LAMBS Improved Danger.fsm

[mickeymen 322]

4 minutes ago, diwako said:

Make sure to update to the RC2, it addresses this issue

How to understand the update? I disabled 2.5.1 and I enabled 2.5.2. What else can I do?

The day before yesterday I downloaded the version from your links.

On 8/27/2021 at 4:22 PM, diwako said:

Download:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2434257231
https://github.com/nk3nny/LambsDanger/releases/tag/2.5.2_RC

 

You've probably lately done a reload of your files?

[diwako 400]

Just now, mickeymen said:

How to understand the update? I disabled 2.5.1 and I enabled 2.5.2. What else can I do?

The day before yesterday I downloaded the version from your links.

 

You've probably lately done a reload of your files?

The workshop link is still the same, jus the github link is now this one
https://github.com/nk3nny/LambsDanger/releases/tag/2.5.2_RC2

[mickeymen 322]

@diwako 

i reloaded files from github link, my error message is no longer present, thank you.

 

I continued my tests and now I would like to talk about AI-suppressing the empty sky.

Very often, I see how AI suppresses an empty sky in which there are no even the slightest air target.

It looks pretty unnatural, don't you have a chance to fix it?

 

Sometimes there is no air target in the whole map, but the AI will shoot at the empty sky for a long time. As a rule, machine gunners or APC shoot.
Sometimes I notice, that an enemy plane or helicopter is flying in the sky, but the AI will shoot at the empty point, where the this air vehicle was a few minutes ago, but not in the enemy air vehicle itself.

Now there is only emptiness, but the AI will supress and supress into the empty sky.  Could you fix this behavior for AI?

If this possible, Let the AI separate air targets/ground targets for suppression, so that air targets are suppressed only if the air target is currently in AI sight

[mickeymen 322]

On 8/27/2021 at 4:22 PM, diwako said:

 - AI spotting distance increased (100-200 meters in perfect weather condition)

 

I am very glad that there is LAMBS danger, for me this is the best AI mod. Big Thanks to everyone who put their efforts into this!

 

I continued testing for a week. For this reason, let me give my opinion on AI detection.

I think that in LAMBS_Danger.fsm v2.5.2 RC the AI detection capabilities seem to be too hypertrafied. In my subjective opinion, visual detection requires some corrections.

 

Some of my stealth missions have become unplayable, as the AI instantly detects the enemy, even under inpossible conditions.

I think, Now, the visual detection distance of the AI is not naturally large and it seems that the AI will not take into account whether it detects the enemy with the help of Night vision device or without it, what mode this AI currently has (safe or danger mode), whether the enemy is moving while lying or standing. Several times, in the dead of night, I was detected by the enemy AI at a distance of 450-500 meters, while I was moving only lying down and did not shoot at anyone, while the enemy AI had a safe patrol mode. 

Seems to me, It is impossible at night to detect a crawling person at such a distance, but the AI ( one infantryman - AT rifleman without any optics devices) saw player and instantly opened fire.
I tried in the game settings, to reduce the AI level, from 1.0 to 0.85, but even with such a decrease, the AI sees the enemy at night and at great distances, through dense vegetation in the jungle. 

 

Overall, I like the sharp-sighted AI, but night and dense vegetation for player should feel better!

 

And yet, when an enemy is detected at a great distance, the AI will instantly shoot, but it seems to me that some delay is needed to simulate ememy identification.

At long distances, the AI must first recognize the enemy and only then open fire.

LAMBS Please try consider this question.

[diwako 400]

5 minutes ago, mickeymen said:

 

I am very glad that there is LAMBS danger, for me this is the best AI mod. Big Thanks to everyone who put their efforts into this!

 

I continued testing for a week. For this reason, let me give my opinion on AI detection.

I think that in LAMBS_Danger.fsm v2.5.2 RC the AI detection capabilities seem to be too hypertrafied. In my subjective opinion, visual detection requires some corrections.

 

Some of my stealth missions have become unplayable, as the AI instantly detects the enemy, even under inpossible conditions.

I think, Now, the visual detection distance of the AI is not naturally large and it seems that the AI will not take into account whether it detects the enemy with the help of Night vision device or without it, what mode this AI currently has (safe or danger mode), whether the enemy is moving while lying or standing. Several times, in the dead of night, I was detected by the enemy AI at a distance of 450-500 meters, while I was moving only lying down and did not shoot at anyone, while the enemy AI had a safe patrol mode. 

