The Middle East part 2

[bn880 5]

Again IDF plays the role of SS or Nazis. Ahh yes, so I am sure htey destroyed the 3 million if it was to cut funding, not took it?

Shortly Hague ruling on the wall will be completed AFAIk, care to bet it will condmen the insane wall?

[Bernadotte 0]

IDF bank robbery

Quote[/b] ]Israeli troops have swooped on several banks in Ramallah in what officials say is their biggest recent move to choke off funding for Palestinian militants.

More than $3 million was removed from bank vaults during the action, Israeli security sources say.

So, what happens to those buisnesses and non-militant citizens who had money deposited in those banks?

Now that's what I call collateral damage.  

Why would terrorists/militants keep their money in a bank where the IDF can come and take it just like they've done in the past?  Let's face it, most militant money is being kept safely out of the IDF's reach.

And even if it was militant money what could such money be spent on in the occupied territories?  Weapons?  Bombs?  The territories and Israel may be where the hardware is being used, but it's not where it's being purchased.  Again, that money is held in foreign banks.

This was not against terrorism. This was nothing more than systematic harassment through theft.  Even the US criticised it. What else is new?

[theavonlady 2]

This was not against terrorism.  This was nothing more than systematic harassment through theft.

Yes, a well planned out $10million heist. Sure, that's what the IDF's for.

Quote[/b] ]Even the US criticised it.  What else is new?

Don't bother mentioning what else the US said.

Quote[/b] ]"We certainly recognize the need to cut off funding for terror organizations, and we've always called for Palestinian leaders to take immediate, credible steps to end terror and violence," <State Department spokesman Richard> Boucher said.

The US talks. The PA does nothing. Israel acts.

Some of the finds. In today's Jpost:

Quote[/b] ]"Charitable organizations" whose assets were confiscated include:

The Antser Association, established to assist the families of suicide bombers and prisoners incarcerated in Israel. The association, headed by Nafez Arji, a senior Hizbullah official and in the past a member of Islamic Jihad, was outlawed in October 2003.

The Islamic Dar al-Arkam Center, a project initiated by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin with funds from Hamas headquarters in Syria. The center is used as a school and a meeting place for Hamas officials.

The Islamic Association of El-Bireh, affiliated with Hamas and outlawed in 2002. One of its founders is Jimal Tawil, arrested in April 2002 for his involvement in the suicide bombing on the Rehov Ben-Yehuda pedestrian mall in Jerusalem in December 2001 in which 11 were killed.

The Ramallah Charity Organization, affiliated with Hamas and outlawed in 2002. It is headed by Akel Rabiah, a senior Hamas official who received direct instructions from the Hamas leadership abroad and used the funds he received in Ramallah for terrorist activities.

The Ahsan Association in Bethlehem, which fronts as a charity organization, but in fact is a center for Islamic Jihad activities.

Funds were also confiscated from senior terrorist leaders, including Montsar Abu Eilun, a senior Al-Aksa Brigade commander in Jenin; Na'af Abu Sharam, a senior Tanzim official in Nablus; and Yamin Farji, a member of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine in Nablus.

Yesterday's initial government announcement:

Quote[/b] ]In the context of the State of Israel’s struggle against the infrastructure of terrorist organizations, and as part of the global war on terrorist funds, Israeli security forces today carried out an operation to seize terrorist funds from the following accounts:

** The accounts of outlawed associations;

** Accounts of Islamic Jihad and Hamas associations in Judea, Samaria and Gaza;

** Accounts to which funds have been transferred from associations that have been outlawed or from terrorist HQs abroad, such as Hezbollah.

** Accounts of terrorists in Judea, Samaria and Gaza to which funds have been transferred from terrorist organizations, including senior terrorists who received funds designated for financing terrorism, and senior fugitives in Judea, Samaria and Gaza and their families (when the account was at the disposal of the fugitive).

In the context of the operation, accounts are being examined at various banks, which are suspected of receiving funds - used to expedite anti-Israel terrorism from Hezbollah, Hamas and Islamic Jihad.

