AI in ArmA

[akhen 0]

As already seen in the Elite videoes, there are some improvements to the AI, of which I'm sure will make it to ArmA.

[redface 1]

I elaborate on stahlhelm's comment

one thing that increasingly bothers me about OFP AI is the following:

get yourself detected by AI and then run into one of the 2 or 4-storey appartment blocks in Petrovice

the AI is clearly scripted not to fire at you, but they can still "see" and follow your movements, AI's knowledge about you remains 100% (only surface and specific vegetation like trees and bushes confues AI about your position)

this is why, as soon as you approach a window, AI will plant a bullet right in your head straight away. It's more like a engine calculation kicking in than a real ability to detect you.

Cover in height-related objects (even the otherwise perfect FDF trenches suffer from this engine limitation) should be more balanced.

I discovered this when I fell through the roof of the apartment on Nogova and landed somewhere inside the building but without a wall blocking my sight. AI couldn't hit me, but they were all aiming at my average position with considerable precision. In the open, you can crawl along the soil to flank the enemy, in buildings, you can't (at least, this is my impression).

You may kill one or two buddies, but you can't engage a group of enemies out of a window since to them, you're floating at a height and thus - paradox - more exposed than in the open.

[UNN 0]

Quote[/b] ]the AI is clearly scripted not to fire at you, but they can still "see" and follow your movements, AI's knowledge about you remains 100% (only surface and specific vegetation like trees and bushes confues AI about your position)

That’s not entirely true, buildings have a coefficient that’s used to generalise how much cover it gives. I can only assume that if BIS try and take into account, what can be seen through every window, doorway and room of a large building. It would be to much for the CPU?

You can run into a house and hide. If the AI see you enter, then what they know about you would reduce at a slower rate, than if you ran behind the house. If you stay crouched and hold fire, eventually they would forget your there. But on the whole it works, if you start trying to take out AI from a house without changing your position, it wont be long before you find yourself at the wrong end of a grenade.

[Pyronick 21]

yes, fear has a very good ki for closed quarter battles. farcry has an very good ki too. and this guys are good in long range fighting and alos in close combat situations. i think the ai in fear and farcry is mostly unscripted like in ofp.

i hope ArmA's ai is better than ofp's. ofp's ai is very good for an game from 2001. but there are somethings that i wish to see - ai

search for cover behind walls or trees or other obstacles by them self. in situations were you fight in wide open territory like fields were is not much cover the ofp ai acts realistic - when there is no cover the only thing you can do ist "hit the dirt". but in villages and towns ofp is getting weak.

but with all its errors and weaknesses in some points of gameplay ofp is still the best and most reliably combat simulation on the market since its release. and thx to all the modders who pushing ofp to its limits in graphics, gameplay and addons - they keep this game worth play over all this years. when i have to setup an new xp, ofp ist still the first game i install on the "virgin" system. i hope ArmA will give a big and new push for smoother gameplay, ai and graphics before the "next generation game" will give us an über-ofp (i hope so!

Yeah, Half-Life 2 had a good AI system. No, seriously!

If you played in City 17 and you are trapped in a house you can block the door and block all windows.

The AI detects this and will split up in teams, one Combine will try to kick in the door, others will try to kick in a windows or find others.

When the AI fails to kick in the door, he blows it up.

I was really amazed, and shocked.

So shocked, that I didn't react at all...

[guyguy1 0]

I hope the AI in Armed Assault drive more intelligently. When I tell them to get in a vehicle and follow me, they usually drive in circles or get jammed trying to undo their vehicular knot they always tie.

[Skewballzz 0]

I hope when I put a shell into the top story window the explosion isnt 20m below on the ground, yet the effects of the explosion hit things where I aimed

[Balschoiw 0]

I guess ArAs will have improved AI as Elite already has it to a certain extent. Still OFP AI never fails to surprise me. Ever been satcheled by a Spetsnaz who was creeping up to you from the back ? I wondered about the beeping, turned around and went boom

[Spy17 1]

Was that just standart OFP?

[as-33 0]

Yeah, Half-Life 2 had a good AI system. No, seriously!

If you played in City 17 and you are trapped in a house you can block the door and block all windows.

The AI detects this and will split up in teams, one Combine will try to kick in the door, others will try to kick in a windows or find others.

When the AI fails to kick in the door, he blows it up.

