USA Politics Thread - *No gun debate*

[miles teg 1]

Yeah I agree, although students or anyone speaking out against the ruling council of clerics still occasionally disappear and are still tortured for speaking out too strongly. It doesn't happen quite as often as it used to, but it still happens. They are also still doing crazy things like banning the Zorastrian holiday of Chehar Shanbeh Suri... a celebration that has been going on for millenia in Persia.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[Akira 0]

Errr....I'm confused.

Why will not accept people's educated word that Israel has nukes, but you will accept the word of an administration that has lied to you a number of times already that everyone in Guantanamo and other prisons are all "terrorists?"

[SFWanabe 0]

2-->

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wow_o.gif[/img]2)]Reforms??? What Reforms?? In case you haven't checked it looks like Hardliners will likely win the Iranian election and if they do, it is widely expected that they will roll back most of the reforms made over the past few years and return to a much more anti-Western and especially anti-American political stance. Also it should be said, that what reforms they made were pretty mediocre and some were only on paper (like the ban on torture). I was born in Iran and I have Iranian friends so I know what still goes on there.

Also reforms don't mean jack when you have even moderate Iranian leaders talking about destroying Israel.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

Havent you heard about the election? It doesnt matter if it rigged or not the USA wont invade while they're putting on that show. It would be bad form and even Bush isnt stupid enough to go against world opinion again. Also I really dont care if israel is destroyed because I dont live there.

[SFWanabe 0]

Errr....I'm confused.

Why will not accept people's educated word that Israel has nukes, but you will accept the word of an administration that has lied to you a number of times already that everyone in Guantanamo and other prisons are all "terrorists?"

No one knows for sure if the adminstration as lied.

[Grim_Fandango 0]

Yeah I agree, although students or anyone speaking out against the ruling council of clerics still occasionally disappear and are still tortured for speaking out too strongly.   It doesn't happen quite as often as it used to, but it still happens.  They are also still doing crazy things like banning the Zorastrian holiday of Chehar Shanbeh Suri... a celebration that has been going on for millenia in Persia.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

Yep, I wouldn't want to live in Iran, and you're preaching to the choir when it comes to their appalling human rights record.

However I'm encouraged by the students "showing their teeth" at the regime, and I really hope that noone really meddle with that progress. If the US starts to stand with the students, they'll lose their momentum, because, like in Iraq, just because the citizens dislike their leaders, it doesn't mean that they don't dislike the US just as much.

I don't know, I can understand the wish to rush Iran on reforms, but at the same time the only real way to do that is to bomb the crap out of the place and replace the leaders with your own as it happened in Iraq, and nobody there appreciates anyone collaborating with the people who dropped bombs on their houses and shot them up at checkpoints for "looking suspicious".

I don't like watching countries torturing and oppressing their citizens, it disgusts me, but I think I'd be even more disgusted by someone either shutting down the progress in Iran further, or causing massive bloodshed to end the regime.

Call me a blue-eyed grassroot (in fact, let me spare you the trouble); I am a blue-eyed grassroot, but it is my oppinion that I would never put a gun to a little kids head and pull the trigger, if it meant liberating a country of it's tyrants. I don't think his or her life is worth ending for that.

That's essentially what you do when you push the button for war, you pull thousands of triggers on thousands of kids, innocent women, innocent men. Don't tell me any of you would have the balls if you had to look them in the eye before you did it.

Quote[/b] ]No one knows for sure if the adminstration as lied.

Tell that to all the unsuspecting US citizens that have been sent to Guantanamo or in "best case" to prison indefinetely on "suspicion" of terrorism, which could just as well be caused by a typo as by some real fact.

The policy of suspending the justice system to get at a subversive movement basicly guarantees that you will hit a lot of innocent people. It's simply not avoidable with a policy like that.

Quit letting your oppinions get the better of your judgement mate.

[walker 0]

Hi all

The US economy under TBA continues to decline with it's rising debt now giving China real power over the US economy.

In its latest move China is set to take over a major US oil firm UNOCAL.

Congress has decided to go for bury your head in the sand protectionism rather than a Recall Vote on George Bush Junior and his running mate Dodgy Dick Cheyney.

