Why couldn't all the modders work together, and make something better than ACE

[Gudsawn 93]

I think this was done before... A bunch of people got together and got all the really good modders together and asked them to make stuff that worked together.

I think it was called Advanced something? Combat maybe? I don't know, but it was some sort of Environment...

Oh you :p

[Ckrauslo 12]

And by this thread i by no means want to hurt the others ego, as i listed names and said only compliments to them

[das attorney 857]

My response to that is if you think you are talented enough, and you are willing to listen to other peoples suggestions and work with others to some degree (and it's very minimal) then why aren't you offering to work with ACE right now? We can always use more help!

Mate, I never knew it was like that. I assumed you were all sort of born as part of ACE or something and it was impossible to get involved with. If there's anything I can do to help out then I will. I've had plenty of gameplay from ACE and feel I'm in the position to give something back. This isn't some sort of arma phishing post to get information. I'd much rather know about the things you need sorted rather than the features you already have in ACE. PM me (or I can PM you). What would you prefer?

[Ckrauslo 12]

I would volunteer to help the ACE guys if they were in need of scripting "Mostly soldier gears", campaigns or templates for massive bases, but since they don't i resume working in the campaigns i'm working on with my mate Siege

[noubernou 77]

oh, i for one know that, it was same before. never have i said it wasn't that way.

Haha, I know, it was directed at the crowd. :)

[Ckrauslo 12]

And Noubernou no disrespect to ace and your work, i'm just trying to say that the community has a lot of potential

---------- Post added at 01:31 ---------- Previous post was at 01:30 ----------

I played with ace in A1 and A2

[Gudsawn 93]

Mate, I never knew it was like that. I assumed you were all sort of born as part of ACE or something and it was impossible to get involved with.

Same here, I've always assumed ACE was a closed/private group and if you wanted to contact the team you would need to send them an untraceable 1024-bit encrypted email via a proxy and VPN, at night.

[L3TUC3 32]

"Y u all no make me better stuffz?"

/thread

[Ckrauslo 12]

"Y u all no make me better stuffz?"

/thread

Actually is more of a "Y u all no work together more"

[noubernou 77]

Same here, I've always assumed ACE was a closed/private group and if you wanted to contact the team you would need to send them an untraceable 1024-bit encrypted email via a proxy and VPN, at night.

Well it is closed, and I guess you could consider it private, and it isn't like every response is going to end up with a person becoming part of the team. That doesn't mean you can't ask. :) Just be prepared to show a body of work demonstrating your capabilities. You don't have to know every trick in the book when it comes to Arma of course, I didn't when I joined, but you will learn a lot once you join. This is why we tend to recruit from the inside because we see people who are capable and demonstrate the type of personalities we all like to work with.

[eggbeast 3673]

in all creative endeavours there's also a risk of monotheism, which kills creativity.

if every good modder worked on ACE, then everyone playing modded arma might have to use it.

and it may not be to everyones taste.

in the past, i always felt sad that arma communities were split down the ACE / non-ACE line, and if you bring something out that doesn't work with ACE then people either dont use it, or they hassle the creator endlessly.

it's not just ACE though is it, because it's a fantastic idea to harmonise the changes, it's just that if one mod becomes too prevalent, then it can stifle the smaller mods maybe. I dunno. I just see and hear a lot of splitting of views when people are planning a mission night or a clan policy or whatever. you have ACE marmite fueling splits. there are others (no 3rd person blip lol)

Personally I won't go near it because every first-timer who gets arma comes steaming onto our servers with ACE on, and the server dies. this has been my number one hate of the arma engine since day 1 lol. I would much prefer a system where mods can be blacklisted by the server, so if they do damage your persistent missions, they can be prevented, without having to lock the server down so people cant play with different sound packs etc.

so yeah, good to work together, good to have an all encompassing mod, but it also has a downside. i think it's better to have mods fit for functions, like for a series of campaigns/missions.

but in A3, well, that's another story. you NEED a stable base of playable modern content, and it doesnt look likely BIS are gonna make it. and everyone porting a tank or a jet or some units or weapons is gonna send the gaming experience (for anyone who cares about balance across weapons for example) to hell in a handbasket. so soemthing needs to be done! good thread.

[noubernou 77]

Yep, the number 1 complaint I've heard from long time communities is the lack of enjoyable content to make missions with in A3. It just is too narrow. It is a specific timeline and specific universe and it really has stifled a lot of the creative potential that was there in A2, where the forces were the stereotypical Russian and US forces, which, arguably are just easier/better to develop scenarios with that are not the same old COIN type crap.

Getting good, quality, up to date, A3 implemented contemporary and recent past units in the game should be the #1 priority. Getting a cohesive collection of units of that type that all meet a certain level of quality and functionality should also be a priority.

That is what we are trying to do with ACE and other community contributors.

