The Forgotten Battles

[Renagade 0]

They would never survive  

Does anyone  know what the server setting is so icons are only displayed on ur own side and the enemy have  none?

I thiink thats the best way to have it so u have the lement of suprise  on the  enemy wiithout chasing a  plane about only to find  its ur  teammate  

ps, were the tips on gun/cannon convergence iin this thread ??

[Badgerboy 0]

100 or less. Get point blank behind the bastard before you fire. You'll shred him to pieces, whilst saving ammo!

Hartmann (352 kills) would always close to point blank before firing, and would often take down Soviet aircraft with one cannon round.

[Tex -USMC- 0]

Wait until your target fills your gunsight. Then wait a little longer. Then fire.

The bigger the guns, the better. That's why so many late-war German aircraft have the Mk108 30mm cannon in them. If you have big cannons like that, aim for vulnerable spots. The engine, the wings, and the cockpit. Machine guns (especially German mgs) are only marginally effective for anything but making the sky a prettier place. Although, as Tovarish will no doubt point out, many of the Russian high RoF machine guns are absolutely wicked as far as pilot-kills go.

edit: .50 cals are an exception though. The P47's eight .50 cals can chew through pretty much anything that flys in short order.

[dayglow 2]

@ June 11 2003,17:12)]

As for the Ubi forums, be careful. They are vicious bastards!

Indeed. Our mods would have a field day in there, and that's just covering the (usually obscene) accusations of purposefully undermodelled German A/C- not to mention the new P-47.

try modding the RvS forums. It's killing me

[Tovarish 0]

 Problem is, we get engaged by 12 or more 109's at the same time, what the heck am I suppost to do? Run back to base?  i can't take them on with odds of 4 to 1.  

That's the beauty of a Dynamic campaign...sometimes you get put into situations where you just can't win, so you just have to try your best to survive.

Quote[/b] ]ps, were the tips  on gun/cannon convergence iin this  thread ??

250 meters on everything (cannon, MG's, rockets) works very well for me. You still get good concentration close up, and you can reach out and touch someone if needed.

Quote[/b] ]Tovarish will no doubt point out, many of the Russian high RoF machine guns are absolutely wicked as far as pilot-kills go.

That and killing 109 engines, those things are fragile (As the P-51's will be) Scroll back a couple of pages and you can see where I posted a screenshot of a 109's engine disabled by a single 12.7mm round (well, maybe not now, but later...damn college server seems to be down...as soon as you can see my avatar and sig again )

*edit* here's the pic again

[bn880 5]

Bear in mind, if you use DDR Ram, then the speed is doubled. I use TwinMOS 3200 (400mhz) memory, and run my FSB at 200mhz. Therefore my memory bandwidth runs at 400mhz. I recommend downloading Sisoft Sandra,as it will tell you all sorts of useful information, even for those not overclocking.

Well yeah I knew that, there is a certain multiplier. Sandra may be good but it annoyed me a little a year ago or so, so I don't use it. There is a little bit of stuff out there, I use MBM 5 at all times, just in case something goes haywire.

[bn880 5]

Problem is, we get engaged by 12 or more 109's at the same time, what the heck am I suppost to do? Run back to base? i can't take them on with odds of 4 to 1.

That's the beauty of a Dynamic campaign...sometimes you get put into situations where you just can't win, so you just have to try your best to survive.

I noticed, it's really weird, one mission we are outnumbered 4 to 1 (3 planes vs 12), next we are even (16 vs 16 or so) then 4 vs 16 or so. I don't really follow how everything is flowing in the campaign, but I can't take out 4 109's in an I153 every single mission, it doesn't make sense. Also not my fault my team mates sometimes all die without taking a single German with them.

This reminds me of a real air campaign, Tornado. Never seen anything beat the planning and execution of the Tornado campaign. Even so, IL2 FB is great as it brings back the feeling of Red Baron.

The engine stalling on the I-153, they need to patch that, there is no way the engine will stall when you pull negative G's, then later spin up to operating RPM without ever restarting. If it did actually remain at some RPM like 1000, it would immediately fire back up unless it's flooded or the magnetos are off. I imagine on the real plane it was simply extremely hard to pull the required 200rpm or so to get it restarted that's all.

[Tovarish 0]

I noticed, it's really weird, one mission we are outnumbered 4 to 1 (3 planes vs 12), next we are even (16 vs 16 or so) then 4 vs 16 or so.  I don't really follow how everything is flowing in the campaign, but I can't take out 4 109's in an I153 every single mission, it doesn't make sense.  Also not my fault my team mates sometimes all die without taking a single German with them.  