Quote[/b] ]China's Oil Bid Riles Congress

Attempt to Take Over U.S. Firm Spurs Calls for Retaliation

By Jonathan Weisman and Peter S. Goodman

Washington Post Staff Writers

Friday, June 24, 2005; Page A01

Political fears of China's economic might intensified yesterday following China's unsolicited bid to take over a U.S. oil company, with lawmakers from both political parties warning that Congress will take retaliatory action against Chinese trade practices if the Bush administration fails to respond.

Under a barrage of questions, Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan and Treasury Secretary John W. Snow warned the Senate Finance Committee against punitive legislation that could trigger a trade war and ultimately harm the U.S. economy...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn....r=email

The plain fact is that TBA have been placing the USA's economic Nads in China's hands for the past four and a half years; getting more and more in Debt to China's banks.

This incedent is the first sign of China putting the squeeze on and in reality all the USA will be able to do is "squeal little piggy"

Quote[/b] ]More broadly, CNOOC's bid for Unocal reinforced the mission of China's largest and best-financed state companies to look beyond domestic confines and invest abroad in what has become known as Beijing's "Go Out Strategy." CNOOC's move came days after a consortium led by China's largest home-appliance maker, Haier Group, launched a pursuit of Maytag Corp., hoping to secure one of America's most recognizable household brands.

Ibid

China's econmic power is incedentaly enriched by the interest payments the USA will have to pay for decades on the loans it owes them. TBA are the people who took out those loans.

Quote[/b] ]Financial war is a form of nonmilitary warfare which is just as terribly destructive as bloody war, but in which no blood is actually shed...when people revise the history books...the section on financial warfare will command the reader's utmost attention."

-Unrestricted War: China's Master Plan to Destroy America, People's Liberation Army, Colonels Liang & Xiangsui

A few months ago in my report "China and the Final War for Resources" I pointed out that the Government of China realizes that in order for their country to grow and survive in the years ahead, they must secure resources, primarily oil supplies. They also view the United States as a major hindrance to this objective, not only because the U.S. is the world's biggest consumer of oil but the U.S. government itself is viewed as being unpredictable, aggressive, and warlike as far as the Chinese leaders are concerned.

To win this war, the hard line doctrine taken from the treatise "Unrestricted War: China's Master Plan to Destroy America" instructs that currency revaluation or devaluation is a primary weapon which when initiated, will create financial turbulence and economic crisis within the U.S. and thus give the Chinese the opportunity to advance their own version of national security.

In analyzing the precarious predicament that has $1.94 trillion U.S. Treasury debt owned by foreign banks, most notably China, the overloaded U. S. debt burden is already teetering on a fine line. Any hint of a problem in maintaining support of U.S. bonds would create an instantaneous meltdown of the greenback with a simultaneous surge in the price of gold...

http://news.goldseek.com/OnlineInvestorsNews/1118949922.php

I for one have been warning those in the USA that TBA was an economic disaster for the States.

In reality America could not survive an economic trade war with China it owes them too much money. China will just pull the rug out from under them and the US will decend so rapidly it would make the 1929 stock crash look like a bull run on the markets. The resulting depression might not end for many decades and in fact the US may never recover.

Sadly Walker

[SFWanabe 0]

Quote[/b] ]Tell that to all the unsuspecting US citizens that have been sent to Guantanamo or in "best case" to prison indefinetely on "suspicion" of terrorism, which could just as well be caused by a typo as by some real fact.

The policy of suspending the justice system to get at a subversive movement basicly guarantees that you will hit a lot of innocent people. It's simply not avoidable with a policy like that.

Quit letting your oppinions get the better of your judgement mate.

If you say so.......

[Akira 0]

Quote[/b] ]No one knows for sure if the adminstration as lied.

They said there were Weapons of Mass Destruction.

Quote[/b] ]"We know where [iraq's WMD] are. They're in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south, and north somewhat." -- Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, March 30, 2003, in statements to the press.

Quote[/b] ]"Our conservative estimate is that Iraq today has a stockpile of between 100 and 500 tons of chemical weapons agent. That is enough to fill 16,000 battlefield rockets." -- Secretary of State Colin Powell, Feb. 5 2003, in remarks to the UN Security Council.

They said they were trying to get uranium rods from Niger.

