BF2 Criticism and Thoughts

[Guest Ti0n3r]

I just have to say that I've totaly changed my opinion on BF2.

I have played online with a couple of friends for hours and we've been using teamspeak2 to communicate. It is very fun to hide in the tall grass and take out all those confused loners who dont know a thing about teamplay.

This game is not by any means realistic. But what can you expect from arcade games, right?

[Stealth3 0]

LoL your no way in the tall grass because from 50 meters you dont see grass anymore. It disappears like in bfv.

[DracoPaladore 0]

I was curious as to see what else I can 'fix' in the game, seeing as everyone was releasing messages on how to get past timer, etc.

But I also found a way to get past only 15 bots. In fact, the file itself gives you the explanation.

This is in the AI folder in Bf2

Look at aidefault.ai (used wordpad to open it up)

echo *****************************************************************************************

echo AIDefault.ai ****************************************************************************

echo *****************************************************************************************

aiSettings.setNSides 2

aiSettings.setAutoSpawnBots 1

aiSettings.setMaxNBots 64

aiSettings.maxBotsIncludeHumans 1

aiSettings.setBotSkill 0.4

rem To spawn more than 15 bots in SP, use the following lines instead of the three lines above.

rem Note that this is totaly unsupported, it will affect your system's performance

rem and may even crash your game. That being said, you will most likely be able to run a lot

rem more bots than 15 on your system.

rem Example for 32 bot game with expert bots

rem aiSettings.overrideMenuSettings 1

rem aiSettings.setMaxNBots 32

rem aiSettings.maxBotsIncludeHumans 0

rem aiSettings.setBotSkill 1.0

run BotNames.ai

aiSettings.setInformationGridDimension 32

run AIPathFinding.ai

rem EOF

====

Havn't tested this myself yet.

doesnt work  

I'm guessing those rem notes were for the full version, but I also suspect that a few other files and folders have to be tweaked to do it. I didn't have a chance today as power was out for four hours.

[MrZig 0]

I just deleted the REM parts on the lower (newer) part and added REM to the top part and now I have 32 ai bots on the 16 player map Great fun!

[DracoPaladore 0]

I just deleted the REM parts on the lower (newer) part and added REM to the top part and now I have 32 ai bots on the 16 player map Great fun!

Great news, I'll do this tomarrow.

Brother will be happy to hear this. He hated it when he found out the limitations they put on SP and COOP.

[der bastler 0]

CLI? It's all python

Just in case of misunderstanding: CLI = command line interface

(switch BF2 resolution to 1280x1024)

The trolls over there at the heise.de-forums tell you all time that only linux users fiddle with the CLI...

Anyway, python is advancing, hmm? Saw it first time while working with a dSpace system.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

hmmm .. or you could have just looked here

BF2 Tweak guide

[shadow 6]

..why are people, 1, comparing this game to OFP. 2, complaining about "realism" in the game..

1: Because we like realism

2: Because we like realism

When you don't like something it is not uncommon to complain is it?

This game needs a realism mod that tweaks damagepoints, hitpoints, dispersion etc

Any python gurus here?

[Gordy 0]

Any python gurus here?

Yeah, I got two.  

[txalin 2]

..why are people, 1, comparing this game to OFP. 2, complaining about "realism" in the game..

1: Because we like realism

2: Because we like realism

When you don't like something it is not uncommon to complain is it?

This game needs a realism mod that tweaks damagepoints, hitpoints, dispersion etc

Any python gurus here?

wait sometime, there are several mods workig on realism bf2, and forgotten hope is going to release his mod (amazing, and really realistic) on bf2.

And talking about bf2, i think, and its obviously, that this game is made for having fast fun, its arcade, too arcade, and u cant expect nothing realistic on this game, but if u start to use the squad and commander system u can made a really tactical game, its really funny to use this system if people on your squad accept the orders a play with a little of sense.

I think bf2 funny, but its only another arcade game, and cant be compared with ofp, ArmAss or ofp2, because i think that those ones are other type of games

PD: Sorry for my bad english ;)

[shadow 6]

I did'nt expect the game to be reallistic. I was hoping it would have been more reallistic than bs42. If there is no realism mod coming for this game then its already dead to me.

[Guest Ti0n3r]

LoL your no way in the tall grass because from 50 meters you dont see grass anymore. It disappears like in bfv.

Ok.

[DracoPaladore 0]

I did'nt expect the game to be reallistic. I was hoping it would have been more reallistic than bs42. If there is no realism mod coming for this game then its already dead to me.