The security establishment has for some time warned about the phenomenon in which funds from terrorist organizations abroad are being channeled to terrorists in the field; in practice, the terrorist organizations have become the main employers of terrorists in the field. The security establishment has pointed out the direct link between the channeling of funds and attacks perpetrated on the ground. The goal of today’s operation is to impede the terrorist organizations’ activities and reduce their financial capabilities on the ground; the operation is part of the

comprehensive US-led measures currently being carried out around the world against terrorist organizations.

I highlighted the above line for obvious reasons.

Today's Govt. Press Office announcement:

Quote[/b] ]OPERATION FOR THE CONFISCATION OF TERROR FUNDS

(Communicated by the GPO)

Thursday, 26 February, 2004

Yesterday morning, (Wednesday), 25.2.2004, IDF and Israeli police forces,

guided by ISA officers, carried out an operation for the confiscation of

terror funds ( www.israel-mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0ofd0 ), which

were deposited in the Arab Bank and in the Cairo-Amman Bank in Ramallah.

Information regarding these bank accounts was presented to the legal

elements of the ISA, IDF and the Attorney General's Office - all of whom

authorized the operation.

A person whose funds were confiscated will be able to appeal the decision.

Background information: funds that fuel terror

The terror HQs initiate and control terror activity by transferring large

money sums to the terrorists in the field. Many terrorists make a living

out of the perpetration of terror attacks. Terrorists interrogated by the

ISA relayed information regarding the funding they received for military

activity.

Ahmad Sari Housein

A Palestinian Islamic Jihad terrorist from Tulkarm, who perpetrated the

30.3.03 suicide bombing in Netanya, in which 32 people were wounded.

Housein was paid NIS 10,000 by the former head of the PIJ in Tulkarm for his

terrorist activity. He was informed by a Hezbollah official in Lebanon that

he would receive more funds only if he agrees to carry out further terror

attacks.

Wael Ghanam

Ghanam is a Tanzim terrorist from the Tulkarm refugee camp. He was in

contact with a Lebanese terrorist, from whom he received:

- $7,000 in order to manufacture explosive charges.

- $1,500 in order to purchase weapons. These funds were transferred to his

sister's bank account.

- $10,000 in order to fund his military activity.

Housein transferred these funds to bank accounts of women he was in contact

with.

Mountasar Abu Ghalyoun

One of the Tanzim commanders in Jenin who was involved in financing and

perpetrating a large number of terrorist attacks, including four shooting

attacks in which four civilians were killed. One of the attacks took place

in Yaabed, on 30.6.03 - one day after the beginning of the "Hudna."

In an announcement made after the attack, the Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades

stated that: "We have executed the killing.We reject and condemn the plots

against our issue.especially what is named the Hudna."

During his interrogation he stated that the minimum payment for the

perpetration of a terror attack is between NIS 3,000 to NIS 5,000. Abu

Ghalyoun's gave details of the cost of purchasing weapons:

- M-16 A2 - NIS 30,000

- M-16 A1 - NIS 20,000 - 24,000

- AK-47 - NIS 7,000-10,000

- A locally-made Sanobal rifle - NIS 5,000

- Handgun - NIS 6,500 - 8,000

- A bullet for an AK-47 - NIS 10.

- A bullet for a Sanobal gun or rifle - NIS 2.50

- M-16 bullet - NIS 2

- A stolen vehicle or a vehicle without licenses that can be used in a

terror attack - NIS 3,000 - 7,000 (depending on the type of vehicle.)

- A cellular phone chip for perpetrators - NIS 50.

The Goals of the Operation

* Disturbing the activity of terror organizations.

* Deterring terror organizations from using bank accounts as means for

transferring money.

* All this while preserving the stability of the banks by only dealing with

bank accounts being used for funding terror activity.

Types of Bank Accounts from which Funds were Confiscated:

Accounts of Institutes:

Associations that were outlawed, Palestinian Islamic Jihad and Hamas

associations in the PA territories.

Associations whose funds were confiscated during the operation:

The Charity Association in Jenin

The association is managed by Hamas elements. It was outlawed by Israel in

2002. The Director of the association was Jamal Abu Al Hija - a Hamas

terrorist who was arrested by Israel in 2002. Al Hija was an accomplice in

the 4.8.02 terrorist attack on a #361 Egged bus at Meron junction

( www.israel-mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0m640 ) in which nine people

were murdered and 52 were wounded.

