World Car of the Year 2005

[brgnorway 0]

............ no one other than a complete git drives a Cayenne, IRL morons that think their shit doesn't stink are really attracted to them.

The Lebaron is a fun _cheeap_ car for modifications, the Cayenne is well, a pice of german crap for people who know dick all about driving well.  

I wholeheartedly agree with you! A Cayenne is even worse than the room for golf clubs in a Ferrari!

[bn880 5]

Quote[/b] ]Well the thing is, it doesn't work too well as it's difficult to control on the edge, like i said.

Sorry mate - without having driven it myself I can tell you from what I've read in Car, Top Gear Magazine and Evo that the car handles fantastically well and that is even before the 4wd has been released! Many think the same as you do - but they are actually wrong! The 911 is a different beast after they changed the suspension which used to be - in combination with an engine at the back -particularly dangerous on the edge. That used to be the case all untill the end of the eighties. Come on mate, that's fifteen years ago! And before anyone else starts - do most of you honestly believe a midengined sportscar such as the former F360 or it's replacement the L430 is so much easier to handle.

Quote[/b] ]Sure the 993 is winning in NGT, although the NGT class is basically made of Porsches... how about something more serious like the GT class mate.

They used to comptete in the GT class against the likes of Mercedes and McLaren with the GT1 and was highly successful.

You did know that the 911 competes against the 360 right? Another factor why the 911 is commonly used is because they mainly compeete against other teams - not cars - and that everybody want's the reliability of the 911. That is why the grid is full of 911's. Did you watch the last 4 years of Paris Dakar? Same reason why everybody in the motorcycle class use KTM!

And the 993 was a 911 model that was launched in the early 90's. Todays new version is called 997.

As for the AM DB9 mentioned here some posts ago - it's a bloody Ford, although a good one. The depressing part of it is that it lacks high speed stability. How's that for a Grand Tourer supposed to thunder along to the riviera? And before you start moaning - yes I saw Jeremy Jackson driving it Monaco beating the train. The man is an idiot and have destroyed a very good programe which used to have excellent reporter such as Tiff Needel, Becky, Quentin Wilson etc. Instead we now have a talkshow with MJ and his idiot dwarf friend "oh look at me I used to be soooo coooool in the eighties and I'm still wearing my cowboy boots" . James May saves the day though.

Phew!

By the way, I still don't see the reason for buying any of the above mentioned cars when you can have a terrific Lotus Elise/Exige or a Caterham Seven.

Well maybe the newest ones, who knows.

Anyway, yes, most people are usually wrong

By the way, USED to is USED to. The Viper USED to as well, now it's history basically.

[bn880 5]

............ no one other than a complete git drives a Cayenne, IRL morons that think their shit doesn't stink are really attracted to them.

The Lebaron is a fun _cheeap_ car for modifications, the Cayenne is well, a pice of german crap for people who know dick all about driving well.

I wholeheartedly agree with you! A Cayenne is even worse than the room for golf clubs in a Ferrari!

Thank you, but I still can't agree that the porsches are pretty. heh

[brgnorway 0]

Thank you, but I still can't agree that the porsches are pretty.    heh

I see what you mean but I don't nessecarily like what's "pretty" or beautyful. I prefer originality, such as Citroen DS and 2CV, Fiat 500, the beetle, 911, Renault Alpine A110 and the 4, Fiat Multipla, Triumph TR2 etc.

I'm sure you'd like the sixties models of 911 which is much leaner and without large bumpers etc.

[bn880 5]

Well, to be honest I really like originality, just not the one on the Porsche. I don't know, that car just looks like a noisy and uncontrollable death trap to me still. What can I say, I just don't like the shape.

Personally I do think Ferrari lately went the wrong way with styling also, but still I prefer the looks to Porsches.

