Us presidential election 2004

[miles teg 1]

Not that it matters anyway, 'cause Bush is gonna win, but I just came across this interesting factoid:

Bush has a Higher IQ Than Kerry

So for everyone out there who calls Bush stupid, well, I guess that makes Kerry just a retard or something.

Hmm...funny how Bush's grades at Yale beg to differ. IQ tests don't = common sense. I only have to listen to Bush talk to tell me that he's not a very good critical thinker and does not have a solid grasp on the complexity of certain issues especially when it comes to foreign policy. You can make a freak'n nuclear physicist and still be a complete moron about other cultures and their histories.

Chris G.

aka-Miles Teg<GD>

[General Barron 0]

What are Kerry's grades? What are his SAT scores? Last I checked, he hasn't released them. I guess he's just being modest... Anyway, so what if Kerry can recite speeches that were written for him better than Bush can? Bush does better on an officer qualification test than Kerry, but that doesn't matter? I'm sure it would matter to you if it were the other way around...

[FSPilot 0]

When was the last time your grades had anything to do with how smart you are? I know it may seem like it, but in the real world it's completely different. I know a lot of people that are much smarter than I am but get worse grades, and the other way around.

Either way, the vdare.com link is bunk because military tests are confidential. They're not going to hand them out so people can post them on the internet.

[Apollo 0]

First of all youre "source" is very questionable ,that site looks like just another conservative propaganda outlet to me ,and the conservative's are known for making campaign by just making up stuff and spreading it as rumours.It's the "Carl Rove" Doctrine.

And Miles teq is right ,it's not because you have a high IQ that it justify youre mistake's.AFAIK as i know Mao Zedong had a very high IQ to ,however that doesn't make the cultural revolution a succesfull episode of chinese society.

[FSPilot 0]

First of all youre "source" is very questionable ,that site looks like just another conservative propaganda outlet to me ,and the conservative's are known for making campaign by just making up stuff and spreading it as rumours.It's the "Carl Rove" Doctrine.

Yeah, and the lovenstein institute thing.

... wait...

Anyway, time to celebrate...

WHOO!! 4 more years of bitching from overseas!

[denoir 0]

Ugh. CBS just reported that 75-85% of the provisional ballots in Ohio come from democratic areas. They say that it could very well exceed the current margin of separation

Looks like this thing isn't going to be decided today. I personally still think Bush will win though.

[General Barron 0]

Quote[/b] ]First of all youre "source" is very questionable

Okay, how about the New York Times? It is really just a Liberal propaganda source, but I think you might consider it "credible".

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/24/politics/campaign/24points.html

[General Barron 0]

Oh, and I know that grades/SAT scores/IQ scores aren't really that important. But I am pointing it out because the Bush-bashers always love to call Bush stupid, because of his "low grades" and his "low SAT scores" and his "low IQ", and his "ineloquent speech". I never thought those arguments held any water either. Glad to see you guys agree with me.

[theavonlady 2]

Quote[/b] ]First of all youre "source" is very questionable

Okay, how about the New York Times? It is really just a Liberal propaganda source, but I think you might consider it "credible".

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/24/politics/campaign/24points.html

This is all nonsense and about as ridiculous as the original Lovenstein Institute hoax that FSPilot recalled.

[Apollo 0]

Ok let me quote from that times article:

Quote[/b] ]To Bush-bashers, it may be the most infuriating revelation yet from the military records of the two presidential candidates: the young George W. Bush probably had a higher I.Q. than did the young John Kerry.

That, at least, is the conclusion of Steve Sailer, a conservative columnist at the Web magazine Vdare.com and a veteran student of presidential I.Q.'s. During the last presidential campaign Mr. Sailer estimated from Mr. Bush's SAT score (1206) that his I.Q. was in the mid-120's, about 10 points lower than Al Gore's.

Mr. Kerry's SAT score is not known, but now Mr. Sailer has done a comparison of the intelligence tests in the candidates' military records. They are not formal I.Q. tests, but Mr. Sailer says they are similar enough to make reasonable extrapolations.

Ladiladila. In essense ,this all just repeats the "facts" written on Vdare and as thus is just an extension of that Vdare propaganda.

[WhoCares 0]

I wonder when the White House will move - just 9% support for Bush in Washington D.C.; I bet he doesn't feel very comfortable

[Colossus 2]

Please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please!

Don't let Bush win this!

If he ever comes here, and is elected, I swear that I will throw eggs at him... or a brick!

[General Barron 0]

Well, Peter Jennings asked Kerry about it as well... so I guess he has been taken for a ride too.

Anyway, I don't really care, but I'm just playing Devil's Advocate. I've always rolled my eyes when I hear people say that Bush is such an idiot because he mispronounced this or that. From the way people are talking, I would think that they do the same as well.