I don't think that's too exciting. They probably didn't do it because they analyzed their environment and developed a tactic, but because they were scripted to do it, like "if there is no path into the house, split up und break in". That's an easy way to give the impression of intelligent behaviour in a confined game like HL2, but it is not feasible in a huge environment like OFP.

[dmakatra 1]

I guess ArAs will have improved AI as Elite already has it to a certain extent. Still OFP AI never fails to surprise me. Ever been satcheled by a Spetsnaz who was creeping up to you from the back ? I wondered about the beeping, turned around and went boom

What improved AI in Elite?

The famous improved AI in Elite is nearly non-existant, if you ask me. You can see it. Occasionally. If you look very hard.

I do hope they fix the AI in ArmA, it should be BIS' top priority. A decent pathfinding and make 'em find cover/hull-down is all I ask. Just about everything else I can imagine AI-wise can be scripted by 3rd parties, if we get the pathfinding/cover/hull-down thing that is.

[Mogley 0]

The AI, when driving trucks or jeeps drove me crazy, constantly zig-zagging. Now I understand the military teaches you to zig-zag making you harder to sight in and hit. But at somemoments during combat it is better to go in a straight line to get where you are going faster. I just wish the AI would use each appropriately.

Has anyone read about what programming BIS put into the AI in OFP. One thing the they programmed was the AI has the ability to think about his life, he values it. If he believes he is outnumbered our outgunned he will retreat or just go prone and lie in wait of you. I love it when you wipe out almost an entire enemy squad and the last two or three troops run away in a hasty retreat as I shoot them in the back

They DO perform way better as a squad than alone. When they have the officer assigned to them, then of course their group tactics get much better. Even with the offficer breaking up the squad to send a few troops to flank your position while the rest keep you busy.

I do wish they would use cover and concealment more effectively though.

And the worst of all AI blunders is the damn snipers, who prefer close combat with their sniper rifles for some reason? I beleive this is because they couldnt program certain troops to have larger detection ranges. If they could just program the sniper to use the scope on his gun like a officer uses his binoculars that might fix that.

And why do the machine gunners tend to fire at targets out to 400m but standard troops no more than about 200m.

Those are the things I would like to see improved.

[Big Dawg KS 6]

Snipers are fine, the unit's engagement behaviour depends on his weapon, not class (semi-auto weapons will be used more at closer ranges, and sidearms will be used if they have one). And if you want them to see things at longer distances, give them a pair of binoculars. And officers have no advantages/disadvantages in the game, the only difference is that their default weapons include smoke shells (which are useless to AI anyways) and they have a pretty hat. The performance depends on the unit's skill.

AI only zig-zag when they're off road, or if the road is cluttered, the AI can be sometimes over-cautious, and aren't allways able to manuver through spaces that are otherwise wide enough to get through. The AI also stop for enemy infantry, which has allways bothered me, since a smarter tactic would be to run them over.

[UNN 0]

Quote[/b] ]And why do the machine gunners tend to fire at targets out to 400m but standard troops no more than about 200m.

It's all to do with the range they can identify an enemy. As a comparison, setup an mg with you as the officer, and pass it targets using your binoculars.

I think adding a more effective implementation of binoculars for the AI would make a huge difference for snipers and MGs. You can see signs of it with my Observer addon, but that also suffers (amongst other things) from some of the restrictions of Ai and optics.

[Mogley 0]

Snipers are fine, the unit's engagement behaviour depends on his weapon, not class (semi-auto weapons will be used more at closer ranges, and sidearms will be used if they have one). And if you want them to see things at longer distances, give them a pair of binoculars. And officers have no advantages/disadvantages in the game, the only difference is that their default weapons include smoke shells (which are useless to AI anyways) and they have a pretty hat. The performance depends on the unit's skill.

AI only zig-zag when they're off road, or if the road is cluttered, the AI can be sometimes over-cautious, and aren't allways able to manuver through spaces that are otherwise wide enough to get through. The AI also stop for enemy infantry, which has allways bothered me, since a smarter tactic would be to run them over.

1)I have never seen an AI sniper shoot further than 200m, I mean come on his scope should work the same way as an officers binoc's. His weapon should effect his engagement, and it should be out about 400-500m or so.

2) The only advantage I see with the officer is to be able to use his binoc's to spot far away and assign targets accordingly.