No, there's one being made. It's called project reality.

[DBR_ONIX 0]

..why are people, 1, comparing this game to OFP. 2, complaining about "realism" in the game..

1: Because we like realism

2: Because we like realism

When you don't like something it is not uncommon to complain is it?

by that logic, why aren't you complaining about.. Area 51? Darwinia (http://www.darwinia.co.uk/ ... what, I like the developers ).. most games..

I dont see the point in complaing about how much a game sucks.. Just play a game you like instead..? *Cough*Flashpoint

Anyway, back on topic, good to see the developers of BF2 lock the game down that tightly Can fiddle with it even before any mod-tools have been released

- Ben

[txalin 2]

..why are people, 1, comparing this game to OFP. 2, complaining about "realism" in the game..

1: Because we like realism

2: Because we like realism

When you don't like something it is not uncommon to complain is it?

This game needs a realism mod that tweaks damagepoints, hitpoints, dispersion etc

Any python gurus here?

wait sometime, there are several mods workig on realism bf2, and forgotten hope is going to release his mod (amazing, and really realistic) on bf2.

[NeMeSiS 11]

I just deleted the REM parts on the lower (newer) part and added REM to the top part and now I have 32 ai bots on the 16 player map Great fun!

Great news, I'll do this tomarrow.  

Brother will be happy to hear this. He hated it when he found out the limitations they put on SP and COOP.

*note to self* stop editing your backups  

EDIT: no difference in FPS with 32 bots

[4 IN 1 0]

just found out that the G36C is the most effective weapon along all guns in game

[miles teg 1]

There are a few things I think that BIS could learn from in BF2. One of them is learning how to do realistic tracers and ricochets. The tracer mods for OFP did a long way making tracers more realistic, but still the tracers in BF2 are just outstanding. Another area which I wish to see incorporated into future BIS OFP games is the area of more realistic animations. In BF2 it looks amazing when the guys get shot. Their bodies twist and shake and their helmets fly off sometimes when they get hit.

The only other thing I'd like to see is the ability to jump in to a helicopter and not be strapped down without being able to fire your weapon. I REALLY love in Joint Operations for example, how you can fire your rifle from the door of a helicopter or out the window of a humvee. But I guess i'd be happy just to have a least multiple weapon positions on a vehicle. But still if No-logic can do it, I'm sure the bright lads of BIS could figure out how to do it. I'm not sure if BF2 has this feature however but I still think it looks worth buying for some fun fast paced action that is vaguely realistic, especially if its open ended and that realism mod pans out into something really good. I have to say that one thing that the BF and JO game engines have that whoops the OFP game engine is that they are optimized and allow for impressively smooth frame rates even on low end systems.

I've played against 32 players and tons of vehicles on huge Joint Operations maps for example with no serious framerate problems. I hope that likewise OFP2 is optimized so that you don't need a 2.3ghz PC and up and the latest Nvidia gfx card to play it. That would seriously suck. Even with OFP:Resistance I am seriously curtailed in the number of units I can use in battles.

Anyhoo.... back to BF2, overall I think it looks really impressive. I'll probably try it out. Hopefully the realism mod for it will cater to more hardcore military sim enthusiasts like OFP does cuz right now while it looks good, it definitely is arcade like still and doesn't seem to foster a sense of team work like OFP MP matches do.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[Heatseeker 0]

Meh, give Flashpoint some graphics improvements and colision detection fixes, plus better looking units (Aras?) and it still smokes both BF2 and JO by miles, especialy if the MP is improved and jip works well enough, those games just dont offer enough and dont play right .

[PainDealer 0]

Meh, give Flashpoint some graphics improvements and colision detection fixes, plus better looking units (Aras?) and it still smokes both BF2 and JO by miles, especialy if the MP is improved and jip works well enough, those games just dont offer enough and dont play right .

well, I'd sign that one. but you know there has to be shooting headshots from the hip while running and firing 2 rockets at the same time otherwise you don't get the green

most of the companies make games for the mainstream, that's why the minority = good taste = us, don't like it.

[shinRaiden 0]

Wow, in response to user's complaints that the 10 minute SP and 12 minute MP timelimits do not adequately allow for useful evaluation of units, weapons, gameplay, team organization, commander mode, etc, The Great Satan EA has this to say :

Quote[/b] ]

EA and DICE both fully support server-side modding in the sense that we have intentionally exposed a good deal of Python functionality to the end-user, primarily to encourage modders to tweak game types and scoring (on UNRANKED servers) once the full game is available. That said, we have come to discover that two items that were not a part of the demo feature-set were hacked in the Battlefield 2 demo. We consider both of these changes in violation of the Tools EULA that each server operator accepted in installing the server software.

