Ai thread

[funnyguy1 0]

in OFP 2 it would be cool if you can get close to AI and cut his throat with knife    it weould be good for missions with special forces   or you can hit him with boyonet or something ;) but i dont want ai to turn to you when you got like 10 meters from him but when you run he will turn

hell no

I don`t think It`s a good idea, because, When somebody Is sneaking to you you`ll hear It right? And AI should hear it too:|

Splinter Cell and other stuff is not realistic, because of Sam Fisher`s super-extra ability to walking without causing any noice...

With the sneaking ability you can eliminate almost all of your enemies using only your knife, because you can snake to anybody without being spotted (I know that when you run it`s a bit different, but as I said, when you`re just walking there`s always something that makes you hearable (?

So knifes are ok, but how It must be implemented than?

I think standard AI "turning back" ability is ok...It`ll be a bit harder to hit It with knife, but the realism will stay...

There Is an option to throw the knife, but I don`t think you can kill somebody by throwing a knife, I mean, It`s possible, but imho damn hard.

Another thing Is the movement system, and new anims, this was mentionet maaany times, but if you want to play with knifes and stuff you`ll need better CQB mode...

So...knifes are some kind of nice addition, but "guns" stuff is imho more important, and they must focus more on this case,

when it`ll be ok, than they can think how to implement realistic knifes.

regards

[Friedchiken 0]

Well, if the will be a "'very' close combat" then maybe it should be proximity based on trigger with specific weapons such as bayonettes. Like that british mod. Then then won't be people bracing out their knives like crazy. On second thought, I think knives would not work, but a bayonette option may be more practical as people will still have their guns at hand.

[GabKa73 0]

Has someone here played the Full Spectrum Warrior Demo or seen some videos about Brothers in Arms?

I'd like to see a simple and quick AI command system like that in OFP2. I don't have the time under fire to tell every single soldier in my squad where to take cover or who to shoot at and I don't want to browse through a complicated command menu.

We need a simple point and click system and an AI that is capable of analysing the environment to choose the right cover and shoot in the right direction.

Ordering actions like pick up weapon/ammo or get in tank as driver/gunner/commander etc should be more intuitive and given with a point and click system. In real life such orders are given within a second with no browsing through a fat multi-layered manual searching for the right commands (and loosing five men because of accidentally choosing a wrong order in the hurry).

I strongly suggest to try the FSW Demo just to get an idea how easy it can be to give rather complicated orders within seconds in a firefight. Not that this game is in any way comparable to OFP or OFP2 but it has some really innovative ideas about a more intuitive command system and AI behaviour.

[Stryder 0]

Priority for me is definitely open-ended AI not CQB AI (tho this would definitely be a welcome addition... as of now CQB is a joke) since OFP *is* indeed mostly in the open... that's what sets it apart from the dozens of other tactical FPS games.

I think BIS should borrow some ideas from "Full Spectrum Warrior"... that game doesn't have near enuff commands for an open-ended game ala Flashpoint 2, but it does have excellent commands for CQB, that could be used in OFP2. Namely, the suppressive/area/point fire commands that can be issued, the fact that there is a "command delay" and you actually see/hear commander giving order... Also the AI in that game handles threats well... keeps all their guns pointed in right directions, etc... know how to handle a threat by themselves... to an extent. The simply "point-n-click" movement system in FSW is also excellent, the AI knows how to set itself up depending on where you send it.

These ideas need to be refined and implemented in OFP2.

Priorities for me for the AI are (in no order... they're all crucial):

1. Additional flanking tactics... flanking was already excellent in OFP but could still use some work

2. No "god AI" where AI can instantly know where you are and kill you if you shoot at them.

3. Correct use of weapons... M60 to provide suppressive fire (not just be the ultimate gun), riflemen to provide area/point fire as needed... etc... snipers to target officers first etc...

4. Better "stealth" mission AI... black ops AIs need to know how to act.

5. AI needs to react to dead bodies and signs of combat, and coordinate well with other squads flanking maneuvers and such, not just coordinate within the squad.

All I can think of atm...

That's all I can think of ATM

[SnypaUK 0]

Id prefer it if AI were a bit less well stupid when im placing them in editor. If i set them to combat then set them to stand still they start crawling off everywhere, ive even seen some run straight at a whole load of enemys and just get slaughtered

[Speedkore 0]

People dont run in open spaces against the enemy, people just hide in a bush, edge of a mountain, in a corner..., and they fire from this position, then hide and again fire. OFP1 seems a medieval war where all the people runs to enemy. So it is what i want, a human behaviour, not kamikazes if we want take things seriously.

Make a hard difficult playing doesnt mean to fire one shot and kill, because all we know, that a computer if we want will never fail a shot.

Last one thing is that you have to make the IA's much autonomous, because in the middle of battle, you can not be touching buttons for those silly ia making the idiot, they must recognize the situation and do the appropiate things.

All this doesnt take away, that i still enjoy playing OFP1, but we will see if it can be posible that one soldier like me, can not kill 40 russians in a game shot by shot, because this is not the reality. It's better less enemys, but well positioned, it is what i always expect in a coop, not a rambo movie.