The thing is, unlike other dynamic campaigns, you are not a Superman in this sim. The performance of your side in the war might not reflect your personal performance. You might be doing very well, and yet your troops might be getting their asses kicked - or vice versa. I'm not saying this is always the case, you can possibly make a significant difference (destroying a supply convoy to an encircled army might be the straw that breaks the camel's back - or shooting down and capturing/killing a historical ace), but you're just one of thousands of pilots. As for being at a disadvantage - that's how it was early on. Try and survive, and it'll get better as the war progresses. BTW, the Chaika campaign is especially suicidal, they really like sending you out on ground attack missions, and well, this plane just can't take groundfire.

Quote[/b] ]The engine stalling on the I-153, they need to patch that, there is no way the engine will stall when you pull negative G's, then later spin up to operating RPM without ever restarting. If it did actually remain at some RPM like 1000, it would immediately fire back up unless it's flooded or the magnetos are off. I imagine on the real plane it was simply extremely hard to pull the required 200rpm or so to get it restarted that's all.

What I find strange is that I've read plenty of stories from VVS pilots who flew I-16's and I-153's, and they never mention negative G's really being a problem. Maybe they knew better and avoided them, but as it is, sometimes even the negative G forces induced by turbulence kills your engine. If that's how bad it was, I would have thought they'd have mentioned it.

[bn880 5]

The thing is, unlike other dynamic campaigns, you are not a Superman in this sim. The performance of your side in the war might not reflect your personal performance. You might be doing very well, and yet your troops might be getting their asses kicked - or vice versa. I'm not saying this is always the case, you can possibly make a significant difference (destroying a supply convoy to an encircled army might be the straw that breaks the camel's back - or shooting down and capturing/killing a historical ace), but you're just one of thousands of pilots. As for being at a disadvantage - that's how it was early on. Try and survive, and it'll get better as the war progresses. BTW, the Chaika campaign is especially suicidal, they really like sending you out on ground attack missions, and well, this plane just can't take groundfire.

To be honest I was hoping it is realism at play here, I know the war didn't go well at all in 1941 so I'm satisfied I am one of thousands of pilots. Problem lies here: I know how to strategically attack the enemy, not suicidally, like head for the nearest and closest airport they just took over and knock out their AAA(if any) then sitting aircraft and supplies... but I am not the commander, I am a Lieutenant, always in the back of the pack. I can't fart in the air without my CO telling me to follow his lead, when he's going to get attacked by 10 109's from the back (literally). I think there is something really wrong with the AI in command of the player, and I would like to see some damn war statistics like estimated losses, morale, supply issues etc. Then some nice objectives planning when I'm finally commanding the squadron. As time goes on, I have nothing but utmost respect for the creators of Tornado's campaign system, if you can stand basic SVGA graphics you can have a look.

Oh yeah, I don't want to be a superman, I thought every little kill I didn't make meant we lost an airport... but how can I know this without any tactical reporting from anywhere.

Quote[/b] ]What I find strange is that I've read plenty of stories from VVS pilots who flew I-16's and I-153's, and they never mention negative G's really being a problem. Maybe they knew better and avoided them, but as it is, sometimes even the negative G forces induced by turbulence kills your engine. If that's how bad it was, I would have thought they'd have mentioned it.

Well, I can tell you from a purely mechanical aspect, and I talked this over with my father who has some experience in engines as well, stalling the engine is not any serious issue in a piston engine if you can still keep some RPM after the fuel finally reaches the combustion chambers, the engine will start up immediately, unless it get's flooded, you should really have to lean it out as it's restarting. So anyway, the solution is, to keep it realistic I turn on Autopilot for 0.5 seconds when I get about 300rpm on the engine.

If they are going to make it realsitic, they should first add some misfiring as the fuel stops getting to the engine, then the engine should dramatically slow down and stay there until you can spool it up again with some good forward speed, then it should get flooded if you don't lean it immediately, if you did lean it it should restart automatically... if not a little bit later.

[Tovarish 0]

Problem lies here: I know how to strategically attack the enemy, not suicidally, like head for the nearest and closest airport they just took over and knock out their AAA(if any) then sitting aircraft and supplies... but I am not the commander, I am a Lieutenant, always in the back of the pack.  I can't fart in the air without my CO telling me to follow his lead, when he's going to get attacked by 10 109's from the back (literally).  I think there is something really wrong with the AI in command of the player, and I would like to see some damn war statistics like estimated losses, morale, supply issues etc.  Then some nice objectives planning when I'm finally commanding the squadron.  As time goes on, I have nothing but utmost respect for the creators of Tornado's campaign system, if you can stand basic SVGA graphics you can have a look.  