The Al Aslah Association in El Bireh

The association is managed by senior Hamas terrorists. It was outlawed by I

srael in early 2002. The founder and director of the association was Jamal

Tawil, who was arrested in April 2002. Tawil recruited the suicide bombers

who perpetrated the 1.12.01 double suicide bombing

( www.israel-mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0kty0 ) on the Ben Yehuda St.

pedestrian mall in Jerusalem, in which 11 people were murdered and 188 were

wounded.

The Al Ansar Charity Association

The association is managed by Nafez A'araj, a former senior Palestinian

Islamic Jihad terrorist and currently a Hezbollah activist in Gaza. It was

outlawed by Israel in late 2003. The association, directed by Hezbollah,

transfers funds to families of suicide bombers and prisoners who are

connected to terror activity. A'araj transfers funds to activists in order

to perpetrate terrorist activities and arms smuggling.

Personal Bank Accounts From Which Funds Were Confiscated During The

Operation:

An account in the name of Naef Abu Sharh

A senior fugitive of the Tanzim infrastructure in Nablus who was behind the

following terrorist acts:

* The 19.6.02 suicide bombing

( www.israel-mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0lyv0 ) of a crowded bus stop

and hitchhiking post at the French Hill intersection in northern Jerusalem,

in which seven people were murdered and over 35 were wounded.

* The 5.1.03 double suicide bombing

( www.israel-mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0mxo0 ) on a pedestrian mall

in Tel Aviv's Neve Sha'anan neighborhood, adjacent to the old central bus

station, in which 23 people were murdered and approximately 120 were

wounded.

The account in the name of Yaman Faraj

A senior fugitive, the head of the PFLP's military infrastructure in Nablus,

who was involved in the direction and planning of terrorist attacks,

including the 25.12.03 suicide bombing at Geha junction, in which four

people were murdered and 21 were wounded.

The account in the name of Muhammad Abdin

Abdin is a Hebron moneychanger who directed a ramified infrastructure in

order to fund Hamas terrorism in the Gaza Strip. The sum of funds

transferred by Abdin stands at $1.6 million. This amount was transferred

over several months.

Family Accounts:

Families of terrorists, when the account is for terrorist activity.

The family account of Ala Al Abasi, a Hamas terrorist who is currently

incarcerated. His cell is responsible for several suicide bombings in

Israel. The funds were transferred to his account from Hamas due to his

terrorist activity and served his family. Al Abasi was directly involved in

perpetrating several of his cell's attacks:

* Attacks against gas tankers in Glilot and Rishon Letzion and against

trains in Lod and Yavneh.

* The 7.5.02 suicide bombing of a Rishon Letzion gaming club, in which 15

people were murdered and 55 were wounded.

* The 9.3.02 suicide bombing at the Caf? Moment in Jerusalem

( www.israel-mfa.gov.il/mfa/go.asp?MFAH0lb10 ), in which 11 people

were murdered and 58 were wounded.

Cry for the poor robbed Palestinians.

[denoir 0]

To confiscate funds you rob a bank?

So, let's say that the FBI discovers that some US militia is buying illegal firearms and that they are known to hold their money in a specific bank. Would it be ok then for the FBI to at gunpoint rob the bank in question? Would it be ok for them to steal the money of other people who happened to have money in the same bank?

The IDF didn't close the suspects' accounts - they broke into the vault and grabbed the cash.

Now, even if we for one second would ignore the legalities and moral objections of it, the fact remains that it was completely pointless (apart from getting IDF a couple of mil. in cash). Banks are insured against robberies and other nasty stuff. In effect the one to pay up will be some large global insurance company. The bank won't lose anything and the individual customers certainly won't lose a penny. So in effect Israel ripped off some insurance company.

[theavonlady 2]

To confiscate funds you rob a bank?  

So, let's say that the FBI discovers that some US militia is buying illegal firearms and that they are known to hold their money in a specific bank. Would it be ok then for the FBI to at gunpoint rob the bank in question? Would it be ok for them to steal the money of other people who happened to have money in the same bank?

