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Quote[/b] ]Plus the bastards eat cheese, drink wine all day and every sauce is made of fat and butter...and the bastards STILL live longer than us!    

And, they work less than us... mad_o.gif

Quote[/b] ]..fact of the matter is they're French.

Nah, he rags on 19th century Spain also in a military history way. He is not one those people that say the Western Allies did everything in World War 2. CESM just comes from WWII and deals with the rapid collapse of the French military and the strategy used by them. On paper, they were superior but they blew it in the belief of a repeat in WWI warfare. Anyway, if Britian was in France shoes, people would be saying that the Brits got pwned by some farmers/colonists and they "supported" the confederates ( mad_o.gif ).

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Actually it wasnt quite so simple. If i recall correctly from my Cambridge History of the British Empire, the upper classes (the establishment ) were mostly cheering for the confederates but the working classes (the majority) were great supporters of the Unionists.

Quote[/b] ]Nah, ..

Ah ok. Consider me mildy mollified, and reassured about the Great American Education System.

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What's so bad about supporting the Confederacy...?  smile_o.gif

I have been known to engage in a little French razzing, but in fact they have a highly capable military. They just never use it....

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I have been known to engage in a little French razzing, but in fact they have a highly capable military. They just never use it....

Or maybe they just dont throw their military at any excuse for a war they might find even fake ones.....

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The french are actually known for using their military and have done so more before and after WWII. Tchad anyone...

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Hi all

I also seem to remember France covered the left flank in to Iraq in GW I. They made a deep incursion into Iraq as far as the Euphrates river.

Quote[/b] ]The XVIII Airborne Corps, under Lt. Gen. Gary E. Luck, held the left, or western, flank and consisted of the 82d Airborne Division, the 101st Airborne Division (Air Assault), the 24th Infantry Division (Mechanized), the French 6th Light Armored Division, the 3d Armored Cavalry, and the 12th and 18th Aviation Brigades.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/desert_sabre.htm

Quote[/b] ]XVIII Airborne Corps attacked in the west and deep into Iraq to control the east-west lines of communication along Highway 8 and cut off Iraqi forces in the Kuwait Theater of Operations. In the far west the French 6th Light Armored and the 101st Airborne Divisions started the massive western envelopment with a ground assault to secure the allied left flank and an air assault to establish forward support bases deep in Iraqi territory. In XVIII Corps' mission of envelopment, the 24th Infantry Division had the central role of blocking the Euphrates River valley to prevent the escape north of Iraqi forces in Kuwait and then attacking east in coordination with VII Corps to defeat the armor-heavy divisions of the Republican Guard Forces Command.
Ibid

Click to see Map of GW I battle plan

hardly what I would call cowardly.

It seems that when France said quite correctly the USA and UK had got it wrong about WMD

The French also pointed out that there were no links between Sadam and Al Qaida and no links between 9/11 and Iraq.

In all this the French were correct.

They then said there was no legal reason to invade in which the French were also correct.

So an Allie says "Dont do it you are about to make a mistake.", as a friendly warning, we then go off and foul mouth them.

hmm leaves our morals up to certain scrutiny

Kind Regards Walker

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Quote[/b] ]The french are actually known for using their military and have done so more before and after WWII. Tchad anyone...mouth them.

Everybody knows this but the term CESM didn't come from those other conflicts.

Quote[/b] ]They then said there was no legal reason to invade in which the French were also correct.

So an Allie says "Dont do it you are about to make a mistake.", as a friendly warning, we then go off and foul mouth them.

But, why didn't the Germans catch flak like the French did? You see the French govt. was pretty active, compared to Germans, in the media and UN in being a headache. The French govt. voiced their opinion and then some acting like they were playing for the other "team" (going to Africa and etc).

Quote[/b] ]What's so bad about supporting the Confederacy...?  smile_o.gif

The Union aka United States, bitches...good (not "good" but meh)

Confederacy....bad (God doesn't like you)

wink_o.gif

Quote[/b] ]Actually it wasnt quite so simple. If i recall correctly from my Cambridge History of the British Empire, the upper classes (the establishment ) were mostly cheering for the confederates but the working classes (the majority) were great supporters of the Unionists.

English govt. supported them (not all did)...better?