Quote[/b] ] "The evidence indicates that Iraq is reconstituting its nuclear weapons program ... Iraq has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes and other equipment needed for gas centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium for nuclear weapons." -- President Bush, Oct. 7, 2002, in Cincinnati.

Quote[/b] ] "The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa." -- President Bush, Jan.28, 2003, in the State of the Union address.

We were told, or at the very least implied, that Saddam had terror connections, and was ready to use those connection against the US and its allies.

Quote[/b] ]"[The CIA possesses] solid reporting of senior-level contacts between Iraq and al-Qaeda going back a decade." -- CIA Director George Tenet in a written statement released Oct. 7, 2002 and echoed in that evening's speech by President Bush.

Quote[/b] ] "We've learned that Iraq has trained al-Qaeda members in bomb-making and poisons and deadly gases ... Alliance with terrorists could allow the Iraqi regime to attack America without leaving any fingerprints." -- President Bush, Oct. 7.

We were told that Iraq possessed these WMDs and had various means to launch them against the US and its allies. Remember the "could launch in 45 minutes" claim?

Quote[/b] ]"We have also discovered through intelligence that Iraq has a growing fleet of manned and unmanned aerial vehicles that could be used to disperse chemical or biological weapons across broad areas. We are concerned that Iraq is exploring ways of using these UAVs [unmanned aerial vehicles] for missions targeting the United States." -- President Bush, Oct. 7.

At the very least it was a display of extreme gross negligence. At the worst it was an outright lie to send this nation to war. The outcome is 1500+ US soldiers dead, unknown thousands of Iraqi's dead, and the complete destabilization of the region.

And you are telling me we can take this administrations word that everyone in the prison system are "terrorists" or Bush's favorite tag line, "enemy combatant"? Are you sure there's no torture or abuse? It's well beyond "stress positions" I assure you. Abu Gharib is not an anamoly, it's a well documented norm.

So what has this administration done to advance "democracy" and "freedom" and "christian values"? What has this administation possibly done to deserve public support? Even some hardliners and fellow Republicans are starting to stand up and take notice, more for the fact their constiuents are than any real concern for Iraq or US image around the world.

So how exactly does the Bush administration warrant any credability or deserve to be taken at face value?

[Sophion-Black 0]

Being in CAP is not the same as being in the USAF. So please dont pretend to be what your not. Plus your 16 years old,thats not even old enough to be in the USAF. I rest my case.

Lets break down' what the title:

Quote[/b] ]United States Air Force Auxillary - Civil Air Patroll

United States Air Force

-look USAF

Auxilary

-suplimentary; reserve in case of need. which is more than just annual.

Civil Air Patroll

-group called in case of emergency, and couter-drug operations. We, and i know you were also, are trained not forfun, we are a unit that is depended on by the goverment to do SAR missions.

Were do you think you got your BDUs? does the term issue mean anything to you. were do you get you blues? look at the return adress its an AFB! WOW! now why would the USAF send THIER unifor to something that is not an any relation to the USAF. You have the oppurtunity to attand USAF academies, think about that. Even your advancement in grade gets you higher in the USAF. you whant to know why? BECAUSE IT IS THE USAF YOU DUMBASS!!!

It suprises me that someone that was in the CAP didn't realize that they were IN the USAF. did you not get inspections from the USAF? WOW! even there you being checked as an acual unit. THINK!!! Did you not see what was on the wing of CAP aircraft? take alook at the left wing. Did you forget the operations we do? LOOK!!! THINK!!!

I rest my case

[Sophion-Black 0]

the fact that you might choose to follow idiotic orders only makes you even more of an idiot for not seeing them for what they are.

I don't have to follow them if they break the geneva convention

[Sophion-Black 0]

Quote[/b] ]If the United Nations invaded America to remove President Bush what would you do?

i would do nothing but celibrate a huge victory. you see the UN meets in NEW YORY CITY! if they all of a sudden decided to attack, we would already have major diplomats held a POWs. also, the UN is not really stron if you look up and down the lines, if we had russian and chinese support (or if they just become nuetral in the war) we would have one hell of a turkey shoot

Quote[/b] ]Would you fight both the United Nations occupiers and the liberal traitors who supported the occupiers?

i wouldn't have to do anything. the liberals would be dead by the time they try to leave the US.

