Iraq (current news/events)

[Xalteva 10]

No ,this is not what i meant ... the general idea is that jihad is only allowed when you are under attack :) which is the opposite of what IS is doing !

Edit :

I tried checking some of those quotes ! and strangely some of them do not exist at all :) you might want to check what you're reading ! not everything on the internet is good.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Xalteva

[vilas 473]

are there different Quoaran versions ?

cause Bible has several version, some versions divide in Middle Ages when in XI or XII centuries, Bible was a little rewritten and put to different churches as different texts,

also translations to national languages from Latin that were done with Bible in middle ages were also different

cause i doubt those guys faked quotes , maybe on Muslim websites some people rather cut such drastic quotes ?

those guys who are living in Middel East rather show that quotes from Quoran that i pasted are more real

Church is told to hidden some "original" Jesus preaching in IV or V century cause it was too anarchistic etc.

maybe the same is with Quoran, moderate Muslism throw away some Quoran parts which parts others use (in this case Taliban, AlQueda and others before IS) , cause they acted BEFORE internet existed

beheading for apostasy is not fake from internet, it happens in Pakistan, Indonesia, Nigeria, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia since decades and ages , it is not fake, cause they acted BEFORE internet existed

guys operating in Nigeria also operate for 2 decades for sure not on Internet website made by 1 right-wing guy, cause they acted BEFORE internet existed and someone made such website

Edited August 27, 2014 by vilas

[Xalteva 10]

beheading for apostasy is not fake from internet, it happens in Pakistan, Indonesia, Nigeria, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia since decades and ages , it is not fake

It exists ofcourse ,that's why people should think before joining any religion ! some other religions have similar things. When you flee the battlefield/army ,you are judged for it !

Yeah ,to my knowledge ,there is one version of quran !

Here's a quote that i couldn't find :

Bukhari (52:220) - Allah's Apostle said... 'I have been made victorious with terror'

And here's the bukhari book ! you can look for chapter 52 there isn't 220 paragraph inside :)

http://sunnah.com/bukhari

[aleksadragutin 9]

Wrong !

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

Wrong !

http://quran.com/5/32

Religions were never about rational thinking ,it has always been about belief :)

Christianity does not forgive murder in any case, so crusaders weren't really following christianity.\

There's mentioned "Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land"

And that's why it is acceptable to kill infidels.

[mistyronin 1181]

Christianity does not forgive murder in any case, so crusaders weren't really following christianity.\

Ask to any Army's Christian chaplain.

BTW did you know that Operation Barbarossa ( the Nazi organized invasion of the USSR ), was supposed to be a crusade against the communists ( with the approval of the church ).

In Spain the Fascist dictator was always escorted by Christian monks. And the Christian church blessed all the killings against the oppressors of the regime.

In fact the Dictator's tomb is still nowadays guarded by a Christian monastery ( he died in 1975 ) :

Edited August 27, 2014 by MistyRonin

[vilas 473]

Vatican has a lot of dirty stuff behind back

Church was always supporting kings, nobles etc.

since ANcient Egypt, all religions have common stuff like "obey ruler",

chaplains in army - their presence always made me laugh

but it doesn't change fact that we must defend our life when some guys came here few years ago from Middle East or Africa and protest on our streets demanding to kill us for criticizing Sharia or stand against those who demand to ban our life, our food, our culture cause "it offends them" and stand against those who commit crimes on our streets,

religion and god - those are sociotechnical tools to control population,

church was fighting with commies, cause commies fight with religion,

worshipers=money and power lust,

without religion all those monks, priests, mullah - are unworthy, what they can do in life ? build ? electronic ? IT ? dig with shovel ? what they can do usefull to have such amount of money ? what job we can offer to person who is lazy and can only do some propaganda speeches ? public relations dept in company selling cheap product ?

they were usefull to kings, nobles, sultans and all kind of rulers across milieniums, churches of all kinds were YT that time

Edited August 27, 2014 by vilas

[Rarkhan 10]

