Assassinated german soldiers

[der bastler 0]

Some days ago there was a bomb attack on german soldiers in Kabul who were heading for their airplane home.

I just could find out that most of the killed or wounded soldiers belong to my former regiment (now: battalion).

Anyway, a last salute to the comrades who died in Afghanistan.

(Casualties in foreign countries are unusual for the modern german army --especially because nearly all german soldiers are not directly involved in hostilities)

[USSoldier11B 0]

Very sad, my repects.

The first coalition KIA in Afghanistan was a Special Forces soldier from my batallion.

[FALLOUTFUN 0]

USSoldier11B are u special forces?

[IsthatyouJohnWayne 0]

respects to the dead and their families.

They were actually heading for their plane home? That is very tragic

[killagee 0]

Truly Tragic. Also the Spanish soldiers who's plane crashed on their way home...

[FSPilot 0]

They've got my respects.

[GoOB 0]

My heart out to the soldiers families and all who knew them. This is sad, sad indeed. To think they were going home aswell..... "War is only beatiful to those that have not yet experienced it"

My true condelences to these soldiers families, and my heart to all those who have been killed fighting a war, or those who have been killed due to war.

"Oh the beast that is mankind, best sought be to leave it alone"

[PitViper 0]

My true condelences to these soldiers families, and my heart to all those who have been killed fighting a war, or those who have been killed due to war.

War?  the situation is post-war in Afghanistan.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

My true condelences to these soldiers families, and my heart to all those who have been killed fighting a war, or those who have been killed due to war.

War?  the situation is post-war in Afghanistan.

[-TU--33ker 0]

My true condelences to these soldiers families, and my heart to all those who have been killed fighting a war, or those who have been killed due to war.

War?  the situation is post-war in Afghanistan.

that depends on where you are. sitting home in a comfortable armchair you can say it's post-war. someone who got wounded in a terrorist attack in Afghanistan might say something different.

[PitViper 0]

Quote[/b] ]that depends on where you are. sitting home in a comfortable armchair you can say it's post-war. someone who got wounded in a terrorist attack in Afghanistan might say something different.

hmmm.. true. The same could be said of those dying to palestinian bombers.

[Guest]

Germany isn't Israel. People generally don't get blown up by terrorists in Germany.

Also it's questionable how much the situation is post-war in Afghanistan. If you define "war" as high-altitude bombings, then yes. If you are refering to people shooting at each other on the ground, then very much no.

Edit: Bah, how do you expect me to respond when you keep editing your posts?    

[PitViper 0]

Quote[/b] ]

Edit: Bah, how do you expect me to respond when you keep editing your posts?

I put it back for you.

[Guest]

I put it back for you.

I'm moved to tears.

Anyhow, too bad about the German soldiers, but getting killed was a risk that they took willingly. I salute them for their work and sacrifice but I save my tears for the Afghani civilians that get killed each day without having any choice.

[-TU--33ker 0]

It was a true tragedy when some of our soldiers died in accidents in Afghanistan, but now it's something different. it was a direct attack on German peacekeepers! But we all know that this could happen every day in a conflict. the German people have to get used to such things as Germany is taking even more responsibility to establish peace in other countries like Kongo.

[FallenPaladin 0]

Yes, we should get used to it. I also hope our politicians will realize that we need better equipment and the best training, when they send us all over the world. Until now our politicians are happily castrating the money the Bundeswehr gets. Sending us to more foreign missions with less money. I wonder how that should work. Maybe I`ll have to buy my own weapons for my missions in the future.

Pffff... politicians and diplomats, they are the worst...

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]need better equipment and the best training

You have both of that in the german Bundeswehr my friend. Only make sure to join the right unit. Can you pls tell me what is outdated with our weapons ? We might not win against the US but for Congo or Afghanistan it will be certainly enough...for a small mission of course

[Donnervogel 0]

it's money. The Bundeswehr has no money. The equipment is available but often not affordable. An example are the Leo 2 tanks. The Bundewehr has a lot of them. But many of them cannot be used because they saw no maintainance for a long time or their parts were used to keep other leos running.

Therefore the Budneswehr can't afford it to send large amouts of the best equipment they have to those regions wich results in lack of good equipment for the troops not involved in the actual fighting.

