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LOD Discussion

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So one thing that has become more and more prominent on my end is the LOD flickering, which, so it seems, was even increased by the splendid visual update.

 

The following video will make clear what I am talking about.

 

 

I removed the vegetation via CTRL + G to give you a better view of what's going on.

 

The issue however, does not only appear in the editor, but also during normal game play. It's most prominent on buildings, vegetation such as grass and bushes, but also trees. Furthermore, almost all rocks are suffering the same issue.

 

I don't know about you guys, but for me, this kills immersion more than any flying tank or bugged animation, so I really hope BIS will be able to fix or improve the current situation.

 

In order to help them, I'd like you to use this thread to collect opinions, system specs, grafic settings and locations where it's most prominent.

 

Feel free to post all related tickets here.

 

Thanks for your help.

 

 

 

Videos & Tickets:

 

 

System Specs:

 

Windows 10 64bit Pro

Intel i5 3570k @ 4.2Ghz

AMD R9 380

24Gbyte RAM @ 2000 Mhz

Drivers are up-to-date

 

Video Settings:

 

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This is pretty outside my realm of knowledge but does the LOD switch need to be instant, can it not fade between two levels to avoid this issue?

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This is pretty outside my realm of knowledge but does the LOD switch need to be instant, can it not fade between two levels to avoid this issue?

 

Thanks how it's done in more modern game so far I know. However, the issue is not necessarly how the lod changes, but when. The distance for the lods and objects seems to be kinda random. Some buildings, trees etc. change it very soon, others not.

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However, the issue is not necessarly how the lod changes, but when. The distance for the lods and objects seems to be kinda random. Some buildings, trees etc. change it very soon, others not.

There doesn't seem to be a standard in place with regard to the resolution (i.e. the numeric value) assigned to the various lods. Its almost as if (for example) building lods are numbers 1.00, 2.00, 3.00, 4.00 and 5.00 and then you have trees (again, as an example) with lods numbering 2.50, 4.50, 6.60 etc. As such, they seem to switch at different times when the resolution calculation (based on player's distance) is reached.

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This is pretty outside my realm of knowledge but does the LOD switch need to be instant, can it not fade between two levels to avoid this issue?

 

Doesn't The Division do that? The longer you're in an area the high res textures it loads, but if you're just running past it doesnt load the super high res textures. Plus they merge from one another instead of just insta swapping.

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LOD blending.It's nothing new technology wise.

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LOD blending.It's nothing new technology wise.

Yes! https://feedback.bistudio.com/T81246

This is something i really expect in Apex. There will be a lot of vegetation and if they will be flickering it would be really disappointing.

 

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this LOD switching happens in EVERY game, including the ones that use DX11 tessellation...not that obvious in other games simply because of the number of object on the screen at the same time, view distance etc etc etc

LOD blending / cross-fading is not a new tech, but as far as i know it can end up being more demanding, and besides, afaik, it is available on a handful of game engines (UE4 doesn't have this feature for instance, neither does CE. Unity does it to some degree though)

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My main beef with tree LODs at present is that they switch when the player changes the direction of gaze. Stand in a forested area and spin 180 degrees, watch the tree LODs changing. Spin back, and watch them change again. It's very distracting sometimes.

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My main beef with tree LODs at present is that they switch when the player changes the direction of gaze. Stand in a forested area and spin 180 degrees, watch the tree LODs changing. Spin back, and watch them change again. It's very distracting sometimes.

Yep hella annoying. Even more so than using "hella".

Is it me or has it only been more prominent in say last two patches? Think 1.56?Will run some tests on it later.

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This was technology carried over from dayz.Weirdly enough I don't remember dayz having this flickering lod issue.

Can someone prove me wrong?

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This was technology carried over from dayz.Weirdly enough I don't remember dayz having this flickering lod issue.

Can someone prove me wrong?

What technology you talking about? LOD switching? It's been like this since OFP. Same for ArmA1, same for ArmA2+OA, same for ArmA3...

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Tree Lod bug

 

https://feedback.bistudio.com/T116761

 

 

I have to agree, the more aggressive LOD switching in 1.60 and the "bounce effect" between LODs can look quite ugly. Many LODs are also different colours and shapes from each other, making the overall effect even more jarring. :(

 

Arma has some kind of LOD blending for trees, it would be good to extend this to clutter as well. 

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What technology you talking about? LOD switching? It's been like this since OFP. Same for ArmA1, same for ArmA2+OA, same for ArmA3...

 

Maybe I'm not thinking the right thing.Maybe I'm thinking about culling tech.

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object culling tech was always in afaik, but the new tech was indeed tested into dayz and recently implemented into arma3 as well. nothing to do with LODs.

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The problem isn't just the aggressive LOD switching but also the LOD flickering. When you approach an object at a certain speed, sometimes it can't decide whether to use a LOD or another, resulting in fast flickering between different LODs for a second. I notice it a lot with rocks and grass.

 

I sincerely hope Tanoa won't have as many noticeable LOD issues as Altis and Stratis. The reveal video left me hopeful because I couldn't notice any serious LOD switching with the grass.

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My main beef with tree LODs at present is that they switch when the player changes the direction of gaze. Stand in a forested area and spin 180 degrees, watch the tree LODs changing. Spin back, and watch them change again. It's very distracting sometimes.

 

Yes it's weird.

 

Sometimes if you look at an object, it uses a lower lod than if you look to one side of it.  Maybe there's something wrong with the maths or calculation of screen width (or it uses camera position rather than player position).  Just idle speculation but it feels like that to me.

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Does anyone here knows if the distances for lods are influenced by one of the grafic settings, like Model Quality?

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The distance of LOD change is definitely based on Model Quality setting. I have a pretty beefy rig but it's the only setting I leave on the highest because short range quick LOD changes are something I really can't stand as they are so distracting.

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I am also having issues regarding the layers of detail since the 'visual update' update.

 

My current graphical settings you can see here.

 

I have screen shot a few different instances whilst in the EDEN editor and whilst in game, which you can see here. (or check here for mouse-over comparisons)

 

The first 3 screen shots, check the base (branches) of the bushes whilst I approach them.

The next 2 screen shots (old outpost), check the doors/windows of the military bunker building as I moved slightly forward with the camera.

The next 2 screen shots (agia marina), check a couple of the trees (leaves/brush) as I slightly move from left to right.

The next 2 screen shots (custom outpost for A3Wasteland), check the sand bags as I made a slight move forward.
The last 2 screen shots (agia marina), check the white house to my ~11 o'clock, and the communications tower as I slightly move foward.

Previous to the 'visual update' everyone saw LOD changes, mainly in rock formations and not much else, but I (we?) accepted it and just played the game... and now it seems most objects have a harsh or non matching transition from the last layer to the next, and it is very distracting whilst playing the game.

The more I play the game in it's current state, the more things 'out-of-place' I'm noticing... and the LOD's are near top of the list.

 

And just for a FYI... my system specs are i7 4770K, 32GB RAM, r9 290 OC 4GB, 500GB SSD. (not sure whether NVIDIA vs AMD has anything to do with it.. I wouldn't assume so).

 

-soul.
 

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