Seems to me, It is impossible at night to detect a crawling person at such a distance, but the AI ( one infantryman - AT rifleman without any optics devices) saw player and instantly opened fire.
I tried in the game settings, to reduce the AI level, from 1.0 to 0.85, but even with such a decrease, the AI sees the enemy at night and at great distances, through dense vegetation in the jungle. 

 

Overall, I like the sharp-sighted AI, but night and dense vegetation for player should feel better!

 

And yet, when an enemy is detected at a great distance, the AI will instantly shoot, but it seems to me that some delay is needed to simulate ememy identification.

At long distances, the AI must first recognize the enemy and only then open fire.

LAMBS Please try consider this question.

Just delete the range pbo, seems you are using local mods anyways.

 

The reason why we added that pbo and increased spotting was fairly simple. Testing showed under perfect weather conditions ai was not able to spot a player laying prone and not moving roughly 300 meters away. this was done in the VR terrain. so no grass or anything as concealment, this was bumped up to roughyly 450 meters with that change. we figures some people prefer the ai to be blind so we made it a separate pbo for people to just get rid off if they did not like it

[mickeymen 322]

3 minutes ago, diwako said:

Just delete the range pbo, seems you are using local mods anyways.

 

Dude, I misunderstood you. Please explain better

 

I am comparing two versions of LAMBS v2.5.1 and v2.5.2

There were no such problems in the previous version. It seems to me that no other mods are relevant to the problem.

Edited September 27, 2021 by mickeymen
Added info

[diwako 400]

5 minutes ago, mickeymen said:

 

Dude, I misunderstood you. Please explain better

Sure thing

 

 

[mickeymen 322]

6 minutes ago, diwako said:

Just delete the range pbo, seems you are using local mods anyways

I understood you. lambs_range.pbo - I need to remove it from addon folder, thanks!

Still Try polishing lambs_range.pbo up though!

I like sharp-sighted AI, but it should take into account more details.

[diwako 400]

That pbo is a simple config tweak nothing more. the ai just sees that well in arma. We wont be implementing our own sighting code as that is not at all performant in sqf. Arma has that built in inside the engine itself.

[mickeymen 322]

1 hour ago, diwako said:

That pbo is a simple config tweak nothing more. the ai just sees that well in arma. We wont be implementing our own sighting code as that is not at all performant in sqf. Arma has that built in inside the engine itself.

@diwako Can you please tell me what settings in the difficulty of the game for AI do you recommend if LAMBS danger is used?
I am interested in

AI SKILL and AI PRECISION

 

Maybe there is no need to remove lambs_range.pbo, just need to reduce AI SKILL to an acceptable value?

[froggyluv 2130]

5 hours ago, mickeymen said:

 

I am very glad that there is LAMBS danger, for me this is the best AI mod. Big Thanks to everyone who put their efforts into this!

 

I continued testing for a week. For this reason, let me give my opinion on AI detection.

I think that in LAMBS_Danger.fsm v2.5.2 RC the AI detection capabilities seem to be too hypertrafied. In my subjective opinion, visual detection requires some corrections.

 

Some of my stealth missions have become unplayable, as the AI instantly detects the enemy, even under inpossible conditions.

I think, Now, the visual detection distance of the AI is not naturally large and it seems that the AI will not take into account whether it detects the enemy with the help of Night vision device or without it, what mode this AI currently has (safe or danger mode), whether the enemy is moving while lying or standing. Several times, in the dead of night, I was detected by the enemy AI at a distance of 450-500 meters, while I was moving only lying down and did not shoot at anyone, while the enemy AI had a safe patrol mode. 

Seems to me, It is impossible at night to detect a crawling person at such a distance, but the AI ( one infantryman - AT rifleman without any optics devices) saw player and instantly opened fire.
I tried in the game settings, to reduce the AI level, from 1.0 to 0.85, but even with such a decrease, the AI sees the enemy at night and at great distances, through dense vegetation in the jungle. 

 

Overall, I like the sharp-sighted AI, but night and dense vegetation for player should feel better!

 

And yet, when an enemy is detected at a great distance, the AI will instantly shoot, but it seems to me that some delay is needed to simulate ememy identification.

At long distances, the AI must first recognize the enemy and only then open fire.

LAMBS Please try consider this question.