[BL1P 35]

Don't keys work for you Eggbeast m8 ?

For us we just place the keys of only the mods we want used on the server in the keys folder with signatures on and job done.

Admittedly this means Joe P. can't join with his favorite sound mod but he also can't join with his mod which might break the mission.

By the way using 3rd person and my name in the same sentence is against the law ! punishable with persistent nagging about 3rd person next time I am on your TS ! :p

Having to test every mod before you allow it on the server is a pain in the arse though.

Specially if its like the 4th weapon rest mod your testing or the 10th m4 mod etcetc.

Having a single mod which almost does it all as ACE did/willdo was a godsend from my point of view.

It meant I could keep the server mod updates down to just a few mods.

Its bad enough with only 4 mods which we use atm I would hate to have to keep track of 40+ mods on a server having to test each update or maybe redo the servers missions for each update in a list of 40+

I guess some server admins don't test each mod to see if it causes errors in the rpt or to see if the weapon resting for example was done how you want it on the server.

I think they just make things harder for the server admins who do, because Joe P. says hey blabla server allows this mod why don't you ? "because i'm a grumpy old fart thats why !" :)

[miketim 20]

NouberNou,

I agree totally with what your saying.

With ArmA 2 the "base" that ACE and everything else was built upon was very rich with content, and most of that content was very widely applicable and very nice.

They couldve done (albeit on a smaller scale) higher quality, with the whole arma 3 engine and that jazz, actual contemporary content.

But alas they have not... and we have to face it.

I just hope that the big mod guys like ACE are not going to rush ahead and make their own US Forces or something when one already exsists etc etc

(RHS US Forces, hint hint)

ie: I hope that eventually the overlap in content tapers out and we have high quality content and the crappy old reskin mods get left in the dust. :)

How sad would it be to see like 4 US Forces mods, but all half finished.

[eggbeast 3673]

it's hard enough making the basic game work lol. look at arma2 history... A2, then OA, then trying to get them to work together (in steam it didn't work until Dwarden fixed steam), then ACE inadvertently splits the community down the MP middle, then 1.62 betas and CBA goes beta only, then ACR lite comes out but isnt in the 1.63 patch, then 1.63 is ok but took me a week to install correctly, then dayZ rips all the new players away from milsim, then A3 comes out in alpha and destroys the heart of many modders... then dayZ comes out in A3/SA and is empty and kills the dayZ community... notto mention killing the server cost-wise owing to enormous bandwidth usage... then A3 brings out go-karts and zeus... ffs lol. where's the milsim community gone? we're all in bunkers with our buddies hanging on for dear life.

basically, we are very much in troubled waters. our approach has been to club together with other modders/ mapmakers / mission makers / gaming clans so we can work together on set objectives (in our case Evolution on unsung, BAF-X, DAF and PRACS and domi in A3)

taking on the task of fixing all that failed in the past 2 years in the bohemia world is just too big for unpaid people to do.... BUT... i will happily lend a hand.

warts and all Arma is still hands down the best game in the world!

Edited July 27, 2014 by eggbeast

[L3TUC3 32]

Actually is more of a "Y u all no work together more"

No. Not really.

You have a sense of entitlement that others ought to provide you specific high quality mods.

Someone's got to pull the weight and it's pretty obvious it's not you. You casually gloss over the fact that everyone is pretty much doing this as a hobby with wildly varying levels of skill. You have the gall to indirectly give the finger to everyone who made and released something not to your standards. And then you try to explain it by assuming everything would be better if only they only worked as group? That their work ethic is lacking because they don't follow your word?

Are you trying to take a piss on everything or something? Hate to break it to you, but it's not about you.

I would just sit back, be patient and have some humility instead of making a whine thread of your percieved lack cooperation. Nobody owes you anything. Your opinion matters little unless you bring something to the table and it's pretty clear you don't know what you're talking about.

[instagoat 133]

This has probably been said before, but I think it bears saying again for emphasis: ACE is and was built on the expertise of tens of dozens of people over a time of over 10 years, dating back to the FFUR mod as far as I know.

You do not simply assemble such a massive, talented and diverse team by magic. Without leadership and dedication, something like ACE won't come around. Additionally, building addons is now much more complex, which is why most mods nowadays do fewer things of higher quality, rather than tons of things.

[slatts 1978]

Getting a lot of modders together who all have different lives and live in different timezones isn't easy. You can imagine how if you want to organize a team meeting just how awkward getting people who live in other parts of the world who sleep while on person works or who works when someone else looks after their family is a hard task in itself. Then there's the potential of a language problem and people arguing etc. And that's before you even go public and get that pressure of constantly being asked "When will it be released?"