Did the US state where the bank is located declare an armed war against the Federal government in Washington? Is this US State's policy to consistantly ignore prior requests to reign in the Militia, whose accounts are known way in advance to the FBI?

I don't think so.

Quote[/b] ]The IDF didn't close the suspects' accounts - they broke into the vault and grabbed the cash.

There's a clear list of accounts and balances that are effected. The banks want to play piggy bank for terrorists? Let them sort out the mess.

Quote[/b] ]Now, even if we for one second would ignore the legalities and moral objections of it

Hindering terrorist's financial sources is morally objectionable? Thanks. I had no idea.

Quote[/b] ]the fact remains that it was completely pointless (apart from getting IDF a couple of mil. in cash).

This is a lie. All of the money is retained by the bank of Israel. The exact amounts have been publicly noted.

Quote[/b] ]In effect the one to pay up will be some large global insurance company.

Tsk. Some policies are just not worth it. If they're publicly traded, their shareholders should raise a fuss about what kind of sleezy clientele they issue policies for.

Quote[/b] ]The bank won't lose anything and the individual customers certainly won't lose a penny. So in effect Israel ripped off some insurance company.

So you say. If there's any clause in the insurer's agreement that forbids these type of accounts from being insured, looks like the bank is out of luck - not the insurer.

[Bernadotte 0]

Cry for the poor robbed Palestinians.

On the contrary.  It is the thieves who I pity most.

[theavonlady 2]

Cry for the poor robbed Palestinians.

On the contrary.  It is the thieves who I pity most.

Ain't that a pity.

[Bernadotte 0]

If there's any clause in the insurer's agreement that forbids these type of accounts from being insured, looks like the bank is out of luck - not the insurer.

You're dreaming.  Let's just look at the first organisation on your list:

Some of the finds. In today's Jpost:

Quote[/b] ]"Charitable organizations" whose assets were confiscated include:

The Antser Association, established to assist the families of suicide bombers and prisoners incarcerated in Israel. The association, headed by Nafez Arji, a senior Hizbullah official and in the past a member of Islamic Jihad, was outlawed in October 2003.

Do you honestly believe that the insurance policy had a clause stating that funds held by organisations headed by individuals finding themselves on Israel's wanted list would not be insured?  But, then again you have no problem finding an Arab guilty until proven innocent, do you?

So what has Israel found his organisation guilty of?  Helping the families of suicide bombers find shelter after Israel has demolished their homes?  Very dangerous, indeed.  Do you really think you can sleep better now knowing that those family members have been pushed even closer to desperation?

[Bernadotte 0]

And speaking of your anti-Arab racism, I'll answer the question that you've ignored 3 times.

The biggest irony is that Mr. Hurndall what shot by an Arab. That's right. The IDF solider who is accused of shooting him is an Israeli Bedouin soldier.

why do you regard that as a great irony?  

The irony for you is rooted in your anti-Arab racism.  For you, all Arabs are the same.  In your eyes, this was merely some Arab shooting someone who was trying to help Arabs.  It matters little to you that the murderer was an IDF soldier or an Israeli.  He was not a Jew and, therefore, he doesn't matter to you.

And the main reason you ignored my question 3 times is that you think there is absolutely nothing wrong with your form of racism.  ...But you know better than to defend your personal bigotry in this forum.

Your turn.

[Bernadotte 0]

Quote[/b] ]The Goals of the Operation

* Disturbing the activity of terror organizations.

* Deterring terror organizations from using bank accounts as means for

transferring money.

* All this while preserving the stability of the banks by only dealing with bank accounts being used for funding terror activity.

Money does not sit in bank vaults with little labels attached showing who owns it.  Please tell us how the IDF was able to identify the owners of the funds that it removed from the vaults.  Or perhaps the Israeli government was simply lying about being able to take money out of just certain accounts.

[denoir 0]

The Muslims are no different. Oh look: Big Brother comes to Arab world. Our tolerance for cultural diversity extends to the point that they can make their own little version, but in the core these are products of the western culture being propagated through another culture, assimilating it. As a side note, I must say that I find it odd how often the cheapest worst elements of western culture are often adopted by other cultures. Have you seen Japanese TV?   I guess it has to do with a greater social segregation and when everybody is a consumer.. Oh well.