There are bilions of Islamist and just 0,0001 % of them are radical, that is the same in christian belief and judaism. Islam is a good religion study it and you learn it is in fact a religion of peace just like all others. The books are written to live in a good way as possible and do no harm. But people abuse this and create mass propagamda. But realy don't say things like the only solution is killing all muslims. It is ridiculous

[vilas 473]

ridiculous is when guy imigrate to EU from Middle East and demand ban beacon, beat people on the street cause they wear not like Sharia say and stab with knife someone (if he emigrate from Sharia country, why he want Sharia in EU?)

ridiculous is saying that Music is something evil, that dance is evil, that earthquake is caused by short skirts

ridiculous is what happens in Sharia-law countries

if someone says he want to kill us for our culture (like terrorists in middle east) we must defend our life and destroy terrorist who want to attack us

if terrorists want to behead village of innocent people because they are whatever religion, we also should destroy those terrorists

Edited August 27, 2014 by vilas

[Rarkhan 10]

ridiculous is when guy imigrate to EU from Middle East and demand ban beacon, beat people on the street cause they wear not like Sharia say and stab with knife someone (if he emigrate from Sharia country, why he want Sharia in EU?)

ridiculous is saying that Music is something evil, that dance is evil, that earthquake is caused by short skirts

ridiculous is what happens in Sharia-law countries

As i said, don't judge the whole religion of a few people trying to make sharia. Maybe 50 % of my friends are muslim also is my wife, i am orthodox christian but don't be so stupid.

[vilas 473]

and she could marry you ?

according to Quoran ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interfaith_marriage_in_Islam

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/15/sudanese-woman-married-christian-death-sentence-apostasy

she can be killed according to Islamists

[Rarkhan 10]

You think that all islamist wear burkas and pray 5 times a day? I am christian but i don't go every week to church we don't have to. Religion is a way of life it is something about you're culture where you are from. Again, there are bilions of muslims BILIONS and just 0,0001 IS RADICAL. oke, don't make hate about people on the internet because it makes you no better then those sharia people.

BTW it is also not allowed in our religion to marry someone with another religion, but you know what? some people have brains and can make there own decisions.

Ah and i need to say, you are totaly right about those radical sharia wahhabi muslims that are beheading people etc etc. They need to get rid of, but i just want you to see not to judge bilions of people just because some thousands of radicals. It is the same as this: you see 100 people that like the color red and 1 of them is raping everybody and you say all people that like red are rapist

Edited August 27, 2014 by Rarkhan

[vilas 473]

http://www.onislam.net/english/ask-the-scholar/family/marriage/174420-why-a-muslim-woman-is-not-allowed-to-marry-a-non-muslim-man.html

It is haram for a Muslim woman to marry a non-Muslim man, regardless of whether he is of the People of the Book or not. We have already mentioned the saying of Allah, "...and do not marry (your girls) to idolaters until they believe..." (Al-Baqarah: 221)

maybe you should read what scholar say, if you not care what he say, maybe you both are atheists , not believers ;) just like i am baptised, cause they baptise newborn, not asking do i want to be christian or not, i was baptised when i was little kid , like all baptised children too , i had "First Holy Comunion" too cause it is made when you are 12, and not adult, i was forced to go to church like many kids in 80s in catholic country,

i screw religion since i was ca. 17/18 y.o. 20 years ago , before i was going to church every sunday and my family still goes every sunday and eat fish on friday and since 20 years there is always argument during Christmas or Easter about food issues or me not praying

and divide 2 words:

Muslims

Islamists

we use in English Muslim for Muslims

Islamists are radical Muslims , Jihadists

Edited August 27, 2014 by vilas

[aleksadragutin 9]

You think that all islamist wear burkas and pray 5 times a day? I am christian but i don't go every week to church we don't have to. Religion is a way of life it is something about you're culture where you are from. Again, there are bilions of muslims BILIONS and just 0,0001 IS RADICAL. oke, don't make hate about people on the internet because it makes you no better then those sharia people.

BTW it is also not allowed in our religion to marry someone with another religion, but you know what? some people have brains and can make there own decisions.

