Third person mode & realism

[idhronphant 10]

Hello

I have been watching alot of Arma 3, 2 videos lately, and I saw a lot of comments like: "it's meant to be hardcore, most realistic military simulator, as real as it gets, tactical cooperated secret realistic operations.."

and others such as: "cod players go home, you have no place here if you play bf 3, this is the game people play to experience realism in its true form"

There is no problem with saying that, I myself think arma can deliver fairly realistic experience - compared to other games, with the use of some mods, and teamwork...

though

I also noticed that in more than 60% of the "Realistic co-operation, tactical mission, ..." videos I watched, the player was in third person mode most of the time..

Or used 3rd person to take a quick look-around..

I can't understand that... maybe my meaning is wrong but what is the point in wanting to experience a realistic military action when you have a

third person camera enabled? Even if you use it for a quick 360 degree peek around your vehicle...

-Could be I watched only the wrong examples..

But anyways..

you could argument with "IRL you can maneuver more freely and see more clearly so 3rd person makes up for that".. I think arguments like that are plain nonsense

I don't mean to argue or insult, but enlighten me if you can

[ProfTournesol 956]

It has been discussed to death and never ends well most of the time (a little example : http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?149711-3rd-person-view-and-difficulty-levels&highlight=person). Anyway, as you can switch it off, everybody can play the game as he wants (or join realism servers that switch it off), there is no really matter of discussion IMHO.

[theevancat 277]

I feel like third person gives me some situational awareness that's artificially limited by first-person. I mean, it's narrow and constricting for me. I pretty much play third person exclusively because of that fact.

[jgbtl292 0]

Drive a kuma in firstperson, offroad good luck ^^ the game is too bad in many things, you can not all see from a infantry perspective ;)

[13islucky 10]

It's kinda strange in third person, since the overall FOV doesn't actually change all that much you basically have the same image in front of you but now with added player character.

[pooroldspike 128]

I never, but NEVER, play 1st person because it's too downright restrictive and unrealistic, like playing with a paper bag on your head with a few holes to look through.

It's especially horrific if you're an AFV driver because you'll spend the whole game looking through the drivers slit without a clue what's going on all around you. (yawn).

Give me 3rd person every time so you can look around, see your character, your vehicle, your kool uniform and the weapons and equipment you're carrying, and whether you're crouching, standing, bleeding or puking etc..:)

Edited May 17, 2014 by PoorOldSpike

[enex 11]

You can change FOV in your config files to whatever value you want.80, 90fov you name it.

By playing in third person you are potentially limit yourself for a lot of fun and adrenaline

beacause of huge field of view, (camera above your head) including peaking around the walls, over the walls.

Watch this scenario first 3 minutes by dsylexi

Most of the time people want it on because of situational awareness but

te be honest you have ALT to look around while you moving, there is

shac tac addon that helps with peripheral vision and there is adjustable FOV.

It's funny how people give up all seeing for all the adrenaline and

first person immersion that it can offer.

---------- Post added at 16:51 ---------- Previous post was at 16:47 ----------

Drive a kuma in firstperson, offroad good luck ^^ the game is too bad in many things, you can not all see from a infantry perspective ;)

I have no problems driving it, and if I play in community I just ask gunner, hey is my right clear?Before I turn right on the road.In third person all this doesn't matter.

[k0rd 3]

first person is ez mode-- you don't have that army guy in the middle of the screen blocking your vision!

[the_demongod 31]

first person is ez mode-- you don't have that army guy in the middle of the screen blocking your vision!

How could you even write that with a straight face? I hope you're joking.

I really don't see you guy's arguments about "looking though a paper bag" and stuff… do you not use free look?

I don't think I press any key in arma more than LALT. And it's apparent you guys just haven't gotten used to it. I can honestly say that Arma 3 has some of the best character movement in any game. You just have to play it enough to get comfortable with it.

Oh and whoever commented on not being able to see in first person from a tank… have you ever driven a tank? I can say from firsthand experience that it's like trying to go though life with a paper towel tube over each eye. You literally have a 3x6 inch hole in front of your face, and one on each side.

[WolfeUK 1]

ive always though that, i love first person view as for me its the final thing to get as close to the real experience as possible, but i do watch some ppl who dont like any kind of normal chatter or crying babys as it ruins there experience yet in 3rd person view, i dont get it either as i feel its a big cheat, 3rd person view means you can see alot more of the battle field for starters, will never understand it

[k0rd 3]

How could you even write that with a straight face? I hope you're joking.

of course i am but since you responded, I'll let you know how I really feel.

I don't mind third person - but I wish there was an option to disable alt-freelook for people who are in third person mode because it is simply too powerful and easy to look around obstacles with it.

[pooroldspike 128]

I agree with many Arma2 and Arma3 players who say bots are far too good because they've got x-ray vision through trees, shrubs and long grass, and their marksmanship and spotting abilities are too good.

So having 3rd-person view gives us humans better situational awareness which balances things out for us when playing agaist bot mofos..:)

[Fushko 60]

It's just because the standard FOV used in the game is very narrow, so third person makes up for that. If you up your FOV you don't feel the need to switch to 3rd person.

[Tonci87 163]

I only play in 1st person. 3rd person is cheating. Honestly I always hear the same arguments from players that use it (situatioal awareness etc.) But every time I see a video with 3rd person enabled the persons use it to look over walls and around corners without beeing seen. If you want situational awareness use ALT. (I agree on vehicle view ports beeing too restrictive.)

[drebin052 323]

Just use both and get the best of both views? Or if you don't like it, then just disable it yourself or tell the admin to change the parameters?

There's no need for measures like excluding 3rd person entirely or locking it out just for the sake of "immersion".

[RushHour 11]

I always maintain the rule that if the server allows 3rd person, i will fully exploit that thing as far as it goes because i know other people do the same and i like to play on an even playing field.