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Quote[/b] ]But, why didn't the Germans catch flak like the French did? You see the French govt. was pretty active, compared to Germans, in the media and UN in being a headache.

Well, I clearly remember some german ministers being in the headlines a couple of times......

But the fact that it didn't reach the wider US public is because US needed a scapegoat and what better goat to findt than the poor french ones who must suffer your boring "freedom fries" humour. Evil ridiculing is so much more entertaining for the stupid masses than the self critical eye.

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Quote[/b] ]They are also known for having The Second Best Empire in History, which doesnt come of eating cheese

How can have thier been a 'best' empire?

But I'll say that the French empire was as good as the British empire. But both of them were not as 'good' as The Roman Empire, Alexander the Great's Empire, Genghis Khan's Empire.

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Quote[/b] ]Afghan Riots Not Tied to Report on Quran Handling, General Says

Army investigating allegations of mishandling at Guantanamo Bay facility

By Jacquelyn S. Porth

Washington File Staff Writer

Washington – The chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff says a report from Afghanistan suggests that rioting in Jalalabad on May 11 was not necessarily connected to press reports that the Quran might have been desecrated in the presence of Muslim prisoners held in U.S. custody at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.

Air Force General Richard Myers told reporters at the Pentagon May 12 that he has been told that the Jalalabad, Afghanistan, rioting was related more to the ongoing political reconciliation process in Afghanistan than anything else.

According to initial reports, the situation in Jalalabad began on May 10 with peaceful student protests reacting to a report in Newsweek magazine that U.S. military interrogators questioning Muslim detainees at the Guantanamo detention center “had placed Quran s on toilets, and in at least one case flushed a holy book.†By the following day the protests in the city had turned violent with reports of several individuals killed, dozens wounded, and widespread looting of government, diplomatic and nongovernmental assets.

However, Myers said an after-action report provided by U.S. Army Lieutenant General Karl Eikenberry, commander of the Combined Forces in Afghanistan, indicated that the political violence was not, in fact, connected to the magazine report.

Meanwhile, Myers said the U.S. military has assigned Army General Bantz Craddock to investigate allegations about the handling of the Quran at Guantanamo. Craddock brings the full weight of his responsibility as commander of the U.S. Southern Command to this effort.

Myers said the International Committee of the Red Cross has approved the edition of the Quran that has been distributed to Muslim detainees in Guantanamo. Craddock has been investigating the claim that proper respect was not given to the Koran. There are now some 550 enemy combatants at the military installation, which is designed to isolate individuals whom the military has identified as likely to have valuable intelligence about international terrorism.

Craddock and his team have examined the prisoner interrogation logs and Myers said “they cannot confirm yet†that there ever was a case of a U.S. interrogator flushing a Quran down the toilet. He did say there is another unconfirmed log reference to a guard report that a detainee tore pages from the Quran and flushed them in an attempt to flood the holding area as a form of protest.

Myers answered questions about the alleged Quran incident on the same day that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice addressed the issue during an appearance before the House International Relations Committee.

She said disrespect for the Quran will never be tolerated by the United States and such disrespect “is abhorrent to us all.†Pakistan has voiced its concerns about the alleged incident, and Rice said the United States understands and shares the concerns of its Muslim friends. She went on to voice this request: “I am asking that all our friends around the world reject incitement to violence by those who would mischaracterize our intentions.†(See related article.)

INSURGENCY SEEKS TO DISCREDIT NEW IRAQI CABINET, MYERS SAYS

At the Pentagon, Myers was also questioned closely about the increase in violence in Iraq in recent weeks. He acknowledged that there has been “a spike in violence in early May,†but he said this is to be expected given the “very violent insurgency†that is under way in that country.

The insurgency’s use of a variety of roadside and car bombs has been difficult to thwart, the general said. He also noted the difficulty of sealing Iraq’s borders against infiltrators. On this “we need cooperation from Iraq’s neighbors†-- an issue that is being pursued vigorously, Myers said.

Most insurgencies have a lifespan of three to nine years, Myers said, and addressing them militarily requires patience. In this case, the insurgents are out to discredit the newly formed Iraqi Cabinet, he said.

Myers made his remarks during an appearance with Defense Secretary Rumsfeld and other senior military and civilian officials to talk about the 2005 Base Realignment and Closure recommendations, which will be formally unveiled May 13.