The demo's feature set included a 12-minute time limit on rounds and excluded access to the weapon unlocks. Because some server operators have hacked the time limit out of their servers or hacked access to the unlocks, we have been forced to reinforce our intended feature set by delisting the offending servers. All violations of the EULA as described above will result in a 1-week ban/delisting.

The activities of the obviously active hacking community reinforce our decision to not release the Ranked server publicly with the final product. Our desire is to be able to offer an exploit-free place to play where players can legitimately gain ranks, and collect awards and unlocks. The only way we can offer such a service and protect the Ranked server content is by hosting the ranked servers directly and through trusted partners. The Unranked server tools will be released to the community so that they may host their own BF2 servers, mods, etc.

1) Timelocks. I don't get the concern at all there, unless it's to provide so little sampling that you are "forced" to get the full version. I would think, that the more time people spend in the demo, the more hooked and interested in the full version they would be.

If the timelocks issue is to prevent super-skilled teams from being able to crash the system balance on day one, that's remotely understandable. What it does do is boot the n00bs before they get a chance to enjoy the product, so they run a strong risk of mirroring the common misconceptions about OFP, that's likewise based solely off the demo.

2) Weapon unlocks. There you have it folks, weapon unlocks are only intended for ranked servers, ie leased servers. Thanks for playing, please deposit another $250 a month to continue... 9... 8... 7... ~ 2... 1... GAME OVER.

What EA obviously doesn't get here is that the "hacks" that they're upset about are not regarded as "hacks" by the community, but instead as "fixes". Which is compounded especially by the UK EA Games forum's comments running now 5 : 1 in the negatives thread vs. the positives thread.

Only days now until EA discovers that although they've empty'd a whole clip of MG fire into their foot, they haven't hit anything at all, and the fan's patience will last as long as their timelocks.

And this comment elsewhere on digitalsoftware.se :

Quote[/b] ]

In several forums there where reports posted about servers semingly on purpose being removed from the ingame-browsers list whenever they use modified server-settings, for instance 'No Time Limit' and 'Unlocked Weapons'-alterations, and included these words in the server-names. We are not calling them hacks, since they aren't. They are simpel alterations in the .py (python)-files included, that EA and DICE have already hyped so much in terms that it will allow new game-mods and server-alterations. Yet, when server-owners now starts to use them as intended...they get blacklisted!

EA has now officially confirmed that the blacklisting is taking place, in the latest 'community update' .

Unfortuanly(sic), EA goes on it's normal path of desinformation.

Let's look at two quotes shall we:

"EA and DICE both fully support server-side modding in the sense that we have intentionally exposed a good deal of Python functionality to the end-user, primarily to encourage modders to tweak game types and scoring (on UNRANKED servers) once the full game is available."

That is very nice that you have included the very versitale .py-scripts. They are indeed powerfull enough to let you alter game-modes and events on the serves.

"That said, we have come to discover that two items that were not a part of the demo feature-set were hacked in the Battlefield 2 demo."

Here EA is getting confused. They say they "intentionally exposed a good deal of Python functionality to the end-user", the server-admins sees this and alters the .py-scripts, just like expected. How is altering the .py-files, that by their own admission contains a lot of functionality to the end-users, hacking the server? Even more so if a changed row above or below for instance the '12-min limit'-entry...is something they claim is within the EULA and alright?

Was these rows marked with "don't touch" comments? No. Where these entrys mentioned in the EULA? No.

So what we have here is EA making up the rules as we go along. This is indeed frightening and a grim preview of what is to come.

Alienating the one source of servers that wouldn't cost them a thing...is a really bad thing. Even the pencil-pushers in the upper management EA should be able to grasp that concept.

We thought they really would be able to grasp it when we wrote it. Unfortuanly, we now know they have no clue at all.

Here is a tip for EA:

If you include something in the .py-files they are going to be altered.

Don't give candy to a kid without instructions and then complain when the kid eats it.

It's just common sence(sic).

Now that EA is back from a long weekend of congratulating themselves, one of the board mods had this to say...

Quote[/b] ]

- Graphics cards. Lack of support for older/certain cards; lack of 1280x1024 support; driver issues.

