Ai thread

[BeerHunter 0]

You guys do know there's a "HOLD FIRE" and "OPEN FIRE" command..right?

I've never had a problem putting my squad in a "do not fire" position then if one calls out he has a target , I can decide whether or not to allow him to fire.

I can also ask one or two to watch a direction I know the enemy is going to come from and they will "cover" our withdrawal.

Sure you have to manage them but IRL if you're a squad leader , you have to manage your squad (firing arcs , positioning , targets etc.) so this is actually pretty damn close to real life.

Sure there are some problems but for the most part , the AI are more intelligent than a lot of human players because they won't plink away at a distant target revealing your position (unless you allow them to).

[nyran125 10]

lol, im just putting my 2 cents in with some of these suggestions for th Ai. SERIOUSLY.

Especially the "i want the Ai to be more Human" people. Define what you meen by more human?

Ok lets have a look at some examples of "Emotional soldiers" in the heat of battle. The AI like in REAL life need to be told what to do and they need to just say YES SIR. THAT IS IT. You dont want a military simulation game to have a silly human emotional character twist to it, because that is NOT realistic. YES soldiers have emotions like any human being before they go into battle, but when it comes to the middle of the battle, they need to just say YES SIR and get on with it so no mistakes are made.

The Ai in this game as robotic sounding as it is, Is more realistic than what your giving it credit for (even though it sounds wierd).

Oh yeah just a side note :> WHat the hell do you want the Ai to do to a tank without a launcher???? throw rocks at it? Grenades do NOT destroy tanks in real life. what do you expect the Ai to do? I dont understand that post at all. If a tank is coming and you dont have the equipment to destroy it, you better run. Or dive behind the nearest wall and tell your Ai buddies to go prone. Or better yet, if you have alot of Ai guys your controlling try grouping them with different colours, Red team etc and order them to get behind cover QUICK. Then run the hell away. Secondly why are you doing missions with tanks without the right equipment???? Sorry this is a simulation type game not call of duty, grenades dont kill armoured vehicles to well, but an after thought has occured to me, even in Call of duty 4 in the missions that you take out Tanks you needed large artillary to do so. In Arma 2 You have a demo expert that has mines, try using the men that ACTUALLY take out Tanks, not just normal Ai soldiers. Then tell the Ai guy to kill the friggin tank, EASY.

+ go on You tube , look up Iraq / soldiers or US troops or whatever and just look at how they really move or run, especially for the Arma 2 players that are complaining about the speed of your Ai. People move pretty slow in real life too, UNLESS they need to run for cover.

I do have to agree with some stuff though. Like telling your Ai guys to get behind cover and they sometimes got to the FRONT of cover, yes THAT IS ANNOYING and needs to be fixed. The Ai should always find cover behind something so they actually have cover, instead sometimes the Ai hide or move in front of the cover and that meens DEATH. You should watch some of the Troops trying to clean out certain buildings with the amount of sht they carry on thier backs ,some of them look like they are struggling to move through rooms and hallways in their gear, backpacks etc.

Edited October 11, 2009 by nyran125

[Mclan 10]

Something i get increasingly annoyed about when it comes to the AI in my own squad is that the medics doesnt do crapola when they or any AI team member is hurt. The medic gets hurt and sits and wait for ME to tell him to heal... Is that missed by BIS or a feature? They die if I dont tell them to heal - themselves. As well as another AI in my team that gets hit should call the medic himself.

Hope this gets fixed.

Yes, I totally don't understand why ArmA2's AI, someone said it's smarter than OFP, but for me, it's totally no any fun control a squard in Arma series.

several days ago, I play a mission. No7 is injured, I ask medic to heal him, my smarter medic run away, for a while, I found he stand by a bus station, and look around with his gun, but the small city already occupied by us right now. Finally My poor No 7 dead for without heal in time.

Then I ask all teamates to a new position, that medic still stand there, OK, I guess the small bus station block it, I find a jeep to crash it in order to help him, not work, the bus station is too strong than OFP's one. No matter how, I order him mount my car when I switch outside view, seems not work, when I back to inside, I found my smartest medic was already there :j:

update:

yesterday play SP mission Behind enemy line, in one scene, I order all teams follow me rush througn road and in the front forest when enemy armed car is not close in yet, but tried many times, the Bxxx-shxx AI always slow and enjoy fighting back with enemy armed car, always cause lot of them blown away, I totally don't understand one squard, teammates don't follow a leader's order, it can be called smart?

Edited October 21, 2009 by Mclan

[kuIoodporny 45]

fabrizio_T is preparing an interesting addon. IMHO it should be done ages ago by BI programmers.