I know, the Porsche is a car that grows on you, but for that to happen it would have to be a pleasure to drive on the edge.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Seriously, it makes the impression both of you talk like that because of prejudice. Show me some articles that say the Cayenne doesnt perform well onroad and offroad! If you see it on the road it is a damn beautiful car and if you say you dont like ordinary... well then I may ask the question..well is the cayenne an ordinary car? It was the first car that was able to bring off and onroad together...you talk about it as if it is a totally useless car.. that is an absolutely unobjective statement.

[brgnorway 0]

Quote[/b] ]Seriously, it makes the impression both of you talk like that because of prejudice.

Let me tell you if you didn't notice Albert, I like Porsche - well, the 911 at least (maybe even the old 928/S/S4GT) .

And I don't like SUVs at all so you are right about the prejudice. It's a silly statement thing: they are heavy, ugly designs because of a "boxy" design, they are ineffective because you could do the same with an ordinary 4wd car. They slurp gas, they take up space and are extremely dangerous for both people and other cars.

Quote[/b] ]Show me some articles that say the Cayenne doesnt perform well onroad and offroad!

The Cayenne only impresses by the numbers; it's power etc.

If you compare it with other cars in it's segment such as the BMW X5 and the Range Rover it easily beats both. Strangely enough its closest sibling the VolksWagen Tuareg looks so much better. Nevertheless, the Cayenne isn't an offroad car and in case you wondered the Range Rover is the only car in that segment to successfully claim exactly that!

Quote[/b] ]If you see it on the road it is a damn beautiful car and if you say you dont like ordinary...

It leaves no impression at all except for being a Porsche (unfortunately) . And that is what the fat rich fuckers that buy this kind of car looks for. They don't care for enthusiast cars or real sportscars (911) . I personaly hate the idea of Porsche making the Cayenne just as much as I hate the idea of Lotus making a premium saloon car. It's just silly!

Quote[/b] ]well then I may ask the question..well is the cayenne an ordinary car?

There's nothing extraordinary about the Cayenne except for the numbers - and it doesn't even work very well off road!

Quote[/b] ] It was the first car that was able to bring off and onroad together...

The hell it was, the Range Rover did combine luxury and offroad capabilities even back as far as the seventies.

Then came the Jeep Cherokee etc.

The Cayenne is a disgrace - and history will judge it as silly and not a "real" Porsche - even less so than the 924 who was nothing else than an Audi with a Porsche badge (including 944 but that one did at least perform) .

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

The question remains.. show me indicators why the Cayenne ( / Turbo) performs worse than the X5 or Range Rover! The X5 doesnt perform as well on and offroad and the Range Rover has zero to no advantages onroad. You better start looking for test results otherwise your statement "for rich fuckers" disqualifies you from any objective approach. Especially since the Range Rover isnt much cheaper / and depending on the version can actually be more expensive (in case havent noticed yet). And better search well cause you need to proof that it is " a disgrace".

"...Rather, the Cayenne drives more like a BMW X5 4.4i equipped with a sport package – on the highway, in the city, and on twisty two lane roads. But the Porsche’s optional air suspension and active shock absorbers do a better job of smoothing the scarred pavement in most city environments, offering Comfort, Normal and Sport modes.

offroad, the Porsche also shines brighter than the X5, approaching Land Rover Range Rover levels of capability. With low range gearing, a locking differential, a hill descent control system, and Porsche Traction Management doling out power between the front and rear axles, the Porsche Cayenne proved unstoppable when faced with difficult terrain in California’s Cleveland National Forest. Normally, the torque split between the front and rear wheels is 38/62, but as much as 100 percent of engine power can be diverted to one axle or the other as conditions warrant. With the optional air suspension, ground clearance measures 10.75 inches and water-fording depth is 21.85 inches."

