German movie "Der Untergang"

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Yes... Placebo.. the last picture is from the short scenes I was talking about. Good source-research from your side, I am impressed!

[void_false 1]

placebo why r u quoting images?

[DracoPaladore 0]

I hope this is released in North American, DVD video or theatre. It sounds very interesting.

[Placebo 29]

Yes... Placebo.. the last picture is from the short scenes I was talking about. Good source-research from your side, I am impressed!

Thanks

I was trying to find the movie clip from the last one but failed unfortunately, IIRC he kept one of his arms inside his coat because it was almost completely paralysed at that point?

<span id='ME'><center>placebo slaps void_false</center></span>

[Blake 0]

Quote[/b] ]I was trying to find the movie clip from the last one but failed unfortunately, IIRC he kept one of his arms inside his coat because it was almost completely paralysed at that point?

I remember seeing the uncensored clip about it in Battlefield: Battle for Berlin documentary. His left arm was behind his back and was shaking up and down throughout the ceremony.

Clear evidence of Parkinson's disease I believe.

Somebody could also do a movie about last paranoid years of Stalin and the power struggle after his death.

[Placebo 29]

Has anyone seen "Hitler: The Rise of Evil" With Robert Carlyle as Hitler? That was very good probably more "glossy" than this is going to be but certainly worth watching.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0346293/

Also another worth watching, (not about Hitler as such) is Nuremburg, about the trials obviously, Brian Cox is simply outstanding as Hermann Goering, but then Brian Cox is outstanding in every role he plays, his Hannibal Lecter (in the original Manhunter) was hugely superior to Anthony Hopkins' IMO

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0208629/

[Charon-VW:BB- 0]

"Hitler: The Rise of Evil" is shown here in Germany on the 24.09 on a private sender called 'RtlII'. I saw the trailer but i think won't watch it. It's more like a dramatic Blockbuster. And i hate RTLII  

[Placebo 29]

I get RTL2 via satellite but I don't speak German

I'd suggest giving it a chance, as I said I really enjoyed it, I wouldn't really call it a "dramatic blockbuster", I found it an interesting drama about aspects of Hitler and his life that never really were touched upon before

[Apollo 0]

I saw Nurnburg and it was a very good movie ,definitly the actor who played goering did it masterly.

[IceFire 0]

Has anyone seen "Hitler: The Rise of Evil" With Robert Carlyle as Hitler? That was very good  probably more "glossy" than this is going to be but certainly worth watching.

Oh no.

That movie was terrible in my opinion. It was a cliche charicaturised drama that portrays Hitler as a 2-dimensional petty, raging madman bent on the destruction of all Jews.

Just another stupid made for TV hollywood drama designed to reinforce average Joe's hatred of their version of some historic cartoon-like megalomaniac.

I wouln't at all call it an accurate representation of history.

[Placebo 29]

That movie was terrible in my opinion. It was a cliche charicaturised drama that portrays Hitler as a 2-dimensional petty, raging madman bent on the destruction of all Jews.

LOL yes and? Hitler was a two dimensional raging madman bent on the destruction of all Jews.

[IceFire 0]

I'll admit a "madman bent on the destruction of all jews".

But it is the 2dimensional raging lunatic who has the depth of a cartoon that makes it just another hollywood drama.

It tried to put him in a simple picture.  

They had scene of him as a young soldier violently yelling and kicking at his dog because the dog didn't come when called(in the battlefield), but immediately afterwards when a shell landed close by, Hitler said he believed "the dog was trying to save his life", this in an effort to portray him as a weak delusional man.  Cmon, that is pure hollywood bs.

You can't just take a real person, and make a characaturized analysis of him and say it is real.  No matter who the person is be it Hitler, Stalin or any other bad guy.  

Everyone has experiences in life that in some way are parallel to others and the sum of these experiences affect and shape them into who they are.  It is always easy to just call someone a "madman" or the "most evil person on earth", but that is just objectifying the person as that character.  

I don't watch a movie about Hitler as a rally "look at the terrible Hitler".  I watch such movies for dark indepth psychological historically accurate version of what he was like with varying shades of grey.  It should be unsettling because he was an actual person who became a mad tyrant, not some cartoon.

[-33ker 0]

Somebody could also do a movie about last paranoid years of Stalin and the power struggle after his death.

I've been watching a film about Stalin in the last days of his reign called something like "The Red Monarch" in school last year and it was pretty good because it was also very funny and showed how ridiculous this cult around Stalin was!

[Blake 0]

I laughed out loud severel times while reading the book "Kruschev remembers" there were so much ridiculous things going on around politbyro and Stalin   Would make an excellent movie. But of course, it was also a very tragic era. I've gotta catch that film you mentioned someday.

I also have to agree on the comments that the Nuremberg film was quite good.

[Tamme 0]

I don't know if I'm going to see this one in the theathers, but I'm definately going to buy the DVD when it comes out.

I saw a short preview about it a couple of days ago on TV. It said that they listened to some secret recording made in Finland IIRC to get Hitler's voice and way of speaking right.

[-33ker 0]

BTW, the fighting scenes in Berlin were actually shot in St. Petersburg.

[Apollo 0]

Quote[/b] ] laughed out loud severel times while reading the book "Kruschev remembers"

Seems like an interresting book ,i like eastern literature easpecially about social topics out there ,do you remember who wrote it?

edit: never mind ,i googled it.