The AI is better than it was in IL-2, but in some areas it always leaves something to be desired, after playing against it a while it becomes predictable, and no, they generally don't make the greatest commanders ( I am very happy in that they now actually work as teams though ).

As for the micro management you are talking about, yes, I remember that sort of dynamic campaign from the Falcon series. It would be great to have, but in the end it wasn't what 1C went for. You're giving the missions to fly and you fly them, you don't get to do any strategic planning outside of the cockpit. I would guess that's how it was with most pilots, even flight leaders.

[Badgerboy 0]

Just restarted the German campaign, and now am battling swarms of 1-16's. Thankfully I've been practising my deflection shots, so the buggers are not little flying tanks anymore.

One problem with the Emil is the manual pitch. I've always flown aircraft (sim/rl) with a CSU. In the heat of a dogfight, I don't want to be faffing with 'gears'. Missions usually end after with my Emil struggling back to base with a smoking, rough sounding engine afetr 15 mins of combat.

Oh well.

[bn880 5]

Okay! I have finally restarted my I-153 in mid flight.

So far, it makes sense but it's a little difficult.

Lean out your engine first, decrease power to say 10 or 20 %.

Get some good speed, until you see some nice RPM like 500 600, drop the prop pitch to 0, that should translate your airspeed into RPMs quickly, your engine should slowly restart.

Well I have only done this once so the procedure might be wrong, but I'm going to try again.

[Tovarish 0]

Okay!  I have finally restarted my I-153 in mid flight.

So far, it makes sense but it's a little difficult.  

Lean out your engine first, decrease power to say 10 or 20 %.

Get some good speed, until you see some nice RPM like 500 600, drop the prop pitch to 0, that should translate your airspeed into RPMs quickly, your engine should slowly restart.

Well I have only done this once so the procedure might be wrong, but I'm going to try again.

Won't be able to try this for quite a few hours, but if you're right, youve discovered something that I haven't even seen posted on the IL-2 forums.

BTW, as a preventive measure, whenever I'm about to pull negative G's I throttle back to idle - seems to work.

[bn880 5]

BTW, as a preventive measure, whenever I'm about to pull negative G's I throttle back to idle - seems to work.

Yes I noticed this too, unfortunately I can't restart it again (big surprize eh). I did it once(well the engine was working well), but I can't seem to duplicate it. I get the RPM back up to 800 and still can't fire it up, damn I wish I saved the track! There has to be a way since the Autopilot can sometimes get it.

[Tovarish 0]

Autopilot = AI. AI Cheats, simple as that. Just look at the flaps on the I-16. As a human pilot, you either get full landing flaps or raised flaps - nothing in between. Yet the AI still has the full range of flap settings.

[bn880 5]

Yep I can see the Ai cheats a lot in FB, anyway, I can't do it again. Obviously my engine wasn't fully stalled before or something, I think I dragged it out of 450RPM and 30% prop pitch. I don't know, I'm kind of ticked off, I thought it restarted for sure, and I can get the RPM to 1000 and still nothing. DAMN IT. Definately a bug...

Sorry for getting your hopes up.

[Tovarish 0]

Well, turning on autopilot when the engine stops is a good stop-gap fix for now - though it dosen't work online. I seriously don't recommend the I-153 campaign unless you're a real masochist . You need some  damn fancy aerobatics around a well defended ground target in order not to be hit, and although the Chaika is fortunately extreemely nimble, it dosen't take much damage to bring down. Sooner or later you will get hit by groundfire, and when that happens chances are you won't make it back. If ground attack is your thing, take the Il-2. Otherwise, the I-16 is very similar to the I-153, but it was used mainly for escort, interception and CAP, so less suicide missions. Or you could start in a Yak-1, MiG-3, LaGG-3.

*edit* Oh, and if you join a Guards regiment, you'll notice your squadmates are much more helpful .

[Tex -USMC- 0]

And, as mentioned before, I-16s are more or less invulnerable to mg fire (I only did it once, and I think it was a pilot kill), so I have no doubt the I-16 is probably your best bet for early war fights.

at least on the Russian side lol. And this is the part where I tell you i've shot down about 40 I-16s in my Crimean campaign

[Badgerboy 0]

But Tex, when the occasional I-16 appears when you are finally armed with the Mk108, its a joy to behold!

Burn you stubby little bitches, burn!

