arcade shooter as we all know. And BIS tend to make complete things.

So they'd had to implement a complicated physics engine that would check whether a car is turning or rapidly breaking(f.i.), because soldiers would have to fall out accordingly. If some flying platform would do any movements, a lot of calculations would have to be done and you surely couldn't have such a view distance anymore. Then you'd had to take into account the different types of soldiers and vehicles that would stand f.i. on an aircraft carrier, soldier animations would have to be regarded and and and.

After all, it's surely a lot more work than some might think. And that is what counts for BIS. Any new feature introduces bugs, which have to be tested and removed. That takes time. BIS have to think from a business aspect when deciding whether to implement some feature or not.

[Spetz 0]

there is a small chance of having BIS made air-craft carrier because there is a harrier, but most likely it is not a sea harrier

[KaRRiLLioN 0]

Quote[/b] ]And I do wonder why so many in this topic are asking this question.

OFP was released 2001, why does no new game have all the features OFP had?

OFP was released in 2001.  Arma is supposedly based on the VBS-2 platform and will be released in 2006 (hopefully).  It might be better to ask why we don't expect such features in a 2006 game since several other games prior to it were able to implement it.

Would I expect it to be completely realistic?  No, but then again there's already so much in OFP that isn't realistic that it wouldn't be a first.

What's not realistic about wanting to be able to land a chopper on a moving ship?  Or walking on the surface of a moving ship?

At a minimum, it'd be nice to be able to shoot out the window or rear of a moving truck if you're being pursued.  That's definitely realistic.

As for other games having the features of OFP, yes there are others.  None of them did it on quite the scale, i.e. larger islands, but they still did it.

So I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for something like this.  Also, considering it was part of a VBS1 module, it's not like it's something brand new for them.

And I'm very familiar with programming/scripting and I know how long and tedious it is to debug.  But BIS has already been adding new content to Arma, as they said in their interviews, so if we're going to have to wait forever on this publishing stuff to get worked out, they might as well add more requested items.  If, however, they're about to release within the next month, then forget it and release it.  I won't cry.

[frederf 0]

I'm not so much concerned with shooting from vehicles or having "intertial rest frames" attached to vehicles fully implimented in ArmA, but I would stress how such features really add to the flexibility of the engine.

Maybe you can't shoot from a UH-60 in ArmA as it comes out of the box, but leave a lil snippet of code for a modder to latch onto and watch what clever and useful things will result like tossing supplies or mines from a truck while moving or something I can't imagine.

Being able to stand in the back of a moving truck may sound useless in terms of ArmA gameplay, but being able to have such interactions allows mod makers to have ships and large cargo airplanes with a vehicle for cargo easily.

[BraTTy 0]

One more thing to add.

I was sitting here worried , totally forgetting about BIS's reputation that some astounding features will most likely be added during the life of the game.I have nothing to worry about

It has tailgunners already! (did I actually see tailgunners or just multiple firing positions? hope that apply's to planes too)

Nevertheless we mostly have release dates to discuss

I have webspace already (50gb space,750 gig month traffic)

For an ARMA Pacific Mod

[UNN 0]

Quote[/b] ]It has tailgunners already! (did I actually see tailgunners or just multiple firing positions? hope that apply's to planes too)

Just multiple positions I think, but they have lifted some of the restrictions for weapons on certain classes. Missiles on the car class for example, so lets hope it extends across all the other restricted classes.

Quote[/b] ] have webspace already (50gb space,750 gig month traffic)

For an ARMA Pacific Mod

Nice one, hope to see more addons like your Corsair

As for BIS including certain functionality, I think it's down to few of things:

A) Does it fit into their vision of Arma. From what I've read, OFP was designed to realise a "dream" rather than the highest possible number of sales.

B) Are there other, more important things that still need to be added.

C) If both of the above don't apply, then is their enough demand to warrant the time and effort.

D) How much work would be involved. Ok let's say if you add walking on moving objects. You have to update the config engine, the collision detection, net code, existing addons, script library & finally external editors like O2. You could probably add more to the list.

For C, looking at the forum hits, compared to the JIP thread. There certainly appears to be the demand. At least as far as the forum life goes

[bravo 6 0]

if Placebo said this feature (Walking On Moving Vehicles) would not be part of ARMA projects why this thread still open?

Did they changed their mind?

has i said before:

Quote[/b] ]they said in an interview that it was not going to be in ARMA.

edit: if you were able to walk in the vehicles im sure you also be able to fire from them.

[Pierrot 0]

if Placebo said this feature (Walking On Moving Vehicles) would not be part of ARMA projects why this thread still open?

Did they changed their mind?

To be sure, Placebo said ArmA will not support this feature. But at the same time BIS exhibited the elevator movie in which a soldier was carried in the moving elevator. So that the community completely gets confused whether ArmA supports Walkin on Moving Vehicles or not.

Someone said the elevator just moves only upword or downword so that this has nothing to do with Walking on the Moving Vehicles. The others said the elevator is opperated with full scripts, so that scripts might realise Walking on Moving Vehicles more or less but it would cosume a lot of CPU resources.

Anyway unless BIS makes mention of it, it will remain to be seen until DEMO is released.

[BraTTy 0]

We have had elevators in OFP.Thats a building animation,and slightly different.People have also made car lifts using that,works fine for cars you are in, but won't lift empty cars

I have been tinkering with stuff lately. Experimenting with moving platforms.I had it wrong.

You can walk and shoot on moving platforms.What happens is while the platform is moving, soldier doesn't move with the platform.

I'm still working on it.Maybe a small video when I get better progress.

[Scrub 0]

Since they have fixed collisions, I believe the unit standing on the elevator goes smoothly up and down because it is a 'Z' collision.  I'd still wager you can stand and run on a stationary carrier, but if it starts to move you're, sliding (staying in absolute X,Y position due to no friction modeled).  My guess.

[BraTTy 0]

Yes exactly

[bravo 6 0]

so it means that it would be possible then, is that what your saying?

if yes, sounds interesting

[dm 9]

OFP was released in 2001. Arma is supposedly based on the VBS-2 platform and will be released in 2006 (hopefully).

Wrong, VBS2 is based on a breed of ArmA/Game2 technology, not the other way round.