"...Even more surprising, then, was the Cayenne's performance off-road. Having raised the suspension to the highest available ride height (273mm) and set off to test the 2.7:1 low range transmission ratio and lockable differentials on a carefully constructed but vertiginous hillside course, colleagues more experienced than I in the black arts of mud plugging pronounced the Cayenne the equal of the Volkswagen Touareg (with which it shares its basic underpinnings) and better than just about anything this side of the new Range Rover. All were particularly impressed by the transmission's Hill Holder feature, which automatically prevents the machine from rolling backwards on gradients of up to 100 per cent.

So what do we have? A supremely capable, comfortable and entertaining yet visually understated, prestige vehicle that makes its sibling VW and even the much-praised BMW X5 look clumsy on the road while being almost a match for the peerless Range Rover on the rough stuff."

You might have a look at the software-hardware inventions Porsche has put into it! Oh and before I forget.. the turbo actually has less consumption than the X5!

[bn880 5]

The Cayenne performs a lot worse than many cars out there for half the price... not only that but that pice of crap blocks my view if it ever gets in-front of me (traffic). It more often kills people in accidents as it doesn't hit squeare on with actual car crumple zones and bumbers(too high), and it will flip just as easily as any SUV under evasive/hard manouvers...

What's so good about another SUV? That it's a Porsche? Laughable, that thing shouldn't even exist. And yes it's stereotyping about the gits, and a good one at that. Tell me Albert, you don't seem like a rich snotty git, do you have one? Well I know some that do...

Face it, the Cayenne is not driven off road and in war zones, it's driven on nice roads in traffic, so it loses to just about any powerful car, and especially AWD one in many ways.

[denoir 0]

The Cayenne is a disgrace - and history will judge it as silly and not a "real" Porsche - even less so than the 924 who was nothing else than an Audi with a Porsche badge (including 944 but that one did at least perform) .

Amen to that.

Personally, I've never been fond of the 911 design. There are however some nice ones.

The Carrera GT is not bad:

I'm not too much a BMW fan either, but there are exceptions - the BMW-Z8 with its über-pornographic retro interior is one such exception:

[ig]http://www.talking-dog.com/photos/photo_library/Cars/Stanford%20Car%20Show%20-%202000/BMW%20Z8%20(interior).jpg[/img]>100kb

[brgnorway 0]

Quote[/b] ]The question remains.. show me indicators why the Cayenne ( / Turbo) performs worse than the X5 or Range Rover!

Well, I buy Evo, Car and Top Gear magazine every month. I've read all the issues the last years and thus can inform a judgement from that! And you'r right about the on road stuff, it does outperform the X5 and the Range Rover. It doesn't do so with the Range Rover in the rough. I'm not talking about a "fire Road" somewhere in California. I'm talking about the real stuff - places where Land Rovers usually go to work. You'd be surprised to see how capable the Range Rover is in the rough. The only real advantage the fantastic Land Rover Derfender has is its (much) lighter weight! The Cayennes biggest problem is it's road bias and its tires who are designed to endure absurd speeds but leaves you wanting in the mud.

The basic problem when you try to design a car that can do both things well (on/offroad) is that you end up with a car that doesn't really excell at anything! The Cayennes high center of gravity denies it the sports car performance and credibility and it also weighs in at two tons. That is also Porsches problem with the Cayenne imagewise, it appeals to the rich people already owning an exotic car but at the same time wants a family car of the exotic kind. I'm certian of the fact that it beats both its most serious contenders on road, but I'm not tempted by any of them (if I could afford it) .

Quote[/b] ]"for rich fuckers" disqualifies you from any objective approach

I don't care - it's my opinion! I've always been a car enthusiast! I love motoring and I'm very disappointed by Porsche and I have every right to be! And many of us feel this way! Just wait, in a few years you'll see lot's of Cayennes on the second hand market and the prices will be ridicolously cheap whereas the 911 second hand value will still be high! I don't try to be objective when it comes to cars, wine and whisky simply because they are phenomenons of affection and love.

Quote[/b] ]Especially since the Range Rover isnt much cheaper / and depending on the version can actually be more expensive (in case havent noticed yet)

LOL - then you should come to where I live and see the price difference!