[bn880 5]

Yep thanks for the advice. Anyway, I liked the dogfights in the I-153 a lot, the I-153 campaign is done, was only about 8 missions before we lost Lvov. Now all of a sudden i find myself in the IL2, which is so much bigger, tougher and less manouverable. At least this thing has flaps. The first mission is already a suicide one, no one is able to reach the bombing location... hmmm

The Chaika was great, sometimes I got 3-4 kills before something stupid like a stall, actually, whenever I had good success my engine stalled out due to this or that, turbulance in thunderstorms most often. The AI was unable to restart it most of the time.

I had some great times fighting without aileron controls or elevators, the resulting landings were a blast. Takeoffs were the most deadly like Tex mentioned.

I'm part of the 34th BAP VVS....

[Tex -USMC- 0]

But Tex, when the occasional I-16 appears when you are finally armed with the Mk108, its a joy to behold!

Burn you stubby little bitches, burn!

Hell yeah!

Anyhow, my Crimean DC has kind of hit a roadblock. This one escort mission takes me and my flight right over a crack AAA battery, and I haven't made it through once without sustaining considerable damage. And then the Commie bastards show up in 6 LaGGs and 2 YaKs, and at least one of them is a bonafied ace, as he tears my wingmates to pieces. Gaaaaaaaaah! The planes wouldn't be so bad if I didn't have to face them with holes in my fuel tanks, and that's when the AAA doesn't shear my wing right off!  

[Badgerboy 0]

The patch will rectify this,as the AI will not plot waypoints over AAA in the future.

I'm having the sdame problem at the moment. Currently I'm flying the F2, which nibbles awayatthe I-16 slowly. After nailing 4 of the buggers, I got hit by AAA from miles away which blew my wing off. This has happened three times now, and I'm a bit pissed off. (I'm actually redoing it as we speak)

I must have a dogfight or a co-op with you and Tovarish at some point. (Must buy Track IR first! )

[Tex -USMC- 0]

Well, i finally finished that mission (finally!), and it was an absolute bloodbath. 19 planes in all went down on both sides, we lost 11, and they lost 8 (for them that was a 100% loss rate). What I did to survive the flak is to hide behind a flight of 9 Ju88s and a flight of 4 Me110s. Once the fight was joined, things were an absolute mad house. Calls for help were coming in on top of each other, and I was watching engines getting lit up like zippos all over the place. My second Schwarm buzzed a flight of LaGGs and got two right off the bat, and I saw the 110s get a couple kills. I got 2, but I lost my wingman and my Schwarm leader. That finished up the LaGGs, but the Yaks didn't engage us and chose to go after the returning bombers. They got one apiece, but both got shot down in return. An absolute madhouse man, Il2 isn't designed to handle fights that big lol. Over 25 planes in the air at once, and every single one of them slinging out tracers like it was the 4th of July.

[Col. Kurtz 0]

@ June 13 2003,08:45)]Well, i finally finished that mission (finally!), and it was an absolute bloodbath. 19 planes in all went down on both sides, we lost 11, and they lost 8 (for them that was a 100% loss rate). What I did to survive the flak is to hide behind a flight of 9 Ju88s and a flight of 4 Me110s. Once the fight was joined, things were an absolute mad house. Calls for help were coming in on top of each other, and I was watching engines getting lit up like zippos all over the place. My second Schwarm buzzed a flight of LaGGs and got two right off the bat, and I saw the 110s get a couple kills. I got 2, but I lost my wingman and my Schwarm leader. That finished up the LaGGs, but the Yaks didn't engage us and chose to go after the returning bombers. They got one apiece, but both got shot down in return. An absolute madhouse man, Il2 isn't designed to handle fights that big lol. Over 25 planes in the air at once, and every single one of them slinging out tracers like it was the 4th of July.

Sounds rather exciting, I'm getting more and more tempted to get back into the game. I believe it was the crashing that drove me off, but I think that was driver problems, still I will wait for the patch then I will jump back in and try to work out how to fly a plane into combat with full realism settings and not get wasted by a I-153.

[Tovarish 0]

I must have a dogfight or a co-op with you and Tovarish at some point. (Must buy Track IR first! )

Did you watch the track of that long dogfight I had with Tex with manual vew controls disabled? if so, you may have noticed I use only the hat switch to look around (And I have a 15 inch monitor!) I guess I've had years of practice doing it that way, but most of the time my situational awareness is very good. Padlock works for some people, but I can always tell who's using it - they tend to fly into the ground when I drag them down low where I am king . This track IR gadget seems neat, but in all honesty I think I'd personally spend the money on a bigger monitor or a CPU upgrade if I had it.

And yes, we must have a game sometime .