Created:12 May 2005 Updated: 13 May 2005

Source (US Govt.)

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Yes, it would have been stupid for the French to invade Iraq: Nobody in their right mind would take out such a good business client.  biggrin_o.gif

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I don't like cheese all that much, I look nothing like a monkey and I have yet to surrender ;) (neither were my father, grandfathers and great grandfathers)

Tchad is just one among a load of others : Africa (Algeria, Kolwezi anyone ? and more recently in Ivory Coast making world headlines) Middle East (Suez Crisis, Lebanon), Asia (Indochina, Afghanistan), Balkans are a just a few notorious exemples.

A star sprangled banner sells better than a tri-color flag in the medias smile_o.gif (It's actually nice to get so little attention as when bloopers or misfires happen, it gets barely noticed smile_o.gif ).

Quote[/b] ]Yes, it would have been stupid for the French to invade Iraq: Nobody in their right mind would take out such a good business client.

Saddam quite liked our stuff, just like most of our ME customers smile_o.gif (Back in the days, the Iranians after seeing how good the AU F1, a self propelled artillery gun was in the hands of the iraqis asked us to hand them a few in exchange of hostages).

Now, when it comes to business, I think everybody's hands are as dirty as ours, if not more smile_o.gif

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Saddam quite liked our stuff, just like most of our ME customers

I also heard the Argentineans enjoyed them aswell. But saying that, they also had a few US weapons but they were from along time ago.

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Yes, It was stupid of the U.S. to sell arms to Iraq, but at least we stopped. France did too, finally.  biggrin_o.gif

Back onto U.S. politics: What are the feelings on the Cuban terrorist arrested by the FBI recently. (If anyone could find a link to the story, I guess that would be helpful)

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Yes, It was stupid of the U.S. to sell arms to Iraq, but at least we stopped. France did too, finally. biggrin_o.gif

Back onto U.S. politics: What are the feelings on the Cuban terrorist arrested by the FBI recently. (If anyone could find a link to the story, I guess that would be helpful)

It sounds like a CIA operative that has out lived his usefulness and is now nothing but a politcal hot potato. The US can't let him stay without cries of hypocrisy, but on the other hand I bet he could spill a lot of info about CIA operations in Latin America.

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Yes, It was stupid of the U.S. to sell arms to Iraq, but at least we stopped. France did too, finally.  biggrin_o.gif

Back onto U.S. politics: What are the feelings on the Cuban terrorist arrested by the FBI recently. (If anyone could find a link to the story, I guess that would be helpful)

It sounds like a CIA operative that has out lived his usefulness and is now nothing but a politcal hot potato. The US can't let him stay without cries of hypocrisy, but on the other hand I bet he could spill a lot of info about CIA operations in Latin America.

The only thing they can do, realistically, is pull a Noriega on him or give him up...

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i doubt he would have anything really usefull for Castro that he probaly doesn't already know that is if there was any meetings between CIA and this man. extradite him and be done w/ it i say.

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i doubt he would have anything really usefull for Castro that he probaly doesn't already know that is if there was any meetings between CIA and this man. extradite him and be done w/ it i say.

He was a CIA operative in Latin America, not just during the Bay Of Pigs. I'm imagining he has quite a bit he can share...

Ne thinks a brain anuerism (in the form of a .45 bullet) is the only way to get cleanly outta this.

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Quote[/b] ]Latest 'Star Wars' Movie Is Quickly Politicized

By DAVID M. HALBFINGER

LOS ANGELES, May 18 - For sheer lack of subtlety, the light-saber-wielding forces of good and evil in George Lucas's "Star Wars" movies can't hold a candle to the blogging, advertising and boycotting forces of the right and left. (Or left and right.)

More a measure of the nation's apparently permanent political warfare than of a filmmaker's intent, the heroes and antiheroes of Mr. Lucas's final entry, "Episode III - Revenge of the Sith," were on their way to becoming the stock characters of partisan debate by mid-Wednesday, hours before the film's opening just after midnight:

¶The liberal advocacy group Moveon.org was preparing to spend $150,000 to run advertisements on CNN over the next few days - and to spread leaflets among audiences in line at multiplexes - comparing Senator Bill Frist of Tennessee, the majority leader, to the movie's power-grabbing, evil Chancellor Palpatine, for Dr. Frist's role in the Senate's showdown over the confirmation of federal judges.