Quote[/b] ]What if the U.N. occupiers and these liberals said that all traces of Christianity and mentioning of "God" had to be removed from all US and state laws?

there would already be war, but then it would turn into guerrilla warfare

Quote[/b] ]What if the U.N. occupiers decided to make Catholics and atheists the majority in our new government...

and how would they do that?

Quote[/b] ]Are you a Christian? Would you believe that your Christian faith was under attack? Would you fight for your religion?

whats up with relegion poping out of the woodwork? I would fight because my country is under attack.

[SFWanabe 0]

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wow_o.gif[/img])]Being in CAP is not the same as being in the USAF. So please dont pretend to be what your not. Plus your 16 years old,thats not even old enough to be in the USAF. I rest my case.

Lets break down' what the title:

Quote[/b] ]United States Air Force Auxillary - Civil Air Patroll

United States Air Force

-look USAF <!--emo&

Auxilary

-suplimentary; reserve in case of need. which is more than just annual.

Civil Air Patroll

-group called in case of emergency, and couter-drug operations. We, and i know you were also, are trained not forfun, we are a unit that is depended on by the goverment to do SAR missions.

Were do you think you got your BDUs? does the term issue mean anything to you. were do you get you blues? look at the return adress its an AFB! WOW! now why would the USAF send THIER unifor to something that is not an any relation to the USAF. You have the oppurtunity to attand USAF academies, think about that. Even your advancement in grade gets you higher in the USAF. you whant to know why? BECAUSE IT IS THE USAF YOU DUMBASS!!!

It suprises me that someone that was in the CAP didn't realize that they were IN the USAF. did you not get inspections from the USAF? WOW! even there you being checked as an acual unit. THINK!!! Did you not see what was on the wing of CAP aircraft? take alook at the left wing. Did you forget the operations we do? LOOK!!! THINK!!!

I rest my case

I havent seen CAP serving in Iraq or Afganistan. So what if its USAF Aux. that doesnt mean jack and that doesnt mean your apart of the real USAF.Also they wouldnt send a 16 year old kid on a counter-drug op and CAP rarely ever does actual SAR missions. Thats left mostly to local fire department and police. Thats like me saying that just because I was in AFJROTC that I'm apart of the USAF. Also I was issued BDUs and uniform in AFJROTC that doesnt mean I was apart of the USAF ether. My shit had a USAF return address too.

[ralphwiggum 6]

BECAUSE IT IS THE USAF YOU DUMBASS!!!  

watch your words. flaming will result in post restrictions.

[Sophion-Black 0]

Quote[/b] ]I havent seen CAP serving in Iraq or Afganistan

Oh... I forgot to mention, National Security as one. that would keep us in the US.

Quote[/b] ]So what if its USAF Aux. that doesnt mean jack and that doesnt mean your apart of the real USAF

so what are you saying here... were just the auxilary?

Quote[/b] ]CAP rarely ever does actual SAR missions

thats irrelivant. we still do SAR missions even if its just one, we do it.

[miles teg 1]

Quote[/b] ]If the United Nations invaded America to remove President Bush what would you do?

i would do nothing but celibrate a huge victory. you see the UN meets in NEW YORY CITY! if they all of a sudden decided to attack, we would already have major diplomats held a POWs. also, the UN is not really stron if you look up and down the lines, if we had russian and chinese support (or if they just become nuetral in the war) we would have one hell of a turkey shoot    

Quote[/b] ]Would you fight both the United Nations occupiers and the liberal traitors who supported the occupiers?

i wouldn't have to do anything. the liberals would be dead by the time they try to leave the US.

Quote[/b] ]What if the U.N. occupiers and these liberals said that all traces of Christianity and mentioning of "God" had to be removed from all US and state laws?

there would already be war, but then it would turn into guerrilla warfare  

Quote[/b] ]What if the U.N. occupiers decided to make Catholics and atheists the majority in our new government...

and how would they do that?

Quote[/b] ]Are you a Christian?  Would you believe that your Christian faith was under attack?  Would you fight for your religion?

whats up with relegion poping out of the woodwork? I would fight because my country is under attack.