[Alpha_Scurge 10]

The AI is Buggy that is Understandable due to the fact the game is so large. But When you call for a copter and It hovers over an Empty paddock, that is just cruelty to me :P

If anything the AI should be able to posses the Human Quality of Judgement. Whether or Not its a Clear Space, or if landing you in the middle of a dam is acceptable. AI will always be asked to be 'Upgraded' and we can never really be satisfied, A) Because where Human, and B) because were all different. In some cases the AI will be good, but tiny little pieces need adjusting. For Arma 2, the AI is good in All cases, but Buggy.

[CarlGustaffa 4]

Especially the "i want the Ai to be more Human" people. Define what you meen by more human?

Selv preservation. A desire to stay alive. Hide when overpowered. Don't do suicide runs. Retreat to cover and screen the retreat if possible.

AI on its own will just sit there waiting to get shot by a tank if they can't fight it. Would you?

Emotional AI? What was that about? :eek:

Pick only the fights you can win. I agree. But the first thing to be destroyed in a war situation is the plan.

Edit: And that addon looks extremely promising.

[TomBabmo 10]

Emotional AI? What was that about? :eek:

Soldiers dig up their tissues and start sobbing?

[Trapper 0]

yesterday play SP mission Behind enemy line, in one scene, I order all teams follow me rush througn road and in the front forest when enemy armed car is not close in yet, but tried many times, the Bxxx-shxx AI always slow and enjoy fighting back with enemy armed car, always cause lot of them blown away, I totally don't understand one squard, teammates don't follow a leader's order, it can be called smart?

So did you order them "Aware" + "Hold Fire" to run across this road with you, and "Stealth" or "Hide" afterwards in the forest?

Because it sounds like you lead them in a slow mode (either Danger or Stealth) across the street and didn't order them to "Hold Fire" on that move. If you did order "Hold Fire" and they still opened up it was supposed to have the first shot because they noticed to be noticed by the car already. But still this detection isn't perfect in 1.04 IIRC.

[ricoadf 0]

What does everyone thing and what other improvements or changes to the ai they would love to see?

COLINMAN

I would like to see the AI not running around like chooks with their heads chopped off when u say hold fire and stay in formation, I'd like to see AI that doesnt shoot you through walls, trees and even terrain, and an AI that can drive better than my 80yo grandmother (I'm not joking either, this AI is stupid behind the wheel).

Bring back ArmA 1 AI, while it wasn't perfect atleast it followed orders and knew how to drive on the road :rolleyes: lol.

Ofcourse doing better than A1 would be prefered :p

[Uziyahu--IDF 0]

Has anyone ever considered the idea of A.I. LODs? A.I. that becomes more complex the closer to the player the character gets?

[Aelin 10]

the ai is the best I have ever seen!I play from the time of the "war" between MSX and C64........

[OdmupP37 10]

I did a test in the editor, placed 2 Russian Riflemen infront of me more or less 35m , I was behind them so they were unaware of me, I shot into the sky, but they clearly dont react to the shots Im firing, they only reacted when I shot the ground close to them, they should atleast be curious to the gunfire behind them,another thing I find is sometimes when I have opened fire and hid behind some sort of foilage (bush, Treeline) They have pinpoint accuracy and kill me almost instantly, Its not like they saw me running behind the cover and fired blindly into it, First shot is usually into my head

[Uziyahu--IDF 0]

Part of human A.I. is A.I. that makes human mistakes.

Why don't we ever see A.I. fumble a grenade, dropping it as his feet? Take too long to line up a shot with an RPG?

[CarlGustaffa 4]

Because being AI they make so much other stupid mistakes humans would never do? :) Not sure about mistakes, but some randomization on times they take doing certain stuff, such as aiming an RPG? Haven't tested in a long while though.

The only serious thing for me would be AIs in vehicles being so damned able to score first shot hits. It would be nice to see them having to track fire to get on target, for machineguns, coax guns etc, like all humans are required to do. Tracking time (from 0-1 second?) should vary with distance.

I agree, they should react to any fired event in the vicinity. Maybe even friendly fire alerting them that something is going on. I have not experienced this from 35m meters though (haven't tested since 1.02), but at greater distances they seem completely deaf. I.e. in Domination, you can frequently see a squad patrolling in safe mode while vehicles are being shot to pieces around them :) It mgith be easy to mod it for the mission, but I don't think it should have to.

[Mclan 10]

So did you order them "Aware" + "Hold Fire" to run across this road with you, and "Stealth" or "Hide" afterwards in the forest?

Because it sounds like you lead them in a slow mode (either Danger or Stealth) across the street and didn't order them to "Hold Fire" on that move. If you did order "Hold Fire" and they still opened up it was supposed to have the first shot because they noticed to be noticed by the car already. But still this detection isn't perfect in 1.04 IIRC.

