Marines in space!

[The Frenchman 0]

*starts humming Klendathu Drop*

I found this on another forum and thought it was interesting:

Quote[/b] ]

http://www.defensetech.org/archives/001815.html

"After three years of being laughed out of meetings, the U.S. Marine Corps' futuristic plans to deploy through space may finally be getting some traction," notes Aviation Week's spunky new spin-off, Defense Technology International.

Although the chuckle factor hasn't altogether disappeared, the Air Force Research Laboratory and Darpa are beginning a study of options for a reusable upper-stage space travel vehicle -- the same kind of technology that the Marines might need for a ride halfway across the globe.

The effort is called "Hot Eagle," and it could be the first step forward in the Marine Corps' hopes for space travel. Within minutes of bursting into the atmosphere beyond the speed of sound -- and dispatching that ominous sonic boom -- a small squad of Marines could be on the ground and ready to take care of business within 2 hours. [One presentation muses that the capsule might later be picked up by a Osprey or by a "balloon cable and C-17" transport plane. Or, the Marines might "hike out," and "leave [the] crew capsule behind." -- ed.]

The Marine Corps calls the concept the Small Unit Space Transport and Insertion Capability (Sustain). This plan, a growing group of Marine supporters say, is the natural evolution of the service's proclivity for expeditionary warfare that began decades ago with amphibious landings...

The concept is to deliver strategic equipment or a small squad of soldiers to any point on the globe -- even the most hard-to-reach location -- within hours of need. Once on the ground, those soldiers can carry out strategically critical missions like reconnaissance or destroying a specific target.

At least, that's their pitch.

Heinlein would be proud.  

[Tovarish 0]

Quote[/b] ]"After three years of being laughed out of meetings, the U.S. Marine Corps' futuristic plans to deploy through space may finally be getting some traction,"

Am I the only one who read this and instantly thought of The Wings of Honneamise?

Ah dang, I just exposed myself as an anime geek.

On topic - nifty!

[Frisbee 0]

It made me think of the drop pods with 3-4 gundams in it, featured in just about every gundam series.

Quote[/b] ]Ah dang, I just exposed myself as an anime geek.

(made me think of Heinlein too though)

I wonder how 'covert' this insertion would be though, I'd imagine they'd have to drop pretty far from the target area, so they're not spotted landing.

[Ex-RoNiN 0]

It made me think of the drop pods with 3-4 gundams in it, featured in just about every gundam series.

Quote[/b] ]Ah dang, I just exposed myself as an anime geek.

(made me think of Heinlein too though)

I wonder how 'covert' this insertion would be though, I'd imagine they'd have to drop pretty far from the target area, so they're not spotted landing.

Marines aren't exactly known for their subtelty. I take this type of vehicle to mean a "normal" beach landing, not a secretive Recon/infiltration mission.

The advantage is that it will be dropping out of the sky at quite insane speeds, so SAMs won't be able to target it until it has slowed down later on...

Would be interesting to see that in action

[ozanzac 0]

What I'll find most intriguing about this 'concept', would be seeing what kind of new weaponry and technologies would be developed to counter the new 'threat', if any.

[Panda-PL- 0]

What I'll find most intriguing about this 'concept', would be seeing what kind of new weaponry and technologies would be developed to counter the new 'threat', if any.

Phoenix missiles?

They were capable of intercepting ballistic missiles, and they were flying at the edge of space.

Plus the IR signature's gonna be enormous after atmosphere re-entry.

[Pathy 0]

Made me think of Aliens....."We're on an express elevator to hell, goin' down!"

[shinRaiden 0]

It made me think of the drop pods with 3-4 gundams in it, featured in just about every gundam series.

Quote[/b] ]Ah dang, I just exposed myself as an anime geek.

(made me think of Heinlein too though)

I wonder how 'covert' this insertion would be though, I'd imagine they'd have to drop pretty far from the target area, so they're not spotted landing.

Marines aren't exactly known for their subtelty. I take this type of vehicle to mean a "normal" beach landing, not a secretive Recon/infiltration mission.

The advantage is that it will be dropping out of the sky at quite insane speeds, so SAMs won't be able to target it until it has slowed down later on...

Would be interesting to see that in action

That is the whole premise of th Quake2 intro modus operendi, that the Zumlin backstory further elaborates on that. The Stroggs had two main defense systems, the EMP 'big gun' that knocked one alien capital ship fleet out of orbit negating orbital bombardment, and the second a massive shield grid which stalled another aliens' retribution ground invasion.

Contrast that with the method employed by the Q2 Spacemarines, which hopefully will get more coverage in Q4. Each soldier was placed in a drop pod that also doubled as a hibernation cell, then racked in a massive carrier ship. The intent was to create a swarm effect similar to the functionality of chaff. However, apparently the Strogg's EMP systems had manual burst capabilities in addition to traditional radar or laser targeting systems, shattering the drop pod swarms headed for Capital City inside the security perimeter.

What they failed to address however is the larger support requirements. Evidently the intended plan was to drop swarms of Marines on the EMP and grid control sites to take them down, so that larger logisitics shuttles could then ferry supplies and equipment down to the planet surface.

While this would have been potentially applicable for rapid insertion into ABM or high-altitude AA missile protected locations such as Moscow in the bad old days, unless they plan do direct crash landing it would be extremely vulnerable on final descent. The thermal insulation requirements would likely minimize the viability of gun ports (space shuttle et al), and would require syncronized orbital bombardment or guided missile strikes to give the landing sufficent cover from ground forces, and protection from anti-air systems.

