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Tyl3r99

Will the beloved 3d editor (EDEN) ever return?

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Now there is actually some forums ill get the party started ūüôā

 

In reference to my ticket T165193

 

will the beloved 3d editor ever make a return to Enfusion or Arma again? 

 

Some people will say that the new editor is a lot more powerful which yes it probably is but it's also a lot less user friendly and time consuming for those who just want to play around making quick small missions to play either with friends or with AI. 

 

A lot of people spent thousands and thousands of hours just playing around in that editor like myself. 

 

I don't want to go through the daunting task of following a 132 page guide on how to start building a mission every time I want to play. Eden editor was perfect for what it was and a masterpiece 

 

Anyway what does everyone else think? 

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I agree with you 100%.. I personally never play online I really enjoy creating my own small missions and playing different scenarios. Hopefully the editor will return, if not for Reforger, at least for Arma 4.

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you did receive an answer already. I Think there is no more one can tell you about:

Quote

Khaosmatic added a subscriber: Khaosmatic.Sun, May 22, 8:49 PM

There is no confirmation on whether or not they aren't going to be adding the editor so not sure why you are requesting it. It's a very complex part of the game that more than likely isn't ready yet, hence it being missing at the moment.

The editor in the mod tools is a stand in I'm sure and not the actual intended editor such as A3s. Just wait, they know how important the editor is.

 

 

8 minutes ago, Tyl3r99 said:

I don't want to go through the daunting task of following a 132 page guide on how to start building a mission in the world editor. 

No need for that. There are several youtube vids out which show you how to do the basics like AI, waypoints and triggers...

 

The other way is to just wait as mentioned above!

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Change is hard. I get that. I had just started publishing sqf content after all this time. I have >8500 hours invested in Arma III. 

 

But the potential of the Enfusion Workbench is going to be awesome. When I first opened it, I said "F this", and closed it. But I've researched, watched videos and now am creating content. Not published yet but getting there. 

 

It will be a very long row to hoe, but in the end, I think we are better off with this system.

 

Maybe one the great community folks will make their own "3DEN" mission editor. There are some very talented folks here. 

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BI has said that the Game Master mode is a first step to an ingame editor. Unfortunately I just don't see how you could possibly do any meaningful mission creation on console, so I don't have high hopes for a new Eden editor. Ideally we would get a mixture of the current world editor, and Eden in the Enfusion Workbench Tools, so an editor isn't compromised by being compatible with console. An easier, more user-friendly (more Eden editor like) World Editor would be the best of both worlds.  

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Didn't someone already try a "Mission Editor" on a console for some other game. IDK. 

 

IMHO... Leave the content creation on the PC and make it portable to the game consoles. 

 

 

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As mentioned, there are various confirmations about GM mode to be foundation for future mission editor. In theory, anyone can open GM mode in Workbench and start adding new features. It is probably just too early to do that for now for BI.

 

And indeed you can use Workbench to create mission, but you're editing game on "engine level", which seems like a huge overkill for simple missions. I do remember opening OFP advanced editor mode for the first time and feelings were similar to opening Workbench (recently) for the first time.

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On 6/5/2022 at 1:35 PM, retrocz said:

As mentioned, there are various confirmations about GM mode to be foundation for future mission editor. In theory, anyone can open GM mode in Workbench and start adding new features. It is probably just too early to do that for now for BI.

 

And indeed you can use Workbench to create mission, but you're editing game on "engine level", which seems like a huge overkill for simple missions. I do remember opening OFP advanced editor mode for the first time and feelings were similar to opening Workbench (recently) for the first time.

to use the new editor you need to know scripting and the meaning of life. Whereas the other editor you don't need 1 simple script to make a mission really that's what I am trying to get at in terms of usability for the common folk  

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On 6/3/2022 at 8:22 AM, Blackheart_Six said:

Didn't someone already try a "Mission Editor" on a console for some other game. IDK.

there's been a few in some weird games like that far cry spinoff on the xbox 360, but coincidentally when operation flashpoint was released on the original xbox it contained the same mission editor as the pc version if i remember correctly. there was no writing or using of scripts and it was a major pain in the ass to use with a controller, but it did work and you could make some relatively entertaining missions with it. sadly, i highly doubt that anything similar will be in the console version of arma 4 which in turn makes me question what the true final editor for the pc version will look like.