I know what you mean. I have been playing OFP for long time, so it's not a order problem, I already order them standup and at ease(in fact, in OFP, I just order them standup is enough to catch up my action, but in Arma2 too %^&*), the enemy BMP is still on the end of S type road, blocked by a small forest. so the so-called AI will be suiside to stay and counterback if not quickly cross the road the merge inside the forest at our front.:confused:

[otrebla_snake_ita 2]

BIS must improve Anti Tank soldiers' AI too: they love to stay in an open field while an enemy tank (or APC) shoots 'em down...while they're switching to their RPG ò.ò.

Do they know what are covers?

[Uziyahu--IDF 0]

Because being AI they make so much other stupid mistakes humans would never do? :) Not sure about mistakes, but some randomization on times they take doing certain stuff, such as aiming an RPG? Haven't tested in a long while though.

The only serious thing for me would be AIs in vehicles being so damned able to score first shot hits. It would be nice to see them having to track fire to get on target, for machineguns, coax guns etc, like all humans are required to do. Tracking time (from 0-1 second?) should vary with distance.

I can see you have a pretty good handle on the deficiencies of the A.I.

Yeah, I have an idea for a mod to deal with the A.I. perfectly leading a moving target.

The rough-draft idea is to have an invisible target (or the real vehicle "target", the part of the vehicle that the A.I. aims at) orbit the vehicle at increasing distance (randomly changing the azimuth of its orbit every second or so) with increased movement speed of its host vehicle. Hits on the vehicle would cumulatively decrease the distance of the orbiting target. This would allow for chance hits and also for the A.I. to correct their aim based on their perceived hits. Once the A.I. had "zeroed in", a significant change of the vehicle's speed and/or vector would require a new zeroing process to be carried out by the firing unit.

It could apply to soldiers and ground vehicles, as well as aircraft.

Unfortunately, the target's orbit would have to be calculated on a per-A.I. basis, as one A.I.'s perspective on the target would be different than another's. (For example, an AA gunner might be firing on a distant enemy jet while a friendly jet was on its tail. Perceived speed and vector of the enemy target would be different for each allied unit.)

The current model of dispersion (which seems to have been partially implemented to keep enemy fire on moving targets from being immediately catastrophic) means that the target is always in the center of the A.I.'s random cone of fire, exactly where an evasive unit would be working to stay out of.

[irR4tiOn4L 10]

Just a little request, could you implement a delay between a unit being shot and reporting that to squadmates?

At the moment if one member of a squad is far away from the others a single silenced lethal shot will not alert the others, however even two shots a split second apart (such as a burst to the chest) will immediately alert the others.

This is quite annoying and artificial and means you always have to go for headshots as a spec ops, which is not really realistic

[Psychopathus 10]

@Uziyahu--IDF: the idea of placing an invisible target would also work on supressing fire, I've read somewhere in this forum there's a mod for Arma that do just that.

But the biggest game breaker to me is (it's been said before): you're walking slowly and crouched in a forest with lots of bushes. Then, suddenly, your character says "Enemy man front far" (but you can't see a thing) or worse, someone says "Enemy helicopter in <place city name>", then you switch to the unit and you can only see trees and bushes!

It's a huge gamebreaker but it's good to have some AI soldiers in your team: they are walking radars!

[NoRailgunner 0]

AI desperately needs some tuning and bugfixing too!

What about additional modules to improve AI combat behaviour eg:

for aircraft

- air combat module

- air-to-ground combat module

- support/transport module

for vehicles

- ground combat module

- ground-to-air module

- support/transport module

for troops

- ground combat - open range module

- ground combat - close range module

- support/transport module

[Mastiff 10]

is there away to stop the AI from seeing through trees and brush I cant see through it they shouldn't see through unless BI gave them Flir?

[irR4tiOn4L 10]

is there away to stop the AI from seeing through trees and brush I cant see through it they shouldn't see through unless BI gave them Flir?

They dont see through trees or bushes, but you have to make sure none of you is visible. They also have a hard time spotting you in grass, but seem to be able to see through it when they lie down (ie they still shoot)

[nkenny 1051]

Sharing is caring. Old Ghost Recon AI.

http://www.ghostrecon.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=52927&st=0

[Comanche3G 10]

I think AI should implement the following for vehicle operation

1. a road/offroad option for ground vehicles. This would significantly enhance the cohesion of a convoy, which AI have a ghastly time trying to keep together).

2. A pilot altitude option (This would facilitate landing as well, when you can set the altitude to 0).

3. Last time I tested, choosing a facing direction for a pilot didn't work. I would really like to see better AI piloting commands so I can jump in the gun with an AI pilot for a change instead of only driving. Firing the cannon in camera view is so much fun.

4. Keep up the good work guys, this AI pisses me off WAAAAY less than the previous games.

[Radnik 18]

http://www.bistudio.com/developers-blog/real-virtuality-going-multicore_en.html