Sorry for my english, i'm from somewhere of internet.

[JRMZ 0]

1) Make AI rearming easier from ammo crates

2) Put Human emotions in AI

3) I still have the feeling sometimes that AI can see through bushes and smoke. This has to be fixed.

4) Fix the AI driving bug. When they drive they either turn first, brake a lot or never drive straight.

[crassus 0]

I hope to see AI that can actually read the terrain. This goes well beyond the desire to have them not run into and over trees when you don't want them to, e.g. when in Stealth Mode, but seeking proper cover (protection from enemy fire) and concealment (protection from enemy observation) and yet maintaining formation.

I've seen some attempts to seek cover/concealment when told to do so, but they tend to do it while disregarding they're position relative to their squad mates. They'll run off to the furthest tree and not the nearest one, requiring you to order him back into formation...they'll hide behind the same tree another AI is behind, etc. etc.

A lot of ambushes I've planned have been ruined by "over zealous" AI.  

During movement to contact, the tail-end charlie in the formation should be covering the rear. Or when in a wedge or vee or line formation, each of the end soldiers should be at least glancing at their respective sectors.

[jakerod 254]

AI should randomly use ambushs or something. As in they should automatically do them when the situation is right and guys should hold fire until the enemy is in the kill zone in oppose to them firing the second they see someone.

[Shalashaska 0]

Use of Cover

- The AI acts almost like combat is of 17th century "Gentlemanly" combat, meaning standing practically in the open to do battle with your foe.

Although, we may give those soldiers Props for ultizing and practically living by a single code, which is "Prone won't make you moan [From wounds]"

Fire on them in the forest? Prone. Jungle River? Prone. Urban Combat? Prone. Desert? Prone.

What I think would be ideal Combat AI (And for that matter, Urban combat) would be a resemblance of AI Characters use of cover.

-This would be the ideal action taken by AI in Urban Combat. They come under fire, and move towards some solid cover to better orient themselves for the threat; NOT merely go prone and sit there like the middle of the road is as protective as a bunker.

- This tends to be the random reaction of AI in urban combat. In larger cities, you often have your comrades running down any odd street. Not so ideal; Players usually can butcher them with ease.

- The worst example, something I have to babysit my troops against doing when I command AI. Instead of lining up along the ridge to take use of its cover, you always have some dumbass running halfway down the hill to attack the AI Soldiers beneath (Who were staying and continued to stay right in the open plain, despite great cover and camoflauge located just behind them by the house) and leaving himself absolutely unprotected. OPF AI seems more intent on killing the enemy than they themselves surviving. I would rather see my AI more intent on surviving than winning. At the end of a scenario I just played on "Blood Gulch" (The perfect CTF style Island south of Nogova), the +40 Russian/Merc force that assaulted an entrenched Israeli and US Force had a stunning 4 soldiers survive the ordeal [Two of my men, myself, and a russian machinegunner]. This wasn't merely because of the difficult enemy, it was also because the AI disregarded trying to survive and keep their heads down.

Skill levels - Instead of just accurancy and rate of fire (I think it should be the opposite. Unskilled AI would burn through rounds in fear or inaccuracy, while skilled AI would be a crack shot and use less rounds) skill could reflect the more humanlike details of the soldier.

An Unskilled soldier could have his weapon jam, make poor use of cover, waste ammunition when they should know they can't hit the enemy, even be a little cowardly and be hesistant to advance and endanger themselves to get off a shot.

Closely knit formations - Something for MOUT style Room to Room or at least close urban combat?

The bottem line for me is to see the AI make an attempt to survive in OPF2, not merely take down the enemy. It would make firefights last so much longer if they actually had a fear of being killed. I swear I saw the Israeli soldiers do a Banzai charge around the end of the battle!  

[kerosene 0]

I've been thinking a "civlian AI" and a "soldier AI" would be nice, with some different anims as well as behaviour. I hate it when unarmed AI stand or crouch as though there holding a rifle.

Improvements to squad movement in built up areas are a must for me, Full Spectrum Warrior isnt perfect, But it would be nice to see AI taking cover, using bounding overwatch and moving to a waypoint using maximum cover and concealment. Perhaps that could be dependant on the squad leaders skill level.

[MrGuru 0]

Close Quarters Combat (CQB): this is the biggest thing that needs improvment. AI has to be able to do basic CQB of going inside a building and clearning it room by room and floor by floor.

Trackers: I think it would be very inventive and creative if we can have tracker dogs to hunt for enemy on those stealth missions gone bad.

Watch Direction: on watch direction .. just like in SWAT3 just order watch direction and then just look in that direction .. a lot easier and quicker.

Group size: It would be great if we can move up from controlling squad to controlling a platoon (36 men) or even a whole company (100 men+)! That would add a strategic depth to the game.

[korax 4]

Watch Direction: on watch direction .. just like in SWAT3 just order watch direction and then just look in that direction .. a lot easier and quicker.

You know, it seems like a lot of people dont know this, but to tell AI to watch any direction easily you just select the AI you want and hold down ALT, then click in the direction you want them to watch.