Ah and i need to say, you are totaly right about those radical sharia wahhabi muslims that are beheading people etc etc. They need to get rid of, but i just want you to see not to judge bilions of people just because some thousands of radicals. It is the same as this: you see 100 people that like the color red and 1 of them is raping everybody and you say all people that like red are rapist

Don't know where you live, but what vilas said is also true in Serbia. Most of the muslims here are radical, coming to our country and insisting on their laws. There have been open provocations like lifting of monuments to terrorist groups like UCK, and the government had to send in elite police forces to take it down. It is a bit weird that the concentration of radical muslims is this high.

In Egypt people voted a while back for the extreme islamic party. It just means that the percent of radicals is much greater than 0,0001%.

Not saying that there are no normal muslims, of course there are.

PS.

I am orthodox and we can marry who ever we want.

[vilas 473]

maybe not 0.0001% but 10% or 5% or 20% in some regions ;)

0.00001% is rather whitening, but in 10% i am ready to believe or in 20% or 5% but not 0.00001%

no go zones in western countries, about which police say is not made by 1-2 person in whold district, but by hundreds of imigrants,

IS is not 10 men, they have population suport, some voices say they have ca. 30% support there

some polls shown poll result like 40% Muslims in UK want Sharia etc.

those numbers are scary, if it iwas 0.00001% - noone would care

0.0001% is easy to fight by locals, so far local armies of few countries cannot win, why ?

cause probably extremists have there 30% population support

in USA people are controlled before they get visa, i can believe that in USA only 0.1% want sharia

Edited August 27, 2014 by vilas

[aleksadragutin 9]

maybe not 0.0001% but 10% or 5% or 20% in some regions ;)

0.00001% is rather whitening, but in 10% i am ready to believe or in 20% or 5% but not 0.00001%

Again, in Egypt was more than 50% since they won the elections.

[vilas 473]

what was their vote result ? cause you can win election when you have 4 parties like 30%, 20%, 20%, 10%, than you are winner having 30%

[Rarkhan 10]

http://www.onislam.net/english/ask-the-scholar/family/marriage/174420-why-a-muslim-woman-is-not-allowed-to-marry-a-non-muslim-man.html

maybe you should read what scholar say, if you not care what he say, maybe you both are atheists , not believers ;) just like i am baptised, cause they baptise newborn, not asking do i want to be christian or not, i was baptised when i was little kid , like all baptised children too , i had "First Holy Comunion" too cause it is made when you are 12, and not adult, i was forced to go to church like many kids in 80s in catholic country,

i screw religion since i was ca. 17/18 y.o. 20 years ago , before i was going to church every sunday and my family still goes every sunday and eat fish on friday and since 20 years there is always argument during Christmas or Easter about food issues or me not praying

and divide 2 words:

Muslims

Islamists

we use in English Muslim for Muslims

Islamists are radical Muslims , Jihadists

Well i am Orthodox christian and it is up to ourself how much we are busy with religion, it is something 24/7 in youre life and you don't need to go to churche for it. My wife is alevi muslim, it is almost the same. But you are right about sunni muslims they need to follow all laws. But again of all muslim population which are bilions only thousands are extremist, that makes 0,0001 %.

And sorry about the Muslims, islamist, i ment to say muslims.

---------- Post added at 15:59 ---------- Previous post was at 15:57 ----------

Don't know where you live, but what vilas said is also true in Serbia. Most of the muslims here are radical, coming to our country and insisting on their laws. There have been open provocations like lifting of monuments to terrorist groups like UCK, and the government had to send in elite police forces to take it down. It is a bit weird that the concentration of radical muslims is this high.

In Egypt people voted a while back for the extreme islamic party. It just means that the percent of radicals is much greater than 0,0001%.

Not saying that there are no normal muslims, of course there are.

PS.

I am orthodox and we can marry who ever we want.