I'll be the first to admit I'm the worst person to have in a mod team. I work on a lot of things by myself, never finish most of it and don't com well :p

[theevancat 277]

Getting a lot of modders together who all have different lives and live in different timezones isn't easy. You can imagine how if you want to organize a team meeting just how awkward getting people who live in other parts of the world who sleep while on person works or who works when someone else looks after their family is a hard task in itself. Then there's the potential of a language problem and people arguing etc. And that's before you even go public and get that pressure of constantly being asked "When will it be released?"

I'll be the first to admit I'm the worst person to have in a mod team. I work on a lot of things by myself, never finish most of it and don't com well :p

We had some trouble with this on ASTFOR, since we've got dudes living on the East Coast of America, Great Britain, Eastern Europe... the works. Nobody's ever online at the same time, and when we are it's usually at some ungodly hour. Makes it hard to coordinate.

[PuFu 4591]

@l3tuc3: +1

[Ckrauslo 12]

No. Not really.

You have a sense of entitlement that others ought to provide you specific high quality mods.

Someone's got to pull the weight and it's pretty obvious it's not you. You casually gloss over the fact that everyone is pretty much doing this as a hobby with wildly varying levels of skill. You have the gall to indirectly give the finger to everyone who made and released something not to your standards. And then you try to explain it by assuming everything would be better if only they only worked as group? That their work ethic is lacking because they don't follow your word?

Are you trying to take a piss on everything or something? Hate to break it to you, but it's not about you.

I would just sit back, be patient and have some humility instead of making a whine thread of your percieved lack cooperation. Nobody owes you anything. Your opinion matters little unless you bring something to the table and it's pretty clear you don't know what you're talking about.

Mate i believe you received a warning cause you are being a bit out of your place , and i believed you haven't read the topic, this is a place to debate if the community can work better together, if people can get more along, ACE was a mere example, the emphasis on the Thread title is in the "Why couldn't all the modders work " that is why there is a comma separating the two parts of the sentence, the coordination sentence and the direct object , but if you are unfamiliar with the rules of the language or don't like debating and raising social awareness to things and just want to be take a piss here, while everyone else is getting along, be my guess i will be sure to talk with the moderators and see what providence's can be taken .

---------- Post added at 21:13 ---------- Previous post was at 21:09 ----------

And one other thing if any of you guys read my first post, i said only good things about the community mods, just asked why can't everything be used as one, as i think a "Community" is a place of collaboration and caring for each other, if you want to have a stupid ass opinion about me be my guess wont change the way i perceive the world, just will change the way i think about you

[PuFu 4591]

Mate i believe you received a warning cause you are being a bit out of your place .

1. nope he hasn't, he was just reported.

2. talking about moderation on those forums in not allowed btw

3. you have been explained that the "creating community" is actually working together in a lot of cases, just not on the same mod, for a number of reasons that have been already given here.

4. what l3 guys is trying to say is that in order to be taken serious you need to put your own time and skills into it: best thing to get something done is to actually do it yourself rather than expect others to do it for you (general rule, not something that is directed towards you)

no pun intended

Edited July 27, 2014 by PuFu

[Ckrauslo 12]

1. nope he hasn't, he was just reported.

2. talking about moderation on those forums in not allowed btw

3. you have been explained that the "creating community" is actually working together in a lot of cases, just not on the same mod, for a number of reasons that have been already given here.

4. what l3 guys is trying to say is that in order to be taken serious you need to put your own time and skills into it: best thing to get something done is to actually do it yourself rather than expect others to do it for you (general rule, not something that is directed towards you)

no pun intended

I've seen many cases where people said that if problems continued they would call moderation, and it was said to be the correct thing to be done, i'm not trying to make anyone do anything for me, what i can do in the game i do it my self, and i don't like people shoving words down my throat

[warlord554 2065]

No. Not really.

You have a sense of entitlement that others ought to provide you specific high quality mods.

Someone's got to pull the weight and it's pretty obvious it's not you. You casually gloss over the fact that everyone is pretty much doing this as a hobby with wildly varying levels of skill. You have the gall to indirectly give the finger to everyone who made and released something not to your standards. And then you try to explain it by assuming everything would be better if only they only worked as group? That their work ethic is lacking because they don't follow your word?

Are you trying to take a piss on everything or something? Hate to break it to you, but it's not about you.

I would just sit back, be patient and have some humility instead of making a whine thread of your percieved lack cooperation. Nobody owes you anything. Your opinion matters little unless you bring something to the table and it's pretty clear you don't know what you're talking about.

Someone is a little sure of themselves huh? I fail to see this thread as a "whine" thread, unlike the countless others that like to complain about what DEVs should do, or what they haven't done. I will agree that some folks may seem.to feel "entitled", and that's not right. But someone expressing an idea, that could benefit the community in the end, isn't hurting anything. Is collaboration possible, absolutely. Will it ever happen, negative

Edited July 27, 2014 by WarLord554

[kiory 404]

Ergh..

http://i.imgur.com/3WkwXkA.gif (2254 kB)

Edited July 27, 2014 by Kiory