Dude....you completely missed the point I was making.  I was not saying that the UN is going to invade the US.  I was giving a hypothetical scenario that is similar to what Iraqis are facing, except taking place in the United States so that hopefully you would get some understanding of what it it might be like for a typical Iraqi militant fighting against the United States and how that militant might feel.  

That's why I was making that scenario, but it kinda went right over your head.

However you did answer one question when you said it would become a guerilla war.... exactly what we see in Iraq.

I'm throwing religion in there, because thats a huge part of whats going on in Iraq...the perception that Iraqi government will keep religion out of Iraq and out of their legal system as long as the US pulls the strings.

Its not totally unlike the efforts of Christian fundamentalists in the US to keep their brand of Christianity in our legal system and public policies at all levels of government and against the will of those who do not share their Christian beliefs.

The only difference is that in Iraq the Islamic fundamentalists are even more extreme and alot more militant.

At any rate, then I take it that in the scenario that I mentioned that you would not be motivated in part by the fact that the U.N., Aethiests, and Catholics were oppressing your religious beliefs by removing all traces of Christianity from your constitution and all of the federal and state laws?  

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[SFWanabe 0]

Quote[/b] ]I havent seen CAP serving in Iraq or Afganistan

Oh... I forgot to mention, National Security as one. that would keep us in the US.

Quote[/b] ]So what if its USAF Aux. that doesnt mean jack and that doesnt mean your apart of the real USAF

so what are you saying here... were just the auxilary?

Quote[/b] ]CAP rarely ever does actual SAR missions

thats irrelivant. we still do SAR missions even if its just one, we do it.

What I'm saying is like I told you in my PM is that the only members of CAP that are considered USAF are the paid members not 16 year old kids. Also I was in CAP for 5 years and I have only been on one SAR mission and It was nothing more than a joke. I was even told by my wing commander who is a paid member of CAP that members who are not paid members of CAP are not consider apart of the USAF. And yes you are just Aux. which means your nothing more than a JROTC(Except the paid members) whos does just alittle more than color guards and such.

[Bordoy 0]

The auxiallary is reserve just like the RAF Auxillary ,except they don't do anything unlike the TA who are everywhere.

[miles teg 1]

Quote[/b] ]I havent seen CAP serving in Iraq or Afganistan

Oh... I forgot to mention, National Security as one. that would keep us in the US.

Quote[/b] ]So what if its USAF Aux. that doesnt mean jack and that doesnt mean your apart of the real USAF

so what are you saying here... were just the auxilary?

Quote[/b] ]CAP rarely ever does actual SAR missions

thats irrelivant. we still do SAR missions even if its just one, we do it.

Dude... the Civil Air Patrol IS NOT the Airforce.  Any Airforce airman would laugh at you if they heard you call yourself an Airman of the United States Airforce.  It is a civilian (hence the word civil) auxillary unit supported by the Airforce.  Nothing more, nothing less.  My father was a member of the civil air patrol in Florida.  The last time they saw combat was during WWII when a German sub tried to go up a river and they dropped some explosive charges on it.  Actually I think that was the first and only time they ever saw combat.

So I'm not saying that the CAP is useless or doesn't have an important job.  But they are a civilian paramilitary organization.  

There is the Texas State Guard here in Texas that does much the same thing.  They are like somewhere in between the Boy Scouts and the Texas National Guard but are a paramilitary state sponsored militia that do not fall under the jurisdiction of the US Army like the National Guard does.   But they do train on US federal facilities like Camp Bullis and wear the same uniforms as the US Army. However they are strictly a Texas bound organization. Mostly they are made up of retired military, and those who want some type of military experience but could not meet the physical requirements of the US military.  A friend of mine is a communication officer in the state guard because he lost his eyesight and was removed from active duty in the Army.  But he could still work a radio really well and could still perform certain duties so the State Guard let him in.

But anyways... my point is, please don't call yourself part of the USAF.  You are a Civil Air Patrol and there is nothing shameful about that.  But it is what it is.  Like SFwannabe said, its like an JROTC cadet calling himself part of the USAF.