¶Conservative Web logs were lacerating Mr. Lucas over the film's perceived jabs at President Bush - as when Anakin Skywalker, on his way to becoming the evil Darth Vader, warns, "If you're not with me, you're my enemy," in an echo of Mr. Bush's post-9/11 ultimatum, "Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists."

¶A little-trafficked conservative Web site about film, Pabaah.com - for "Patriotic Americans Boycotting Anti-American Hollywood" - added Mr. Lucas to its list of boycotted entertainers, along with more than 200 others, including Jane Fonda, Susan Sarandon, Sean Penn and the Dixie Chicks.

¶Even the Drudge Report Web site got into the act: beneath a picture of Darth Vader, it compared the White House press corps to the vengeful Sith, after reporters peppered a press secretary for pressing Newsweek magazine to "repair the damage" in the Muslim world caused by a retracted report about desecration of the Koran.

There is nothing all that new or imaginative, of course, about politicians borrowing from popular movies to score points; witness Ronald Reagan's co-opting of the "evil empire" metaphor for use against the Soviet bloc, or his critics lampooning his missile defense ideas as something straight out of "Star Wars." And Senator John McCain of Arizona, a Republican rebel of sorts, compared his 2000 primary campaign to Luke Skywalker's fighting his way out of the Death Star.

But it is highly unusual for a mainstream Hollywood movie to wind up in the swirl of politics even before it has opened - though that did occur with 20th Century Fox's "Day After Tomorrow," with its apocalyptic vision of global warming's consequences, which advocates including Moveon.org and Al Gore used to protest the Bush administration's environmental policy.

As a rule, Hollywood studios go to great lengths to ensure that their projects - both in the development stage and especially when they are positioned in the marketplace - are free of messages that could be offensive to any great swath of the moviegoing public. Like, say, people who vote for one political party or the other.

All of which calls into question Mr. Lucas's decision to have the premiere of the "Star Wars" finale at the Cannes Film Festival. France is sometimes called the biggest blue state of all, after all. And just what was Mr. Lucas - who could not be reached for comment Wednesday - thinking when he told a Cannes audience that he had not realized in plotting the film years ago that fact might so closely track his fiction?

Alluding to Michael Moore's remarks about "Fahrenheit 9/11" at Cannes a year earlier, Mr. Lucas joked, "Maybe the film will waken people to the situation."

Apparently in all seriousness, though, he went on to say that he had first devised the "Star Wars" story during the Vietnam War. "The parallels between what we did in Vietnam and what we're doing in Iraq now are unbelievable," he told an appreciative audience.

Peter Sealey, a former marketing chief at Columbia Pictures, said the partisan tug of war over the new "Star Wars" episode seemed absurd, likening the political interpretations of it to a Rorschach test. But he said Mr. Lucas was probably savvy in adding sizzle and relevance to a movie that otherwise might have earned publicity only by its effectiveness as entertainment.

"He could've come out and said, 'That's ridiculous - this is the white hats and black hats of the 1950's in space,' and quashed it," said Mr. Sealey, who teaches entertainment marketing at the University of California, Berkeley. "Did he do that? No, and it was probably smart. If he can get 'Star Wars' brought into the debate over unilateralism and the Iraq war, it just brings a current spin to it. And I don't think it's going to rule people out."

Indeed, it is extremely unlikely that all the online screeds and boycotts put together will leave so much as a dent in the movie's box office results. Hollywood insiders have estimated that "Episode III" will have ticket sales of $120 million or more in its first four days.

But Mr. Sealey said other filmmakers and marketers might do well to inspect their pictures for latent political messaging before the public does it for them.

He noted that a Universal Pictures marketing executive had given a lecture to his marketing class about "King Kong," which is coming out later this year. "Is there a political overtone to it?" Mr. Sealey said. "I suspect he's got to think that through today. The political sensitivities are so great that you have to take that calculus into consideration. Is somebody going to read into 'King Kong' that it's pro-Iraq, or it's going to get PETA upset?"