Quote[/b] ]by Nikita S. Kruschev

   

duh *slams head*

[xawery 0]

Speaking of Hitler films, has anyone seen "Max"? A fairly unknown film, set in the years directly after WW1. The story is completely hypothetical; it shows Hitler as a fairly mediocre painter of realism, struggling in a time where abstract works dominated the art world. Hitler sparks the interest of a rich, Jewish gallery owner Max Rothman. In the meantime, Hitler begins his engagement in politics.

I won't tell you anything more; suffice to say the film is worth watching. Noah Taylor plays Hitler and John Cusack plays Rothman. Unfortunately, the film suffers from its share of quirks: for example the Jewish germans speak with an american accent, while the "bad" germans are given a ridiculous "vee vill azk ze kvestions" accent. Highly annoying. There are also some minor historical innacuracies, but none of them is blatant enough to be truly annoying.

The ending is quite ironic and quite tragic. It leaves the viewer with some food for thought. Always a good trait, in my books.

As to "Der Untergang", I can't wait to see it. It seems that here in the Netherlands A-Film has already purchased the screening rights. Can't wait can't wait...

[Placebo 29]

Haven't seen it but I've heard of it, is this the one that alludes to a homosexual relationship between Hitler and his Jewish friend?

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Went to watch the movie yesterday.

I was impressed, Der Untergang is no regular movie. The film isnt organised in the typical greek tradition of theatre plays. It basically has no real train of actions, it is not building up any tension towards the end, there is no battle of good against evil, there is no narator or character you are able to identify yourself with... nothing like that.

It is just a naration of known facts of the last days inside the Fuehrer Bunker and the battle inside Berlin. BUT never before Hitler has been shown in such an accurate an believable way.  I cant describe it here but he is not shown as an exaggerated cartoon, he is not made deliberately evil.. but you can feel the brutality inside him. Never before I have seen a film about Hitler and afterwards said: "he could have been like this". If you got the chance to watch it, do it. But dont expect to come out of it and say.. "wow, that was a movie"... as I said... it wasnt meant to make make corporate hollywood rich but there was a serious intention behind it. And no, it is far from being "low budget".

from the movie

Goebbels shooting his wife

[xawery 0]

Haven't seen it but I've heard of it, is this the one that alludes to a homosexual relationship between Hitler and his Jewish friend?

If it is, then I'm truly bad at picking up subtle messages. And I'm not:)

The film does however suggest that Hitler was asexual in a way, but that idea is easily created when the person in question is ascetic.

Incidentally, Steven Spielberg was quite interested in directing "Max", but he decided not to, as he felt it would "dishonour the memory of the victims of the Holocaust". How the two can be logically linked is completely beyond me.

As to Albert's review: that's exactly what I had hoped "Der Untergang" to be. No dramatising, no moral lessons, simply a film that acknowledges the fact that the viewer is an intelligent being and is able to draw his own conclusions.

Hitler was a madman and a monster, but decades of two-dimensional bogeyman portrayals have turned him into a grotesque, almost comical figure. He's just that bloke with a funny moustache who liked to shout a lot. I am not surprised that 11% of British youth think that he was a fictional figure.

I know we all would prefer to think that Hitler did what he did because he was a monster, an anomaly. It's much easier than to acknowledge that he was human, and that we humans are capable of such things. The same goes for Heydrich, Eichmann, the lot. How can a man who is brought to tears by Schubert's work simultaneously be the Butcher of Prague?

Only accurate, unbiased portrayals of the past will prevent us from repeating our mistakes. It's drivel like Pear Harbor, Enigma or Uprising that shapes the historical awareness (although that may be too big a word nowadays) of our youth.

You could label me a cultural pessimist, but that would be incorrect. Pessimism suggests a biased, coloured look at reality. Sadly, reality only affirms my point of view.

[Charon-VW:BB- 0]

Xawery: That's the point: Hitler wasn't a monster directly send from hell. He turned into a monster because of inauspiciously circumstances. And a Hitler isn't a ghost of history he can return everytime (not with the same name or body but with the same thoughts), not only in germany but all over the world. And i personally think the more you know about this episode the more you know how to avert another Hitler.

And it's sad to see that the NPD and DVU and all of these right wing parties get now again more power in elections all over germany (yes it's not a problem of the east!) but again it's wrong to think that this is only a problem of germany! Nazis are everywhere even in countries you would't expect them.

That's my point of view.

[Lt_Phoenix 0]

I'm hoping this movie comes to norwegian cinemas, but so far I haven't been able to find out anything substantial...  

I think it will be coming here to Norway. I will definately try and see the film when it comes. I don't understand much german, but thts what subtitles are for. I'd also prefer seeing a german language version rather than en English version, since I reckon this will add to the films atmosphere.

[WargamingNor 0]

Yeah... they could TRY and dub it to english language or others... I hate dubbing - period!  

(germans are notorious in dubbing everything though...)

EDIT; some martial art flicks and other old Hong Kong movies can be insanely funny due to dubbing... that's the only dubbing I can half approve of...

[-33ker 0]

All I can say is that it's one of the best movies ever made in Germany! We should have come up with something like this earlier!