I don't even consider college ROTC cadets part of the US military.  They are cadets and trainees, but are not full fledged soldiers except for those who are prior service and are just there to get an education and to get back into the military as part of the officer corps. My old Army Reserve unit would have these green ROTC cadets get attached to our unit.  We had to set them straight REAL QUICK that they weren't shit to us when they tried to do stupid crap like demand that we salute them or try to order us around.   I've only saluted one cadet at my unit and he was a damn super soldier who earned his salute by showing genuine leadership and skill. Cadet Davidson was his name. But unlike most cadets he was enlisted first. We went through Basic Training together at Ft. Leanordwood. Later he became a cadet while still in our Reserve unit and was just a fantastic leader and soldier partly because he knew what it was like being an enlisted man. But he was both hardcore, educated, and highly intelligent and capable. Last I heard he was a Captain in an armored company commanding an M1 platoon.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[miles teg 1]

The auxiallary is reserve just like the RAF Auxillary ,except they don't do anything unlike the TA who are everywhere.

Actually not quite... the Airforce Reserve is quite different.  For one thing they don't let 16 yr. olds in.  You have to go through all of the training that an active duty airman must go through, only that afterwards you go back to your home duty station and drill once a month and a few weeks of annual training every year.  In addition any reserve component can be activated to active duty and deployed anywhere in the world along with active duty military.  

The CAP last I heard has never been deployed outside of this country.  I'm not saying its impossible that they might have a program for sending qualified CAP personel to Iraq for real world training.  However I've never heard of entire CAP units  getting deployed overseas. Its also not the same thing as the Airforce National Guard either, because likewise, the National Guard gets deployed overseas. The CAP also does not fly combat aircraft. Only in rare instances are they trained with weapons or explosives such as the case during WWII when they sank that German sub I mentioned above.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[Sophion-Black 0]

The CAP last I heard has never been deployed outside of this country.  I'm not saying its impossible that they might have a program for sending qualified CAP personel to Iraq for real world training.

like i said National Security, we were drafted for it right after 9/11. Thats the reason we're never deployed we form. its kind of like a militia.

Quote[/b] ]Only in rare instances are they trained with weapons or explosives such as the case during WWII when they sank that German sub I mentioned above.

its true we sunk a geman sub in wwII but we are trianed in weapons and explosives. I haven't recieved this training due to my rank, but generaly Captain and above can take this training, but its taken at USAR fireing ranges. the Unit "rents" so to speak, weapons for the cadets (My unit is poor so we're stuck with M16A1's from the Vietnam era). like i said we can recive education from USAF academies colaborating with Airman from the USAF. Think what you whant to think i won't argue to a headless horsmen ho can't hear. but the CAP is still a us millitary organization

[Sophion-Black 0]

Dude....you completely missed the point I was making.  I was not saying that the UN is going to invade the US.  I was giving a hypothetical scenario that is similar to what Iraqis are facing, except taking place in the United States so that hopefully you would get some understanding of what it it might be like for a typical Iraqi militant fighting against the United States and how that militant might feel.  

That's why I was making that scenario, but it kinda went right over your head.

However you did answer one question when you said it would become a guerilla war.... exactly what we see in Iraq.

I'm throwing religion in there, because thats a huge part of whats going on in Iraq...the perception that Iraqi government will keep religion out of Iraq and out of their legal system as long as the US pulls the strings.

Its not totally unlike the efforts of Christian fundamentalists in the US to keep their brand of Christianity in our legal system and public policies at all levels of government and against the will of those who do not share their Christian beliefs.

The only difference is that in Iraq the Islamic fundamentalists are even more extreme and alot more militant.

At any rate, then I take it that in the scenario that I mentioned that you would not be motivated in part by the fact that the U.N., Aethiests, and Catholics were oppressing your religious beliefs by removing all traces of Christianity from your constitution and all of the federal and state laws?  

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

well... you know... I think a bit differanty than others

but i would gett a little ticked if they removed... wiat... there isn't any trace of relgion in the constitution.

Ah.. i know thats why our founding fatheres made it that way. although they did say a prayer before signing the constitution, they slipped in a masonic rule "must not force ones religion apon another man" (were you get seperation of church and state so the masonic rule is not broken).

oh.. back to the scenario... Yes i would be ticked if they forced me to worship something else.