[ofpchaos 0]

The Soldiers musst be attack Flying units (not only AA Guns), Jets must can be attack with LGB (GBU) Bombs from very High Altitudes. Over 5.000 Foots and more. These must fly in horizontal flight.

The AI must can Disable and Enable. When the Combat Mode /Behaviour of soldier is "red" and "combat" these units would not stand when enemy in sight. And these don´t stay on the same place. But its not good idea when these units are in a house (on window) or behind everything. When i command this to: X setUnitPos "up" and X stop "true" these don´t fire on the enemy. Most of the units don´t fire on enemy when these is light obscured.

(sorry for my english - i hope i can help)

[sasyboy 0]

Please make it so that you can tell AI to go to sleep.  Also have responces like a slow wake up.

I love to bump people in the night while they are sleeping.

[Chiefy 0]

All I want the AI to do is scare me ****less in terms of their skill, but I'd also expect realistic behaviour. I don't want to be shot from 2 miles away by an AI carrying a machine gun, for example, I want them human.

A tactically-minded AI would blow away every other available game and would make the experience so much more complete. I agree, also, that CQB skills need to be boosted for a more rounded experience.

[The-Architect 0]

I don't know if these things have been mentioned but here goes anyway.

I don't want AI to be able to see through bushes, on the other hand If I shoot a bad guy and hide in the only bush visible for miles, then he should know to plaster the bush.

Also, I think AI should recognise dead bodies. I can kill a guy and have other enemy guys from a different group walk by and just ignore the dead guy. That should change.

[twisted 127]

the ai in ofp now is pretty good at times.

but this is about what we'd like to see..

1) AI that's reflects different levels and philosophies of training. ie spetnaz is going to engange you in a very different way to Rangers who in turn will act very differently than regular light infantry.

2) fear like mentioned previously. plus excitement, experience, panic.

3) ability for AI to regroup with a new leader if their one if killed.

4) AI that uses terrain properly and is as limited by it as we are (no super vision).

5) AI thats works in platoon, squad, fireteam and battelteam levels.

6) AI that uses real military tactics and vaire sthos tactics based on success rate.

[funnyguy1 0]

I have read this thread several times, and don`t remember exactly if it had been mentioned:

I have recently downloaded  mission from the editing competition, and realise that there is quite strange option in some menu...

Please BIS don`t do this to me...I hate when I`m the only guy on the battlefield who`s able to kill enemies, and survive...

Although the AI was quite smart in ofp, I think you guys did something like that in previous campaigns. And it`s rather popular in fps games, but god no, in ofp!?

When the difficulty is rising, AI should be smarter on both sides imho...

edit: I have mixed up something with the .jpg file, i`ll try to paste it again...//// ok it`s working now

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

I got only one important note

OFP2 should enable the interaction of different squads for tactical purposes. Right now it is rather a bunch of chickens running around without any clear structure or strategy.

E.g. Any enemy AI should be able to call any enemy bmp for support.

[Extremeus Decimus 0]

All these suggestions, if implented would make ofp 2 the ultimate tactical action game imo, i agree with you there Albert Schweizer, having mutally supportive squads who share tactical information then put it to good use would indeed add alot of atmosphere and make the AI more of a "realistic" challenge.

[Albert Schweitzer 10]

okay.. well hmmm that is what I wanted to say... thanks for exposing my lack of rethorical precision!

[ruff 102]

Watch Direction: on watch direction .. just like in SWAT3 just order watch direction and then just look in that direction .. a lot easier and quicker.

You know, it seems like a lot of people dont know this, but to tell AI to watch any direction easily you just select the AI you want and hold down ALT, then click in the direction you want them to watch.

are you serious?

cause ive never read that anywhere on the manual

i will try it

my suggestion is more crouching than proning

like if you order ai behaviour danger they crouch not prone they prone only when you order them to get down

that also means better cqb ai

also one fucntion would be in the action menu to select cqb or lrb which gives certain configs to ai if chosen cqb the ai and you can shoot accurate at close ranges and moves are more refined like walking with a weapon etc but shoot crappy at long ranges and vice versa for long range commands

[funnyguy1 0]

I think I don`t have a technical solution...just a suggestion.

But here it goes:

I want ofp2 AI to be more...hmm...careful

It`s kind of summary of my suggestions concerning AI.

AI should move slowly, slower than ofp AI does.

It should be able to use objects as a cover, while moving

(for ex leaning out of the wall, vehicle), and do It wisely.

While moving through the built up area AI should check the corners, (as I said, move slower), keep the formation (especially in CQB), sticking to the walls.

Something must be done with the startled AI..

It`s rather obvious that if you`ve heard the shots, you won`t run from one side street to another madly.

You`ll lie down, but you`ll lie down behind a cover, not in the middle of the road.

I`m just dreaming of a perfect AI in ofp2, but seriously,

making AI more carefull will enforce ppl to act more carefully while playing the game.

[ruff 102]

also ai heli pilots being better than now

if someone is shooting a mg at them the helicopter should be able to blow him away rather quick