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On 6/8/2022 at 10:48 PM, Tyl3r99 said:

to use the new editor you need to know scripting

 No, you don't.

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6 hours ago, haleks said:

 No, you don't.

 

That's not really correct, some scripting is required because there is literally not a single mission making tool in the workbench, only a few crude prefabs that BI created for their game modes that you can use in the world editor.

 

The workbench has a great world editor for terrain making, but not one tool for mission making, I believe this was a pretty serious mistake by BI. Reforger was always going to have trouble maintaining a player base because of the lack of content, and while there are mods, the lack of tools for creating interesting missions to use the mods in, compounds the issue of getting "over the hump" of having enough content to maintain a decent player base. Lets face it, Reforger's player count is nearing that of Ylands, and while the connection issues are contributing, the biggest reason is a lack of gameplay features, and content.    

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44 minutes ago, stburr91 said:

only a few crude prefabs that BI created for their game modes that you can use in the world editor.

 

So, just like Arma 3 and any other game then?

You probably want to read documentation on mission making before saying there's no tool to do so. The world editor is where you create your missions.

Granted, it doesn't have all the options/features Arma 3 offers, and it's a tad more demanding - but you can indeed make missions with it, and without writing a single line of code.

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I quite like the workbench/editor in reforger. I'm just not that keen on the game, it's simply a terrain rebuild to me (a very good one though).  The terrain seems to outshine all the other bits in there.

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30 minutes ago, haleks said:

 

So, just like Arma 3 and any other game then?

You probably want to read documentation on mission making before saying there's no tool to do so. The world editor is where you create your missions.

Granted, it doesn't have all the options/features Arma 3 offers, and it's a tad more demanding - but you can indeed make missions with it, and without writing a single line of code.

 

I've got 200+ hours in the world editor so far, I'm fairly familiar with it, so I know you can create missions with it, but as I've stated, there's not a single tool in the world editor for mission making. There are a few prefabs for missions, but a prefab is not a tool. People in the Arma discord trying to make missions were extremely frustrated with the almost complete lack of mission making features, and support from BI. Hell, mission making is such a mess that a BI dev tried to make a coop game example, and completely screwed up the task creation because there is no framework for such things. The community spent a week working with this example wondering why they couldn't get it to work before they realized BI gave them a broken example. BI then realized that they don't even have the framework for a functional task system, and that they need to create one. 

 

As far a scripting, you have to write out all scripting for triggers because there is no trigger tool with condition options, or options to sync to other tools. You can't even end a game without writing the script for it, so yes, you have to write scripting to create a mission. There's a reason why the missions available right now are extremely crude, and rudimentary, it's because almost everything has to be scripted out, and very few people have even a basic understanding of the new scripting language.     

 

All of this is why I believe that BI made a pretty serious mistake by not create any tools for mission making.   

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As i said in another Reforger post some months back, if they took the Game Master Zeus Wannabe, and made it functional to where

they added some dialog in terms of where you can edit a unit, vehicle, and or object's properties and states and enable saving, with some basic functions Eden has,

you would have your editor right there.

    The GM is essentially an Eden editor waiting to be enhanced, it aint Arma without the editor.

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On 6/29/2022 at 6:08 PM, stburr91 said:

You can't even end a game without writing the script for it, so yes, you have to write scripting to create a mission. There's a reason why the missions available right now are extremely crude, and rudimentary, it's because almost everything has to be scripted out, and very few people have even a basic understanding of the new scripting language.     

 

All of this is why I believe that BI made a pretty serious mistake by not create any tools for mission making.   

 

On that aspect, I'm tempted to say that the workbench probably isn't finished - I can't imagine they won't implement more prefabs/components for such basic stuff.

On the other hand, I'll admit I am somewhat frustrated too when it comes to mission making, and how painfully slow and difficult it is; but let's be fair : even in Arma 3, any serious mission maker will write bits of code at some point, so that's not really the issue here.

 

IMO, the perceived lack of tools stems from the extreme complexity of the new language and how its OOP nature influences the design of the workbench : since everything has to be designed with data/operation encapsulation in mind, it becomes increasingly difficult to design the versatile tools we are used to. You can do anything, but you have to do everything yourself.

I don't think we'll see any sensible improvement on that front anytime soon (or ever), and I'm a tad skeptical about Game Master becoming a mission editor in any meaningful way.

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