If on the other hand they go for crash-impact insertion, we're talking the biggest joyride since the Fulton Chair. The impact shock would likely level the neighborhood, and roast anyone that comes near. But the time to exit the red-hot vehicle safely and secure a perimeter would be long enough that even unadvised local bandits would be able to get in position. A potential solution there would be to have explosive bolts on the doors and gunports to blow them off immediately on impact. Then you just have to undo everyone's crash harnesses.

While this is an interesting idea, it's really only practical imho fully complemented by orbital satallite bombardment and airborne air superiority high-energy laser platforms, and all the other crazy stuff. Given that none of the major defense contractors atm have a lust for serious R&D similar to UAC etc, it's highly doubtful that such a system would fly. More likely they'd use it to fleece the tax payers and replace America's Army with the equally relevant Halo.

[Harnu 0]

Maybe I'll be able to get that ticket to space while I'm in the Corps afterall!

[Commander-598 0]

While this would have been potentially applicable for rapid insertion into ABM or high-altitude AA missile protected locations such as Moscow in the bad old days, unless they plan do direct crash landing it would be extremely vulnerable on final descent. The thermal insulation requirements would likely minimize the viability of gun ports (space shuttle et al), and would require syncronized orbital bombardment or guided missile strikes to give the landing sufficent cover from ground forces, and protection from anti-air systems.

If on the other hand they go for crash-impact insertion, we're talking the biggest joyride since the Fulton Chair. The impact shock would likely level the neighborhood, and roast anyone that comes near. But the time to exit the red-hot vehicle safely and secure a perimeter would be long enough that even unadvised local bandits would be able to get in position. A potential solution there would be to have explosive bolts on the doors and gunports to blow them off immediately on impact. Then you just have to undo everyone's crash harnesses.

My idea is ripping off Halo. The Pillar of Autumn was staffed with a contingent of UNSC Orbital Drop Shock Troopers(ODSTs, Helljumpers), kinda the space Marine equivalent of US Army Rangers. They were dropped from the ship in one man drop pods. After reentry and somewhere near the ground, they deployed a parachute and landed safely. Of course, some of them became ads for KFC and others were clearly listening too intently to Megadeath's High Speed Dirt, but overall the vast majority of them did make it safely to the ground.

They were extremely small and extremely fast targets, so any defences were pretty much nullified.

Quote[/b] ]

"Most of the crew-not to mention your fellow jarheads-will be leaving the ship in lifeboats. They'll ride to the surface in air-conditioned comfort, sipping wine, and nibbling on appetizers."

"Not you, however. Oh no, your going to leave the Pillar of Autumn by a different method. Tell me, boys and girls... How will you leave?"

"WE GO FEET FIRST, SIR!"

Halo: The Flood

[gandalf the white 0]

This just sounds too un-marine-ish to be true . also, as said: there are ways to repel an attack like that, as I see it it's a pumped up horsa glider mixed with the normal space shuttle, and neither of those is very safe to be in...

EDIT:

Made me think about Full Metal Panic btw

watch episode 1 or the 80 mb trailer and you'll understand

[DracoPaladore 0]

Quote[/b] ]

New U.S. Department of Defense plans for the future!

The Department of Defense today has released to the public some of the United States government most top secret plans for the future of their military armed forces. Their revolutionary and imaginative ideas of the battlefield of tomarrow continue to advance the ability for the glorious country to dominate the battlefield.

First among a series of concepts shown to the public was that of their new 'Space Marine'.

-'New Concept of future US Soldiers in combat'-

"We really hope to make this work." John Susselmen, one of the lead designers behind the project. "Soon our marines will be able to jump from building to building, take RPG( ed:Rocket Propelled Grenades) in the chest, and dominate the battlefield without a single casualty."

The lead designer continues, telling those at the conference that 'they could be dropped from space without harm, and further damage the enemy pshycollogically with their menacing and monstrous presense.' Some may refer to these designers as being almost heretical to logical thinking and could possibly be lead off to provide their research to other dominate figures on the globe, but they assure everyone that they will continue to work for the United States government with loyalty.

The United States government has told the press today taht they plan to have this new battlefield armor, costing several million per suit, out into service by 2008.

[shinRaiden 0]

Research into this is ongoing in the University of South Australia's Tinmith Augmented Reality system, and UC Berkeley's BLEEX augemented exoskeleton robotics.

http://www.tinmith.net/

http://bleex.me.berkeley.edu/bleex.htm

It would be relatively striaght-forward to expand the BLEEX system to integrate arm augmentation, and add a pair of SCUBA tank sized fuel cell energy modules for power. Then cover the whole unit with heavy armor and then you have a suitable first-gen mech suit. Obviously this is a long ways from full Eva syncronization, but there's a lot of other bio-tech and alien too that would need to be developed in the mean time.

[walker 0]

Hi All

The first place this was dealt with was in Robert Heinlein's Starship Troopers. Not the film which as usual has nothing to do with the book.

In the book a drop from space and the risks from AA fire and how it is dealt with are described

Basically the concept is lots of targeted prep fire from orbit, Tons of Window, Electronic Warfare packages and tons of Decoys.

The real problem is how the hell you get all that up into orbit.

Logistics is the real technical problem. Without a cheap fuel source; and I mean a tenth of the fuel cost of an aeroplane to the location, you are just fantasising about war from space.

Options:

* Produce your materials on the moon, thus reducing the gravity well you have to climb out of. You still have the cost of getting the soldiers into space which is probably prohibitive on its own.

* A space elevator

* Small fusion engines (end of war any way no reason to fight)

* Unknown nearly free fuel system (as above)

Kind Regards Walker

[Scorpio 0]

Marines - for the land, sea, and air....and space!

[EiZei 0]

Marines - for the land, sea, and air....and space!

and wearing angora if ed wood is any indication.