AND, if I was desperately in the need for a powerful 4wd with zero steering feel I'd go for a Volvo XC or an Audi Allroad. They simply make more sense!

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

the cayenne currently gets a facelift and some modifications and we be released 2006. The sales figures are up to expectations. Well maybe it doesnt make much sense to buy a Cayenne, I agree with that, but that does NOT disqualify it as a bad car. I dont read car magazines, I enjoy driving them . I was offered to try a cayenne (not S not turbo) onroad but I refused since I was scared to cause damage to it.

I usually prefer small cars rather than SUVs and large limos but you got to stay focused on facts.

[bn880 5]

WE are focused on facts, fact is, that thing is a bad idea.

[walker 0]

Hi all

World Car of year should be this one

The sooner all cars are like this the better.

Kind Regards Walker

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

well once you do that you will have an unemployment rate of 45% in germany! So walker=Rumsfeld!

[bn880 5]

Albert, you might as well go here and click on "Watch the AD"

http://www.esuvee.com/flash.html

It might ring a bell with this cayenne talk.

[Gordy 0]

Wanna offroad buy a Discovery wanna Porsche buy 911.

Simple as that.

[Dauragon 0]

personaly hjere in switzerland, you go to a nice luxury place in the mountains like Verbier or Crans Montana you can see 1000 Porsche Cayenne Turbo other dozens of Touareg and a couple thousands of X5, these cars are so popular that driving one is normal at those place, but they are very usefull for transporting all the ski stuff with the family, most swiss family has a house near the lake and a house in the mountains called "Chalet" in french, and i'd definatly choose a Porsche Cayenne Turbo for these kind of winter trip

[bn880 5]

Yeah but at least that's fora purpose, which is the transportation of ski equipment in the mountains etc. Not to mention those are rich gits. and that's not even a joke...

[Dauragon 0]

Yeah but at least that's fora purpose, which is the transportation of ski equipment in the mountains etc.  Not to mention those are rich gits.     and that's not even a joke...

yes extremely rich, but they come from allover europe aswell, we can see all the GB plates on the land rovers and the yellow NL plate with weird numbersd like 69 on BMW's

but the restaurants up there are like 5* the price of a restaurant in a nice city :S

[crashdome 3]

Bah....

This,

http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordgt/

a few of these

http://www.daytona-coupe.com/photographs/photo_026.jpg

and maybe one of these to actually use daily:

http://www.unicycling.org/

are all you'll ever need  

EDIT: OK..ok for those with wives/children: http://www.yican.com.au/1935/images/rickshaw.jpg

[brgnorway 0]

There are so many great cars out there. I for one however have started to develop a liking for smaller more efficient cars - which can also be fun to drive!

The Fiat 500 was also available in an Abarth version made for rallies:

........and here's the modern version - soon (hopefully) to be put into production. If ever a car could be an Ipod then this would be it:

Cheers!

Christian

[theavonlady 2]

EDIT: OK..ok for those with wives/children: http://www.yican.com.au/1935/images/rickshaw.jpg

Hey, if hubby does the hauling, what the heck!

/avon dusts off rider's cane

[crashdome 3]

Hey, if hubby does the hauling, what the heck!

/avon dusts off rider's cane

lol

[Necromancer- 0]

Hi all

World Car of year should be this one

"]http://www.saundersonsecurity.co.uk/awc.jpg[/img]

The sooner all cars are like this the better.

Kind Regards Walker

Buy 4 of them... so the cops can't put one on your car. ;)

I live in Amsterdam.. a city where many European tourists get the infamous wheel clamp every now and then..

A friend of mine has a Jeep with huge wheels and forgot buy buy a parking ticket. A cop came by and tried to put a wheel clamp on it.. no luck as the wheels are too big.

Instead he put a 40 euro fine between the windshield wipers.. Normally he would get a 80 euro fine to get that wheel clamp removed.