 

 

Dense vegetation has no effect on their concealement level unless you implement that yourself. BI gave uis commands to help but they themselves never impleneted them -so only if units are fully blocked from Line of Sight will they enjoy concealment. Here i made a demo mission off dynamic concealment from foliage and shadows as well

 

Also those skill levels your referring to are WAY too high -that also was never properly calibrated. Ill generally use  values like 0.05-0.08 for things like AimingAccuracy for Basic level troop. In my experience anything over 0.2 skillwise is Elite -thats why you always feel like your fighting Terminators which aint fun because they're ALL too lethal. Games need disparity so that you can enjoy different types of enemies -in Arma its all cookie cutter across the board

[mickeymen 322]

7 hours ago, froggyluv said:

Ill generally use  values like 0.05-0.08 for things like AimingAccuracy for Basic level troop

 

Are you talking about monstrously low settings, are you sure you are talking about game difficulty settings, in settings / game / difficulty / simulation / AI level?

If we look at the vanilla presets, we will see the following values:

 

Expert
AI LEVEL: 0.8
AI PRECISION: 0.7

 

Normal
AI LEVEL: 0.7
AI PRECISION: 0.5

 

So your values are microscopically small ...

I can't even imagine such values for myself, I've been playing Arma3 since 2013, I've always used these values:

 

AI LEVEL: within 0.8 - 1.0, but no less values
AI PRECISION: within 0.35-0.45, but no less values

 

Thus, all these years, I have used these values and enjoyed the game.

I like hardcore AI opponents, only sometimes it was annoying the excessive AI accuracy, for this reason I used 0.35-0.45 for accuracy, I find it comfortable to play with such values.

As for the AI Level, I have always tried to maximize this value precisely so that the AI can visualy detect me at great distances at the daytime, so that it is not blind, and I want to say that 1.0 is quite playable for the player, I have not noticed any non-human vigilance in AI players especially with previous versions of LAMBS.

 

Only after trying LAMBS_Danger.fsm v2.5.2 RC I noticed that the AI sees too unrealistically in the dark night.

Maybe I need to try to lower AI SKILL down, which I have never done before, I will definitely try. For this reason, I would like to know what values are used on their computers by the creators of LAMBS.

 

LAMBS team please tell your numbers for AI LEVEL & AI PRECISION in your settings ?

 

[froggyluv 2130]

2 hours ago, mickeymen said:

Are you talking about monstrously low settings, are you sure you are talking about game difficulty settings, in settings / game / difficulty / simulation / AI level?

If we look at the vanilla presets, we will see the following values:

 

Expert
AI LEVEL: 0.8
AI PRECISION: 0.7

 

Normal
AI LEVEL: 0.7
AI PRECISION: 0.5

 

Did you not understand what i was saying -as far as BI not properly calibrating AI skills and subSkills? Nevermind, carry on

[mickeymen 322]

5 hours ago, froggyluv said:

 

Did you not understand what i was saying -as far as BI not properly calibrating AI skills and subSkills? 

 

Hey dude, I long time playing Arma 3 on the settings I specified above (decimal fractions - 0.0), and now you urge me to lower the values to hundredths (0.00).

I admit that the BI is incorrectly calibrated, but I that if it is really incorrectly calibrated, there cannot be such a huge difference! It shouldn't have hundredths (0.00) in any way, otherwise, you will play against AI-suckers, instead of difficult AI-players. I don’t know if you like it, but I don’t like it.

I've been playing only with decimal values (0.0) for over seven years, this way i got adequate and hardcore AI-players and I don't see any problem with decimals

 

[cooked auto 4]

So I've run into an odd issue.
I've been working on a mission using the modules for a while now. That has obviously created a lambs_wp dependency in the mission sqm file, obviously.
But for some reason the server the mission is meant to be played on returns a missing addons message for that dependency. Despite the fact that the server has LAMBS loaded onto the mod list.
Both me and the server are running the latest version from the workshop. I made sure to check that.

 

[diwako 400]

6 hours ago, cooked auto said:

So I've run into an odd issue.
I've been working on a mission using the modules for a while now. That has obviously created a lambs_wp dependency in the mission sqm file, obviously.
But for some reason the server the mission is meant to be played on returns a missing addons message for that dependency. Despite the fact that the server has LAMBS loaded onto the mod list.
Both me and the server are running the latest version from the workshop. I made sure to check that.

 

If the server is saying it has missing addons and it points to lambs than the mod might not be mounted correctly. You can check the RPT file of the server if the mod shows up as mounted and the pbos getting loaded.

[cooked auto 4]

2 hours ago, diwako said:

If the server is saying it has missing addons and it points to lambs than the mod might not be mounted correctly. You can check the RPT file of the server if the mod shows up as mounted and the pbos getting loaded.