You're right, it doesn't really matter if Bush has a higher IQ than Kerry, or higher grades or SAT scores (just what are Kerrry's grades and SAT scores anyway, I'm geniunely curios). And it doesn't matter if Bush misspeaks alot. Bush is obviously not an idiot, and neither is Kerry, which is something we can all agree on, if we take an impartial look at things.

On an anecdotal note, I remember back in 2000, this one girl in my class would talk about how Bush was such an idiot... but it turns out that Bush had a higher SAT score than she did! This girl isn't stupid herself, but maybe she (and others) should speak with their minds instead of their hatred.

[toadlife 3]

Barring some *massive* counting error in Ohio, it's pretty obvious that Bush is going to win. I'm sure anyone who has taken statistics will agree.

Sorry guys. It's four more years of 'dubya' for the world.

[Placebo 28]

Ok I've just closed this temporarily so that I can catch up (maybe 10 new pages since I left work yesterday), the thread inspired a large number of complaints overnight and I want to check it properly.

Things have calmed down but once it's opened again the discussions must be about the election, we have middle east threads, we have war on terror threads, the discussions must be done calmly, rationally and politely.

Once this thread is opened again flaming = WL+1 & 1 week PR, flame baiting = WL+1 & 1 week PR, spamming = WL+1 & 1 week PR, so when you post you better make damn sure it's valid and worthy and not one of those three.

[Placebo 28]

Okies time to open it again, I repeat the discussions must be about the presidential election and not sway into areas covered by the middle east thread or the war on terror thread.

[Pathy 0]

All i can say is, thank god for the 2 term limit.

[theavonlady 2]

Dem. Senate leader Tom Daschle is unemployed.

Quote[/b] ]Democratic Senate Leader Toppled in South Dakota

Wed Nov 3, 2004 04:14 AM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Senate Democratic leader Tom Daschle lost his South Dakota re-election race to Republican John Thune on Tuesday, becoming the first Senate leader in half a century to be voted out of office, CBS and ABC networks projected.

South Dakotans had elected Daschle to the House of Representatives and Senate since 1978 but the state has trended Republican and the big turnout for President Bush boosted Thune, a former House member who failed in his last Senate race. Republican leaders also broke Senate tradition by campaigning against the Democratic leader.

As for the Great Race, they're stuck in Ohio. Maybe you should close the thread again for 2 or 3 weeks.

[Pathy 0]

Isnt Ohio meant to be Bush's? In which case, bye bye Mr Kerry, thank you for trying.....

[robbo 0]

Apprently the provisional votes in Ohio have to be counted 11 days after the election, so they can't call the state yet.

[denoir 0]

Barring some *massive* counting error in Ohio, it's pretty obvious that Bush is going to win.  I'm sure anyone who has taken statistics will agree.

Sorry guys. It's four more years of 'dubya' for the world.

Yepp, it's highly unlikely that the provisional ballots will change the picture so much. If it comes to a recount (not to be ruled out), it could though change a bit more.

Bush convincingly got the popular vote and is likely to get the EC votes as well. That's a solid mandate.

As an external observer to these elections, I have a few comments on the system:

[*] Putting the elections on a regular working day is not good for voter turnout. It's much smarter to put them during the weekend. It will also reduce the pressure on the polling stations and reduce long queues.

[*] Polling machines need to be standardized across all the states. This is currently a source of counting errors and various other problems.

[*] The electoral collage should be dumped in favour of a popular vote. When you are voting for the president, you are not voting as New Yorkers or Californians etc, but as Americans.

[*] There should be provisions for repeating the elections should the results fall within the error margin of the counting method. I.e, if it is to close to reasonably call, the elections should go to a second round.

[*] Don't expect every vote to count. It is simply not achievable in any practical way. Don't expect it to be perfect and take that into consideration. Making a decision on numbers that are within the error of the poll is exactly like flipping a coin.

[Ironsight 1]

On CNN:

Kerry just won 10 electoral votes in Wisconsin.

Bush: 254

Kerry: 252

[Pathy 0]

BBC 2nds that.

[whisperFFW06 0]

[*] The electoral collage should be dumped in favour of a popular vote. When you are voting for the president, you are not voting as New Yorkers or Californians etc, but as Americans.

This is done so that vote is not decided by NYC and California alone. It's a (slight?) re-weighting of states, IMHO not so bad.

[theavonlady 2]

[*] The electoral collage should be dumped in favour of a popular vote. When you are voting for the president, you are not voting as New Yorkers or Californians etc, but as Americans.

This is done so that vote is not decided by NYC and California alone. It's a (slight?) re-weighting of states, IMHO not so bad.

One person. One vote. Dump the electoral college!