[FallenPaladin 0]

That`s what I meant. Our sidearms are fine, e.g. G36, MP5 (different versions of it) and so on. Unfortunately the politicians don`t allow the Bundeswehr to buy new vehicles or don`t spend enough money to keep all existant vehicles in a good condition and running.

[FallenPaladin 0]

We might not win against the US    

Shhhhhhht!!! Don`t make it so obvious why I enlistened!!

[Balschoiw 0]

Leo 2 tanks in Afghanistan would certainly give the wrong impression to local inhabitants. We are no invaders or occupiers unlike others. We reestablish basic life systems, schools, radio programs and things like that. You need no tanks for that kind of jobs. Kabul at least was a more or less stable point for our troops.

And not to forget: You can´t fight terror with tanks. That´s an american failure in the thinking process.

You´re right. Some units don´t have max strength, but the role of the BW has changed from defence army to an army with an international role to play.

There are of course new weapon systems bought by BW:

- Eurofighter

- Dingo

- Infantry loadout

- Drones

etc...

You have to judge the role of an army and then check the material needed for that. That´s what is done right now and I am confident the process will be finished in a satisfying way.

On a sidenote:

I am in contact with some friends in Kabul and they say that they are completely satisfied with their equipment and vehicles. They don´t see the necessity to change anything in their vehicle park.

A risk always remains but the germans do a great job in afghanistan and will carry on. That´s for the people of Afghanistan only.

[Donnervogel 0]

common zthe Leo's were just an example that I knew of. I didn't ever say they should send those tanks to afghanistan.

I know in Afghanistan the troops have the best equipment available but the problem is the Bundeswehtr is at it's limit. If they send troops to other parts of the world they simply don't have the money to provide the same standart everywhere.

[Balschoiw 0]

Quote[/b] ]If they send troops to other parts of the world they simply don't have the money to provide the same standart everywhere.

The tasks currently taken by the BW were chosen wise. We are in former Yugoslavia, Cambodia,Afghanistan, Kuwait, Chechnia (military observers only) and some other places

For sure the capacity is limited as it is with every other country. For sure the money is also limited as it is with every other country.

Therefore the planers of BW´s military operations are aware that even more troops deployed to any other country in large amounts would exceed the BW limitations. Therefore we only will send support troops to Congo for example.

The BW responsibles would never send their soldiers with bad material into hotspots. I can guarantee that to you.

Also if you check the roles within the BW you will see that troops that arew used for foreign tasks have always the best equipment with them. Check the KRK and KSK forces. The ones near to the line have always the best with them.

You can think of the BW what you want, but they take their responsibility for their man serious.

[NurEinMensch 0]

That's right, currently all the good equipment is used in the various international missions, while at home there's mostly crap.

This means bad training at home, lower morals both to the point where "standard duty" isn't even possible any more.

I'm not talking out of my ass, I've experienced that enough.

How do you train a march (note: not march by foot )with your platoon when there are no vehicles?

It's no secret, the Bundeswehr is underfunded. Yes, it's mission changed from "fighting against the red hordes" to "defending Germany at the Hindukush" and with that change of mission comes change of structure etc. But what most politicians fail tor realize is you can't reform the Bundeswehr just by cutting its budget. You need to invest.

Germany has a sad record at delaying investments. "Jäger 90" anyone?

And there is is draft... I admit I'm a believer in the draft system and I will defend it as long as it makes sense, but even I have to agree the moment of the draft makeing no sense any more is coming closer every day.

But again most politicians only look at the money - and, weird enough, by turning the Bundeswehr into a professionals only force they could save money. I don't buy that argument.

My point being: Do the reforms but invest the money needed for them.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

Quote[/b] ]but I save my tears for the Afghani civilians that get killed each day without having any choice.

Very true. I assume the german public holds the same attitude.

The german army is undergoing a restructuring process. Many Leo2A tanks dont work because we simply dont seem to use them in these days. My friends that were stationed in Mittenwald however told me that they had relatively new equipment. And germany has indeed heavily increased and modified the variety of its vehicules during the last years. (See Panzerhaubitze 2000...no US tank can keep up with the same firing-rate).

But I guess I am going offtopic. Concerning those soldiers I am pretty sure that the families are proud of them and they can be. They died on a peace-mission!