Didn't last too long:

Arab Big Brother show suspended

Quote[/b] ]

The Arabic satellite TV channel MBC has suspended its version of the reality TV show, Big Brother.

The series, which began on 22 February, caused a public outcry in Bahrain where it was being filmed.

On Friday 1,000 people protested against the show and a group of Bahraini MPs threatened to question the information minister on the issue. A spokeswoman for the station told BBC News Online that the show was unlikely to be put back on air.

"We don't want to be the cause of differences of opinion, so MBC decided to suspend production of the programme Big Brother from the kingdom of Bahrain," said an MBC statement.

It added that the decision had been made "so as not to expose the network to any accusations that it is offending the virtues and traditions of the Arab world". Following Friday's demonstration, several Bahraini women's groups protested against the show outside the information ministry on Saturday.

"I have watched the show and it must be stopped," said 34-year-old teacher Shahnaz Rabi'i, who helped organise the demonstration.

"Our religion has strong values which say boys and girls should not mix together," said Ms Rabi'i.

"This programme is a threat to Islam. This is entertainment for animals."

Segregated sleeping

The Arab version of Big Brother, which has been renamed Al-Ra'is (The Boss) in Arabic, put 12 housemates - six men and six women - from around the Arab world in a purpose-built house on Amwaj Island in Bahrain. For the first time since the show's inception, men and women were barred from each other's sleeping quarters.

There was also a prayer room, a separate women's lounge and a mixed-sex communal area. But these modifications to reflect Arabic customs did not go far enough for some protesters.

"It is normal for males and females to mix, but not to put them together in the same house for a long time," said 21-year-old student Maryam al-Sayrafi.

Dating game

The controversy over Big Brother came as another Arab reality TV show ended. Al Hawa Sawa - which means On Air Together - paraded eight women from across the Arab world before suitors in a luxury apartment for 24 hours a day.

The men could contact the woman of their choice to propose marriage. The show was criticised for being too liberal.

It ended on Monday when one of the last two contestants said she refused to get married.

[shinRaiden 0]

Cheap labor, great benefits

10 year old porter got handed a bag, told to carry across border. 7~10 kilos of explosive

If you can't go over or around, go under

One al-Aqsa leader in Gaza, who identified himself only as Abu Qusay, said that "this is a message to the Israelis that all their walls and fences cannot prevent us from infiltrating Israel and doing whatever we want."

Civilians = enemy combatents

"Now we say it clearly, hoping that you [Aznar] will understand it this time. We at the Abu Hafs Al-Masri Brigades are not sorry for the deaths of so-called civilians. Are they permitted to kill our children, our women, our elderly, and our youth in Afghanistan, Iraq, Palestine, and Kashmir, and we are forbidden from killing them? Allah, may he be praised, said: ' Whoever attacks you, attack him in the same way that he attacked you' [Qur'an 2:194].

(From Abu Hafs Al-Masri's claim of responsibility for Madrid)

[shinRaiden 0]

And in response the Israelis are cooking up something 'spectacular'. No surprise, considering everything hinges on the fence working, and the palestinians fighting it out amongst themselves.

Jpost frontpage

Tuesday's planned meeting between Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and PA Prime Minister Ahmed Qurei was postponed indefinitely because the government will not "negotiate as if there were no terror, and fight terror as if there were no negotiations," Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom said Monday.

Speaking at a Jerusalem press conference with visiting Croatian Foreign Minister Miomir Zuzul, Shalom said Israel has made clear to the PA and the international community that it won't tolerate a situation in which it "negotiates by night and buries its dead by day."

[SpecOp9 0]

I hear they "almost" got Usama Bin laden in Afghanistan.

Shame that they did not.

[shinRaiden 0]

Christian Palestinian, son of prominent Palestinian defense mistaken for Jewish settler, capped in drive-by. Fatah claimed responsibility. Father holds PA, Arafat blameless, saying "they have no control over the situation."