However i prefer 1st person by a country mile, you just can´t beat that immersion!

Just got back to reality after a solid 4-5 hours on EUTW CTI servers (best servers i´ve played on by far)

[-Coulum- 35]

Third person is "cheating" from a realism standpoint, I don't really see any way that can be argued. Yes it might add realistic aspects, but it also adds unrealistic aspects. Lack of a realistic feature is better than an unrealistic feature. Plus firstperson isn't actually that restrictive if you have a comfortable FOV, use free look, and have played enough to generally know where your body is. Yes I will occasionally die because I thought my elbow was tucked behind cover when it wasn't, but I would rather that than being able to see guys outflanking me behind a wall, toss a grenade at them and kill them when I should have never been able to see them.

Its like arguing for players to be able to jump 100ft in the air and arguing its realism with: "well its realistic because in real life you can jump". I know, I know its an extreme analogy but I hope you get my point.

I always maintain the rule that if the server allows 3rd person, i will fully exploit that thing as far as it goes because i know other people do the same and i like to play on an even playing field.

However i prefer 1st person by a country mile, you just can´t beat that immersion!

My feelings exactly.

[Sneakson 1]

Currently 3rd person is the only way to have body awareness and broadens your field of view significantly however also allows for easy cheating.

The 3rd person camera really should be moved down somewhat to always being vertically in level with your character’s head.

That way we would still have body awareness and would only have to adjust to using zoom out to broaden our field of view to a more natural level and at least some of the camera cheating would go away.

Zoom out broadens your field of view even more than 3rd person does by the way.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_vYk45ep4ZG0/TGhhjmwEN0I/AAAAAAAAARo/zXFC_kn3sPE/s1600/3520i0m.jpg

Why the hell doesn't the forum resize this image if I post it using IMG tags like it usually does? The 100 kb rule still applies doesn't it?

Edited May 17, 2014 by Sneakson

[Varanon 892]

Currently 3rd person is the only way to have body awareness and broadens your field of view significantly

I beg to differ. It does not. It gives you only a slightly broader field of view, as can be seen in

(check around 1:50).

The problem with 3d person is that you can see around or over walls, which you can't do in real life, so to claim it'S more realistic is plainly wrong.

3rd person really should be changed so the camera is closer to you and always vertically in level with your head similar to Resident Evil 4 and Gears of War, the definitive 3rd-person shooters.

If the camera wouldn't climb all the time to allow you to look over walls, it would already help. However, moving the camera closer wouldn't work, since that makes the third and first person view practically the same.

The real problem is that there is no solution to this. The field of view should be bigger in first person, but third person allows you to peek over and around walls, and sorry, no one can claim that this is realistic... is it more realistic than first person ? I don't know, but in any case, it will give you an advantage and a view angle that is totally unrealistic.

There is no solution to this problem.

[BadHabitz 235]

In PvP I agree that limiting to 1st person is the right thing to do, out of fairness.

But if it's co-op, and the objective is to have fun, then why does anyone care which view people are using? Use what works for you and just let everyone play the game in the way that makes them happy.

[Ckrauslo 12]

What are you guys expecting? that combat in real life isn't restricting? that i can peek around my cover without exposing my self? this doesn't exist...and the field of view is the same in 1st person and in 3rd the only difference is that the 3rd person is a few meters back, and you can't see what is directly in your front like a small rock that will block your path

[13islucky 10]

Currently 3rd person is the only way to have body awareness and broadens your field of view significantly however also allows for easy cheating.

The 3rd person camera really should be moved down somewhat to always being vertically in level with your character’s head.

That way we would still have body awareness and would only have to adjust to using zoom out to broaden our field of view to a more natural level and at least some of the camera cheating would go away.

Zoom out broadens your field of view even more than 3rd person does by the way.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_vYk45ep4ZG0/TGhhjmwEN0I/AAAAAAAAARo/zXFC_kn3sPE/s1600/3520i0m.jpg

Why the hell doesn't the forum resize this image if I post it using IMG tags like it usually does? The 100 kb rule still applies doesn't it?

Heh, I actually have a third-person camera that's almost identically placed thanks to dfs_thirdperson for Arma 3. I'm pretty sure you can still find it on Armaholic, and you can pick from a bunch of presets and even create your own. I recommend anyone interested in a different third-person viewpoint to check it out.

[dav 22]

The crosshairs in third person is way off anyway, no fun shooting at all.

[WolfeUK 1]

What are you guys expecting? that combat in real life isn't restricting? that i can peek around my cover without exposing my self? this doesn't exist...and the field of view is the same in 1st person and in 3rd the only difference is that the 3rd person is a few meters back, and you can't see what is directly in your front like a small rock that will block your path

you couldnt be any more wrong, the field of view is different between 1st and 3rd person view, lets say your hiding behind a rock cause your under fire, in first PV all you can see is a rock, in 3rd PV you can see beyond that rock and see where there firing position is without exposing your self, same as looking around buildings your hiding behind

[znooptokkie 14]

In my opinion, every player who wants to play arma in "realistic" way, has to play with the first person view. 3rd person is like cheating, looking over walls, behind walls, over bushes and so on... and you will not be seen at all. Use ALT, TrackIR 4/5, FreeTrack or other head tracking system you might know. Crosshairs also are a must to be deactivated, you get a feeling for aiming without a sight anyways.

The only time i get the feeling of being restricted because its a game is in close quarters operations with a 4 man team cleaning rooms because you dont 'feel' your buddys around you and when laid down in higher grass.

In a tank: If the driver cant see enough through the viewport(s) - let the commander and gunner give you the commands you need to navigate. Armas lack of functions for the driver to manoveur or navigate can be less if the commander and driver team work good together.