 

Yeah, that turned out to be the case. Turns out the folder name in the mod list was written as .sfm and not .fsm. :p Thanks for pointing it out.

[nkenny 1051]

LAMBS Danger.fsm

Current version 2.5.2

Requires
CBA_A3

 

-- Changelog --

Spoiler

 

Added SQFC Support

Added Setting for Advanced Obstacle Proximity Detection for Suppression

Added vehicles main gun switch to HE or AP when engaging targets (#261)

Added Range PBO (allowing units to spot and engage targets at longer ranges)  (#246)

Added greatly enhanced suppression check (#249)

Added unified doGroupHide action (#258)

Added ‘suppress’ option to taskGarrison as an exit clause

Added variable to block auto artillery registration

 

Improved taskCamp, taskHunt, taskGarrison and taskReset with eventhandlers (#259)

Improved taskCamp by using ‘suppression’ event handler.

Improved stance usage in taskCamp.

Improved cleanup system of eventhandlers in taskReset

Improved Polish Translations

Improved Task Hunt with settings for Flares

Improved vehicle brain by accounting for Air vehicles

Improved doDodge function

 

Fixed taskHunt module not working in Zeus (#252)

Fixed taskAssault Zeus module opening when no dynamic target is created (#250)

Fixed civilian.fsm exit conditions (#253)

Fixed units attacking SuppressTarget (#256)

Fixed issues that artillery guns did not get readded in certain cases (#264)

Fixed assault/garrison issue with taskAssess (Units would fail to assault new buildings!)  (#255)

Fixed wrong eventhandlers being selected in the garrison module.

Fixed vehicles spamming shareInformation

Fixed the 3den Artillery Register Checkbox

Fixed Zen Action for TaskPatrol calling the wrong Event 

Fixed duplicate vehicle suppression calls 

Fixed doSelectWarhead errors  when gunner dismounts or is not assigned a gun

Fixed doUGL would throw an error if a player was in the array

 

Changed WP Strings now using Stringtables (#247)

Changed to using native hashes for artillery system (#263)

Changed findClosestTarget function added to main (#265)

 

-- Changelog end --

 

The long-awaited 2.5.2 is now here. It comes with a number of very interesting features. 

 

A considerably smarter system for evaluating suppression, armoured vehicles changing ammunition based on targets, the Ranged PBO, and we’ve implemented the SQFC standard for this and future releases. What does this mean?

 

The enhanced suppression selection system lets units more intelligently choose whether or not to suppress potential targets. Each unit will evaluate its own position and that of the enemy, visibility, cover and concealment, before committing. Units will still suppress potential or assumed enemy positions, but are less likely to shoot at pointless positions. The new system greatly reduces instances of uselessly shooting at walls in towns. 

 

Armoured, turreted vehicles will now switch ammunition type based on available targets. Soft-skinned vehicles and infantry will be hit with HE, while AP and APDS will be used to engage enemy armour. This much-requested feature will greatly enhance the deadliness of enemy armour. Consider yourself warned!

 

LAMBS Danger will also tweak AI sensitivity. This makes AI infantry much more able to spot enemies moving across open fields. Expect engagement ranges to be increased by 100-200 meters in favourable conditions. The use of cover and concealment to break visibility is more important than ever. AI ability to see at night, or to spot targets from vehicles, is unchanged.

 

SQFC makes code work more gooder. In more technical terms it is SQF code precompiled which the engine can load faster. Code execution time is faster due to compile-time optimizations. In practical terms, it offers performance enhancements to the AI. The full extent of which we’re still mapping out. SQFC is already in use by major mods in the Arma3 community with more to follow. We’re part of that gang. 

 

As usual, there are a slew of bug fixes and minor enhancements. The ‘Suppressed’ eventhandler has been added to garrisoned and camped units, which will make them more responsive to enemy fire. We’ve also cleaned up and improved the performance of many other modules. 

 

NOTE: This version changes (and fixes) garrison modules. For mission makers that have set particular exit conditions will want to re-check Garrison modules in their missions. Previously the garrison module would not apply the selected exit condition consistently. That has been fixed.

 

The team would like to thank our contributors:  Floyd as video editor from Gruppe W, @veteran29 for code and translations, and @MiszczuZPolski for translations. 

 

Shout out to our Discord crew. The team always enjoys the lively banter of feature requests, bug reports and after-action reports (particularly when you all die or get suppressed through bushes, Muahahaha). 