Whoopsie, wrong palestinian

[GoOB 0]

"Riots" in Stockholm today. Apparently some pro-Palestinian activists were rallying against yearly Israeli event being held by "Förenade Israelinsamlingen". A few shop windows were shattered and the windows of the Israeli tourist-beureu were also shattered. Also several of the activists were arrested for firing fireworks and throwing glass bottles at police officers.

http://www.dn.se/DNet....rType=6

(Linked to Swedish site in lack of good English source)

Really a quite idiotic way to try and gain sympathy for Palestine, why can't people learn to be civil?

[EiZei 0]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3556099.stm

Quote[/b] ]

Hamas chief killed in air strike

The leader of the Palestinian militant group Hamas, Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, has been killed in an Israeli air strike.

Reports from Gaza say Yassin was being pushed in his wheelchair when he was directly hit by an Israeli missile.

Thousands of Palestinians have taken to the streets in protest, after mosques announced his death over loudspeakers.

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon is said to have personally authorised the attack on Yassin, whose group has killed hundreds of Israelis.

Local residents said Yassin was targeted by helicopter gunships as he left a mosque near his house in Gaza City at daybreak.

Two bodyguards were among four people killed, while at least 15 people were wounded.

Good riddance I say.

[lee_h._oswald 0]

The terror will now rise "oversize".

MfG Lee

[Longinius 1]

In the case of the riot in Sweden, the people attacking the police most likely cared very little about Palestinians. Or Israelis for that matter. They were probably what we'd like to call "proffesional rioters". Aparently many of the demonstrators left the scene when these guys started taring the place a part.

They also threw acid at the police, K9's and horses. Hope they "tripped" on the way to the police car. Pricks.

[miles teg 1]

I agree...that Sheikh should have been assassinated a long time ago. He is the root of alot of the blasphemous and twisted Islamic militant beliefs that is so popular in the Palistinian territories.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[Bernadotte 0]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3556099.stm

Quote[/b] ]

Hamas chief killed in air strike

The leader of the Palestinian militant group Hamas, Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, has been killed in an Israeli air strike.

Reports from Gaza say Yassin was being pushed in his wheelchair when he was directly hit by an Israeli missile.

Thousands of Palestinians have taken to the streets in protest, after mosques announced his death over loudspeakers.

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon is said to have personally authorised the attack on Yassin, whose group has killed hundreds of Israelis.

Local residents said Yassin was targeted by helicopter gunships as he left a mosque near his house in Gaza City at daybreak.

Two bodyguards were among four people killed, while at least 15 people were wounded.

Good riddance I say.

Good riddance?  What exactly has Israel rid itself of besides an old man in a wheelchair?

Do you honestly believe that Hamas will be weakened or discouraged by his death?

Let's be honest!  Killing (instead of aprehending) this terrorist leader may score high on feel good factor, however it will almost certainly escalate the conflict and lead to the loss of additional innocent Israeli lives.

Also from your BBC link:

Quote[/b] ]He was targeted as he returned from a mosque in Gaza City at daybreak. Seven others were killed and many wounded.

...

UK Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said the killing of an elderly man in a wheelchair was "unjustified" and "very unlikely to achieve its objective".

France also condemned the assassination, and European Union foreign policy chief Javier Solana said it was "very, very bad news" for the Middle East peace process.

[Colossus 2]

OMG! This is gone be bloody.

Now they just made it worst.

Well done Sharon

[EiZei 0]

Good riddance?  What exactly has Israel rid itself of besides an old man in a wheelchair?

Do you honestly believe that Hamas will be weakened or discouraged by his death?

True, overall it might have been better off not to kill him directly, but lets just say I dont feel very sorry for the guy.

[Postduifje 0]

This might not be the most friendliest guy to human life around, but politically seeing this was a very bad move from the Israelian gouvernment, maybe the worst possible...

[denoir 0]

While I don't feel sorry for him getting whacked, I must say that I'm surprised the way they did it. An air strike? It's begging for retaliation. Why not let Mossad quietly assasinate him? Let him die in his sleep or something like that..

Obviously they wanted to make a publicity stunt out of it, but I don't understand what they have to gain by it. Perhaps Sharon can score some domestic popularity scores. Still, it seems like its an awful risk...