I'm surprised it took them that long. I saw the parallels in Episode II. Though I personally think Cheney is the Emporer pullin' the strings and Bush is an easily manipulated, whiny Anakin.

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I'm surprised it took them that long. I saw the parallels in Episode II. Though I personally think Cheney is the Emporer pullin' the strings and Bush is an easily manipulated, whiny Anakin.

Who is Yoda then? tounge_o.gif

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Why Jedi Master Kerry of coarse! Obiwan is Jedi Master Edwards. Princess whats her name (the one Anikan boinked) is of coarse Princess Condaliza Rice.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

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Yes, It was stupid of the U.S. to sell arms to Iraq, but at least we stopped. France did too, finally.  biggrin_o.gif

Back onto U.S. politics: What are the feelings on the Cuban terrorist arrested by the FBI recently. (If anyone could find a link to the story, I guess that would be helpful)

He's not a terrorist, he's a Cuban FREEDOM FIGHTER. When people kill civilians to fight commies its A-OK for America! But if they kill civilians fighting against America, they are damned to hell commie Muslim terrorists who are fighting AGAINST FREEDOM, democracy, and the American Way.

THere's a big difference you see. Its like Al-Zarqowi said, innocent Muslim deaths are a necessary part of Jihad and should not slow it down. Just like fighting commies, its ok if some civililians die because they're dying in the name of FREEDOM so you can't feel any sympothy for dead Iraqis like those bleeding heart liberals want you to do especially if they're Muslim cuz we all know Muslims are the enemy.

Just remember 9/11 and BRAVEHEART if doubt creepes into your mind about the necessity of this war. Like William Wallace said, FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDOM!!!!!!!

He got his intestines pulled out and was chopped up into a bunch of pieces but its all good in the name of freedom cuz freedom isn't free yo.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

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Nothing on the border happens but just illegals crossing to find a job or new life...not

http://www.kpho.com/Global/story.asp?S=3366962&nav=23Kta3w0

Quote[/b] ]

Mexican Drug Commandos

Email to a Friend  Printer Friendly Version    

They were the elite "special forces" of the Mexican military, trained in the U.S. at the School of the Americas at Fort Benning, Georgia and sent to "wipe out" one of the most powerful Mexican drug cartels.

But these soldiers deserted and became the muscle for the very cartel they were supposed to destroy.

According to this Department of Justice "Intelligence Bulletin" obtained by the 5i-Team, these rogue commandos now known as "Los Zetas" may be heading our way.

The normally busy streets and busy stores in Nogales Sonora have been a little less bustling lately. Caesar Fierro says, "It's been slow this year." Caesar Fierro says his empty store is the result of rumors about a drug war. Tourists are scared.

Out on the streets, other vendors play down the speculation the Mexican Commandos are already here. Tony Marques says, "The Zetas.. I don't think they'll operate here you know." Marques says, "Maybe in the big cities like Juarez , Tijuana , now you're talking seriously like that."

The Intelligence Bulletin we obtained says the Zetas are responsible for hundreds of violent drug-related murders. It says they've executed journalists, murdered people in Dallas, McAllen and Laredo, Texas. They even detained two DEA agents and recently they've shot at Border Patrol agents. At the Arizona border with Mexico agents are already seeing a major increase in violence.

Jose Garza says, "Last year we had documented only nine shootings against our agents. This year we're up to about 18 shootings already."

Agent Jose Garza says his agents have seen no direct evidence the Zetas are responsible for the shootings here, but as far back as three-years ago, the Zeta-like tactics started to appear.

In March of 2002, U.S. Customs agents were involved in a shootout south of Phoenix with an enemy they had not seen before. Equipped with automatic weapons, body armor, and state-of-the-art communications, in a word - it looked "military."

Kyle Barnette says, "I'd be lying if I didn't say it concerns us."

Now, as a drug war between the Gulf Cartel to the east and the Tijuana Cartel to the west starts to heat up, the Justice Department bulletin warns: "The violence will spill over the Mexican border into the United States and law enforcement agencies in Texas, Arizona and Southern California can expect to encounter Los Zetas in the coming months."

05.19.05

unclesam.gif

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Quote[/b] ]Nothing on the border happens but just illegals crossing to find a job or new life...not

Don't remember anyone saying that... rock.gif

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