3) Yes they do zig-zag even when the roads clear and straight, in cwc, on the convoy escort mission, those dumb bastards in the three 5t trucks swerve all over, and yes they should just run them over

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]Was that just standart OFP?

Don´t nail me on this, but as I have no other mods than Resistance and FDF, I guess it is standard RES behaviour. Maybe he was out of Bizon ammo. I don´t know but it certainly gave me a good laughter.

[Hillslam 0]

In my opinion as a mission builder the biggest problem with OFP's AI was not its accuracy or pathfinding but the fact the AI always engaged just BEYOND the visual distance you set for human players.

For example - if I setviewdistance 900, and I'm sitting in a tank, I can see ground out to 900m, building and some terrain objects out to 850m or so, and finally all vehicles, infantry, and objects are visible by 800m or so. But the AI finds targets at around 1000m and (depending on their weapon) engages them before a human player will ever see them. Before they are even rendered for a human player.

In other words, the AI does not react correctly to the viewdistance setting. Its especially bad in vehicles with long range weapons. Unless you set view distance to 4000m or so (and in my large missions that kills even modern top of the line PCs), you'll be mostly shooting at, and being shot by, grey fog.

I hope AA addresses this.

Thoughts?

[sanctuary 19]

1)I have never seen an AI sniper shoot further than 200m, I mean come on his scope should work the same way as an officers binoc's. His weapon should effect his engagement, and it should be out about 400-500m or so.

That is all linked on how the sniper unit, and his weapon are configured.

I experimented with that , and you can try it there, an AI sniper capable of killing you at more than 2000m of distance

(the original goal was to make an AI unit that would be used to put "killing zones" in mission, better than the old "trigger kills who comes in" trick)

[-DirTyDeeDs--Ziggy- 0]

thanks for you work!

the OFP community is simply the best

[Sniperwolf572 758]

Quote[/b] ]Was that just standart OFP?

Don´t nail me on this, but as I have no other mods than Resistance and FDF, I guess it is standard RES behaviour. Maybe he was out of Bizon ammo. I don´t know but it certainly gave me a good laughter.

Belive it or not, I had a same experience, my squad was playing an MP mission, and a friend and I were standing next to a building in Lamentin, a another man from our squad was about 100m away from us facing our direction, he saw the spetznaz, but he didn't shoot him, the spetznatz setup the satchel meter from me and started running away, I turned around as I heard the footsteps, but the spetznaz was already around the corner, and I saw the satchel, at first I was like: "WTF? I didn't place a satchel there!" and then I heard gunshots, that same spetznaz was exchanging fire with the guy that was 100m away, the guy killed the spetznaz and the satchel didn't blow, lucky us.

I think I have a screenshot of that, but I'm not sure.

[5133p39 16]

omg, those stories about spetznaz setting a satchel are really interesting.

I think i will do some "research" into this.

But let's get back to the AI improvements, which some say, are in the OFP:E.

How exactly is the AI improved there? I didn't played OFP:E, and from the videos i can't find anything from which i could tell the AI has been improved. I am not trying to imply it wasn't improved, i am just humbly asking for exact informations, because i am really interested.

So is here anyone who is playing the OFP:Elite who could tell us?

[dachrinne 0]

omg now i get paranoid on those spetsnaz ai

[sputnik monroe 102]

One of my oldest memories of Flashpoint is that night patrol mission in the CWC campaign where you guard the Vulcan from the two spetznatz. First time I played the mission I wandered around lit the campfire watched a boat at sea through my binoculars. After a few minutes I thought I saw a shadow crawling in the bushes about 40 meters away. I kind of squinted and held the right mouse button for zoom to see what it was, and then KA-BOOM! Big explosion, my first ever experince with the satchel charge.

I thought it was awsome. As the years went on though I came to believe it was a scripted event, that the spetznatz must have a waypoint then a trigger that makes them set the charge for that mission. Now you guys have me wondering...

[Metal Heart 0]

They're smart enough not to attack an empty Vulcan without ammo unless told to It's this fire ["put", "pipebomb"] on the waypoint On Activation field.

[Sniperwolf572 758]

I don't remember telling AI to place a Satchel right behind me, nor anywhere in that mission, also, I think the mission was a Zeus CTI.

[Zerg 0]

In crCTI AI units with satchels are scripted to aproach the enemy buildings and set the explosives if you get them to a certain distance of the enemy buildings.

Maybe it`s similar in Zeus and you we`re standing next to a base building?