- Server issues. The missing Linux server code; the "blacklisted" server issue; apparent server stability issues.

- Control issues. Remappable/non-remappable keys; flight systems.

- Gameplay comments. Infantry weapon damage or lack thereof; various commander and squad discussions; spawn camping discussions; excessive vehicle question.

I believe that the above 4 groups cover around 80% of the negative or problematic posts made since the release of the demo and we are seeking answers and/or comments from the development team in each respect. Obviously, that list is purely off the top of my head - aside from the actual full feedback we send into development.

Yeah, those 4 items are pretty much the 80% or so in a vague sort of way, but he also convienently didn't mention the repeated and obvious complaints about the gamespy and mp account system. I would think that they'd have the sense to realize that people who make accounts now, will want to carry them forward, hopefully they won't break the system in the process.

So lessons learned anyone? The entire editing community here got launched from tweaking the original OFP demo, and we've come a long ways since then. It's a shame that a company would willfully drive a viable - although inferior - product into the ground just because they were too lazy/clueless to be arsed to do it right, but hopefully that will mean more sales ultimately of ARAS to the BF refugee market.

[der bastler 0]

EA is fighting their own customers... it would be fine if the customers would bring in the ultimate weapon: boycott.

But sadly that will not happen. Instead of insisting on certain customer rights the major part will bite the bullet -- see the case "HL2/Steam".

So the game market is truly dead... Well, more time to earn money!

P.S.: EULAs are null and void in Germany. So what?

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

boycott doesnt work nowadays anymore. .. reminds me of big multimedia stores like MediaMarkt. They got no service whatsoever, often rude employees and illegal selling techniques but noone seems to care because it is cheap. The chain grows faster every year.

Same goes for computer games

The very abusive license agreements and the insulting requirements of Steam for HALF LIFE 2 caused no sales problems either.

The game itself was totally overvalued. Lets admit it. The AI was rather ridiculous and after a great beginning it gets boring in the end.

But what can we say about battlefield. I must admit that their move wasnt smart as far as their "reputation" is concerned.

The message of their banning of servers is: "dont mod the demo, buy the game instead!

But at the moment THERE IS ONLY THE DEMO OUT so why punishing people

But in the end they dont have to care. From Half Life 2 they have learned the lesson that there might be a lot of crying and shouting but in the end people will buy it anyway. Marketing Propaganda rules over personal experience and perception.

[Placebo 28]

The entire editing community here got launched from tweaking the original OFP demo

That's what started me off on the path to where I am now. Creating "patches" which changed loadout weapon in the game, converted empty tents into empty vehicles for people to play with, changing the time etc. etc.

[Balschoiw 0]

I didn´t buy HL2 and I will not buy BF2. I did not buy HL2 for the steam - crap. As I am on ISDN it would have taken me one week to get all the updates that were needed via Steam. I´ve seen it running at a friends comp , was impressed, than not. Highly overrated game imo.

BF2 has never been on my list of interest. Tried BF1, tried BFV, both were crap to the limit, I guess I never uninstalled demos that fast as with those 2.

I don´t mind if there are guys who enjoy the series, but I´m just not one of them.

The EA policies on demo regulations is just nonsense. As is most of their other policies on consumer rights and data privacy.

Unfortunally those publishers get bigger and fatter and their market-share rises by the minute. That´s a real problem as even good games will be put under the EA policies that don´t really attract me. Boycott will never work as there are just too many out there who want to play the games. The game-developers have little choice these days. Either they go with the major publishers with big balls and a rolling PR machine, or they risk to choose a small publisher who doesn´t mangle into their business that much but has not the PR machine in the background. Not easy to choose.

Hopefully OFP 2 and ArAs will not suffer from those limitations.

Anyway, this all seems to be a trend, having an eye on Ubisoft and others. You think you buy a product for 50 or more euros and all what you get is some online-downloading madness and copy-protection routines that mess up your comp and violate your privacy rights...

The days of a gamer have definately been better...

Quote[/b] ]That's what started me off on the path to where I am now. Creating "patches" which changed loadout weapon in the game, converted empty tents into empty vehicles for people to play with, changing the time etc. etc.

Same here. I was shocked and awed by the demo and immedeatly sucked in. Even at those early days BIS (at least I don´t remember) hasn´t interferred with editing the demo.

Hehe, I remember adding some unguided rockets plus launcher to a guy along with a 20mm gun. Those were the days