 

 

 

 
STEAM Workshop

---
GitHub

---

Discord

 

From the team

diwako / joko / nkenny

 

 

 

 

Video exploring the new suppression logic. Video made by @Floyd from Gruppe W

[froggyluv 2130]

Took the latest for a spin in downtown Saigon - with just a couple Garrison and Patrol waypoints -Very impressive !

[mickeymen 322]

On 10/3/2021 at 5:00 PM, nkenny said:

From the team

diwako / joko / nkenny

 

Big thanks for the great release! As long as LAMBS exists, Arma 3 will never die...

PS: In the future, If you will need to run some in-game AI tests, that you don't have time for, I'm always ready to do them for the LAMBS team.

[The_Real_Jammie_23 0]

I havent seen any similar issues about this anywhere else, but our server seems to be getting this error message when LAMBS modules are applied to Units in 3den.

10:13:06 Starting mission:
10:13:06  Mission file: Operation_Thunderbird (__cur_mp)
10:13:06  Mission world: chernarus
10:13:06  Mission directory: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\
10:13:06 mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item131/Entities/Item12.type: Unknown enum value SeekAndDestroy
10:13:06 mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item133/Entities/Item12.type: Unknown enum value SeekAndDestroy
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item185.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item186.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item187.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item188.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item189.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item190.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item191.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item192.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskCamp no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item194.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item195.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskCamp no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item196.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskPatrol no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item197.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item198.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskCamp no longer exists
10:13:06 Warning Message: mpmissions\__cur_mp.chernarus\mission.sqm/Mission/Entities/Item200.type: Vehicle class lambs_wp_TaskGarrison no longer exists
10:13:06 Missing addons detected:
10:13:06   lambs_wp
10:13:06 Warning Message: You cannot play/edit this mission; it is dependent on downloadable content that has been deleted.lambs_wp

What makes this strange is that the module functions could then be applied to the units via Zeus. Any way to fix this?

[mikey74 168]

I was wondering is there a way to tone down the AI rolling around like toddlers high on candy??? <---- I found it. lol I forgot you can configure certain mods in options. That said. Could you add a chance option of them rolling? IN FOA I randomized it a bit so they didn't roll evetime the hitnear triggered. I think it ended up around %25 of the time I would trigger it. If you can add that option. That would be pretty great. 😉

 

Your turret mod, and suppression mod totally complements my pinned mod. But Danger and Pinned together. lol The AI looks very silly when they are pinned for long periods of time because of the constant rolling. 

[mickeymen 322]

4 hours ago, mikey74 said:

I was wondering is there a way to tone down the AI rolling around like toddlers high on candy??? <---- I found it. lol I forgot you can configure certain mods in options. That said. Could you add a chance option of them rolling? IN FOA I randomized it a bit so they didn't roll evetime the hitnear triggered. I think it ended up around %25 of the time I would trigger it. If you can add that option. That would be pretty great. 😉

 

I don't know what you mean when you say "tone down the AI rolling around like toddlers high on candy"

You probably mean a super-fast roll when the AI is on the ground.

I managed to avoid this by using the TPW mod, which slows down the crazy vanilla roll animation and makes it more adequate.

As a result, the reactions of AI units look more pleasing to the player's eye. Try it!

 

I would also like to learn at least some options for disabling the AI animations that occur when the AI is under fire.

In this case, the player sees problems, that the vanilla game does not have.

 

For example:

1) the ai-unit can teleport - disappear and appear withnin 3-4-6 meters to the right or left of its initial position.
2) the ai-unit can slip in place, move its legs, but at the same time do not move anywhere
3) ai-unit will try to avoid shots (side or diagonal movement) with superhuman speed
4) ai-unit lying on the ground will rotate (roll) but not move in the direction of rotation

 

On the one hand, this all complicates the ability to hit such an AI, but on the other hand, it is unpleasant for the player's eye, especially when the player is a sniper and fires a group of AI from a long distance.

I've tried disabling auto-maneuvers in the LAMBS settings but it doesn't affect that. As I understood the maneuvers are movement, bypass for suppression, etc

It would be nice to see in LAMBS  the enable/disable the AI's dodge reactions when they under fire.

[mikey74 168]

@mickeymen I wasn't referring to the animation. ;) I was referring to how often they spin on the ground per bullet impact nearby. 🙂

[mickeymen 322]

7 minutes ago, mikey74 said:

I was referring to how often they spin on the ground per bullet impact nearby

Right! This happens too often. In addition, the AI will not always move with this kind of animation. A roll-animation without moving to the side looks unnatural