I know the situation there my mother is from hrvatski, and what uck etc is doing ofcourse is very bad but i am talking globaly. In some regions there are mostly extremists and in some regions there are none. And yes we can marry who ever we want but it is not a "good" thing

[vilas 473]

, that makes 0,0001 %.

how much ISIS could do if they were 100 people ?

how much fighters are in Syria ? only 500 UK citizens and 300 German citizens were reported by intels to be there,

so ...

no, it is absolutely not 0.0001%, it is at least several percent

at ease several percent

if they were 100 people, than Iraqi police would shot them in 2 days

so far several countries cannot hold them, while they are bombed by USA and other countries,

Russia killed similar number in Chechen wars

in A-stan and Iraq our NATO troops killed at least 100 000 of extremists

so they are not 0.0001% , if they were, they would not be able to control several countries

they are at least dozen percent , look at Nigeria , Lybia, Egypt, Syria , etc.

Edited August 27, 2014 by vilas

[Rarkhan 10]

how much ISIS could do if they were 100 people ?

how much fighters are in Syria ? only 500 UK citizens and 300 German citizens were reported by intels to be there,

so ...

no, it is absolutely not 0.0001%, it is at least several percent

at ease several percent

Well maybe i am a bit way off in the % thing, but all i am trying to say is that the big majority of muslim population are peaceful people and only the small minoritie is extremist. Just want you to also see the good things and not only the bad, that is called education what i saw people talking about earlier. If you want to have a opinion you need to see 2 sides about the subject.

And well this is something to worry about

Because as they say, 250 have returned so that means in the UK there are now walking 250 radical wahhabi sharia islamists with fighting experience.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Rarkhan

[vilas 473]

maybe you are right, but for sure all IS-like guys must be destroyed for good of this planet, the same with all Jihadists , and Muslims should (and local countries do) do all to remove those who make them black p.r.

other wise this dozen percent islamists do harm to all Muslims and shape their p.r. (such actions like "we demand to ban beacon" "slaughter all who criticize Allah", guys who want to kill apostates etc)

scary is that in some countries extremists win elections

for sure IS would not be able to spread if they had no wide support from local people (who live like in middle age time)

[Rarkhan 10]

maybe you are right, but for sure all IS-like guys must be destroyed for good of this planet, the same with all Jihadists , and Muslims should (and local countries do) do all to remove those who make them black p.r.

other wise this dozen percent islamists do harm to all Muslims and shape their p.r. (such actions like "we demand to ban beacon" "slaughter all who criticize Allah", guys who want to kill apostates etc)

scary is that in some countries extremists win elections

Yes i totaly agree

[vilas 473]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340599/WikiLeaks-1-3-British-Muslim-students-killing-Islam-40-want-Sharia-law.html

o look at this please, this is not 0.001% , it is wikileaks report about survey on immigrants students in UK , such number is very scary, cause it sounds like 1/3rd is ticking bomb ,at least wikileaks claims so

of course 70% is okay, 30% is minority, but at least 29% too much ;)

Edited August 27, 2014 by vilas

[Rarkhan 10]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340599/WikiLeaks-1-3-British-Muslim-students-killing-Islam-40-want-Sharia-law.html

o look at this please, this is not 0.001% , it is wikileaks report about survey on immigrants students in UK , such number is very scary, cause it sounds like 1/3rd is ticking bomb ,at least wikileaks claims so

of course 70% is okay, 30% is minority, but at least 29% too much ;)

Yes that is very disturbing to see. But again i still believe islam is a religion of peace but people like them abuse it. Our instinct tells us to react on fear with hate. But think wisely and see the difference between this sharia supporting muslims and the fast majority of peacefull muslims.

Don't think black and white that is very dangerous and that is exactly the way like those radicals think.

[Xalteva 10]

Again, in Egypt was more than 50% since they won the elections.

So 50% of Egyptians were radical muslims ? and muslim brotherhood was radical ?

I don't see what's the point of discussing a religion details ,as long as you don't belong to it ,you should not complain or try to shape it to your ideal model ! you are not allowed to marry people from other faiths in islam because it's one of islam's teachings and that's it! it doesn't accept arguing according to your ideals, most of muslims accept it and do it in order to protect their community !

[Dwarden 1124]

so Muslim Brotherhood isn't radical ? I remember theirs representatives wanting to destroy Egyptian historical monuments if they get to control ...

sometimes I have simple wish, these who support these 'movements' shall go there and live for year ... then tell us about the wonderful life