[SFWanabe 0]

The CAP last I heard has never been deployed outside of this country. I'm not saying its impossible that they might have a program for sending qualified CAP personel to Iraq for real world training.

like i said National Security, we were drafted for it right after 9/11. Thats the reason we're never deployed we form. its kind of like a militia.

Quote[/b] ]Only in rare instances are they trained with weapons or explosives such as the case during WWII when they sank that German sub I mentioned above.

its true we sunk a geman sub in wwII but we are trianed in weapons and explosives. I haven't recieved this training due to my rank, but generaly Captain and above can take this training, but its taken at USAR fireing ranges. the Unit "rents" so to speak, weapons for the cadets (My unit is poor so we're stuck with M16A1's from the Vietnam era). like i said we can recive education from USAF academies colaborating with Airman from the USAF. Think what you whant to think i won't argue to a headless horsmen ho can't hear. but the CAP is still a us millitary organization

CAP is not a military org. like it used to be during WW2 all it is now is one of the USAF's. You really need to stop pretending to be a big soldier boy because your not. You already have 2 people say that your not military. So you might as well give it up. Also about the whole weapons deal that is such bullshit. Nobody in CAP gets weapons training anymore and I'm sure you dont have BB guns let alone M-16s. I also hope you know that there is federal law against inpersonating a member of the US military which carrys a very hefty prison sentence.

[ralphwiggum 6]

ok, SFWannabe and Sophion, I think your discussion is quite off from the thread's intention of discussing US politics. perhaps its best to put a freeze on your discussion.

[SFWanabe 0]

I'm fine with that Ralph.

[walker 0]

Hi all

US stock just took a hundred point plunge today as the US continues to suffer from rising Oil prices.

With the dollar once more set to spiral down and any one with dollars set to loose it big time Russian and OPEC countries are once again thinking of valueing Oil in euros.

For many now the euro is becomming the choice for reserve currency. At least until the US economy shows signs of revcovery.

Quote[/b] ]Higher oil prices crush stocks again

NEW YORK (AP) — Rising oil prices plagued Wall Street again Friday as the Dow Jones industrial average suffered its second straight 100-point-plus loss, ending a week dominated by concerns that energy costs would soon eat into corporate profits. All three indexes finished the week substantially lower.

The Dow Jones industrial average fell 123.60, or 1.2%, to 10,297.84, after plunging more than 166 points the previous session.

The broader gauges, which also posted big losses Thursday, were down as well. The Standard & Poor's 500 index dropped 9.16, or 0.8%, to 1191.57. The Nasdaq composite index lost 17.39, or 0.8%, to 2053.27.

For the week, the Dow lost 3.1%, the S&P fell 2.1%, and the Nasdaq dropped 1.9%.

Investors overlooked decent economic news, choosing instead to focus on oil. Transportation and manufacturing companies — considered the most oil-dependent — were hardest hit, though the selling was spread throughout the market as crude oil futures threatened to top the psychologically significant $60-per-barrel barrier for the second day in a row.

"The crude situation is a big concern right now," said Brian Williamson, an equity trader at The Boston Company Asset Management. "People aren't really looking at the economic numbers."

Even the economic data, while mostly positive, raised some concerns. The Commerce Department reported a 5.5% rise in orders to U.S. factories for big-ticket manufactured goods last month, but much of that was due to a surge in demand for commercial aircraft. With transportation orders removed, durable goods orders fell 0.2% in May, the third decline in the past four months.

Also adding some volatility to the market, institutional investors were adjusting their portfolios to reflect the annual rebalancing of the Russell indexes.

The bond market reflected investors' uncertainty, making substantial gains as stocks dropped. The yield on the 10-year Treasury note fell to 3.92%, down from 3.96% late Thursday. The dollar fell against most major currencies and gold prices also lost ground...

http://www.usatoday.com/money/markets/us/2005-06-24-wall-street_x.htm

It amazes me that so many Americans were fooled into backing a pair of business failures like George Bush junior (Shrub anyone) and Dodgy Dick Cheyney who's former company Halliburton went bust due to Dick Cheyney's incompetance and that now lives off the world biggest social security cheque. How could Americans suposedly steeped in business be fool enough to forget the basics "It's the economy stupid!"

Well as the bible says as you sow so shall you reap.

Sadly Walker