Is Arma 3's AI so unusually accurate? I don't think so

[CyclonicTuna 87]

In my opinion the AI in arma is pretty poor. And I think it has a lot to do with the pathfinding. You hear a lot of people say that the Arma AI runs into open fields without popping smoke or taking cover, they never dispurse or regroup in a realistic fashion, they never give each other covering fire etc. I think its literally because the AI sees much less than us. They don't see certain objects, then don't see grass and bushes. All they think of is to return fire when fired upon, and to fire on anything hostile they can see.

Now ofcourse it can't be expected of AI to draw entire battleplans on the fly, but it would be nice to see them taking cover, being able to find their way in urban enviroments without getting stuck every 3 feet. Also, they're generally not that well balanced. Either they miss you whilst looking you dead in the eye from an armslenth away, or they put a bullet between your eyes from 3k away thrue the fog and several forests, its really inconsistent.

I often feel like I have to babysit my AI teammembers to keep them from walking into the open, on their own, against a platoon of tanks, with only a sidearm.

But I think the thing that frustrates me the most about the AI is the fact that there are some particular bugs in the AI that were literally carried over from one Arma title to another, which indicates to me that the developers actually did nothing whatsoever to try and reform the AI. For instance, there's a command "copy my stance", but its useless, because the AI never copy your stance, no matter what the situation or combat mode. They always stay in the stance in align with their current combat mode.

Also, a bug that has annoyed me to the point of uninstalling Arma 2 (and has actually kept me from playing with the UAV's in Arma 3), and not playing it for several months. When you order a UAV to a certain waypoint and you tell it to adjust its altittude at the same time. 9 times out of 10, it will start flying in circles and there's nothing you can do to stop it :mad:.

Edited May 27, 2014 by CyclonicTuna

[roshnak 41]

"Copy my stance" is just mislabeled. It's actually "Go back to choosing your own stance." It just resets the AI to default stance behavior after forcing them prone or whatever.

[mamasan8 11]

What annoyes me the most is the fact that Ai (in MP) don't use stances. They are either prone or standing, never anything inbetween. We have what? 6 stances? Why don't AI use them as well?

Then theres houses. Why don't AI enter them? Taking a town should be about clearing the houses, not the surrounding forests and streets.

Supression fire, I havent seen that. Either they aim straight at me, run away or lie prone and hope that I will run to them. Rarely do they flank.

[RuairiAU 1]

I don't mind the 'laser' accurate aiming so much. What I do mind is their ability to see me at long range, through cover or immediately after I open fire.

If the AI gets the jump on me, I:

1) run.

2) Quickly I look for cover and hide.

3) Then try get a bearing on the enemy.

4) Drop smoke if pinned.

If I get the jump on the AI,

1) they go prone,

2) swivel round to my direction an open fire

3) then reposition as a group

When i shoot near the AI they are oblivious. When I'm shot at I take cover.

When I hit them, they seem to just nod their heads. When I get hit, it's an insta kill headshot.

[XBrettlyX 10]

I don't mind the 'laser' accurate aiming so much. What I do mind is their ability to see me at long range, through cover or immediately after I open fire.

If the AI gets the jump on me, I:

1) run.

2) Quickly I look for cover and hide.

3) Then try get a bearing on the enemy.

4) Drop smoke if pinned.

If I get the jump on the AI,

1) they go prone,

2) swivel round to my direction an open fire

3) then reposition as a group

When i shoot near the AI they are oblivious. When I'm shot at I take cover.

When I hit them, they seem to just nod their heads. When I get hit, it's an insta kill headshot.

Exactly my thoughts.

Exactly what I do when shot at.

[Mirek 166]

I just started to play Arma 3 Campaign last weekend. The AI in this gaim shoots like retards. Actualy if further than certain distance they dont even shoot back if you shoot them. It looks like they cant see me wich is ridiculous because i can see them clearly at those distances, and my unsilenced M14 or what ever they call m14 in arma 3 should give my possition away.

So no AI isnt unusually accurate, actually when they "if they" spot you and actually start shooting at you, they have the same accuracy as i have when shooting at them. On medium distances, I mostly hit with every 3rd or 4th shot wich is roughly the same as AI do. 2to5 shots usualy hits the ground around my before i get killed. And when you run they mostly cant hit you.

(i ran my way trough the first mission in "Adapt campaign where you are supposed to sneak through it.)

Possible campaign spoiler ahead:

side note: First part of the campaign the "survive" sucks. Its boring. Second part "adapt" seems to be way much better at least the "going on patrol" part is fun. I actualy Only played the first 2 missions (i didnt like the first one) and then i felt in love with the free patroll part, so i didnt play the campaign much further.

[Leg 10]

The problem seems to be no one likes to be on the receiving end of a bullet. A lot of people don't like to be killed by "only AI". However, these AI that people die to are usually modified to be weakened strains (or just weaker in general because the global skill setting for AI is set to like 'Regular' 90% of the time). Imagine what Elite would be like? It just means that you can't fuck up against AI, and to treat them as if they are real human enemies.

They don't always have to be tweaked down (even though as stated, 90% of the time they are). The AI is very interchangeable and you can make them either really weak or really strong. I personally prefer a really strong AI on Elite or the hardest possible so that you know the AI will be a formidable enemy (most of the time they are just defending a town anyway).

Rant thing:

The problem with that is it's rare to see individuals who can handle the pressure. The vast majority of people might get offended and say there's no possible way you can do certain things in Arma, and say like "hur go play cod you troll". But then.. I turn around and shoot down a helicopter with an RPG or I go in solo and kill 10 elite AI (or sometimes even groups of players) without dying. I really like the run and gun style of play, and Arma has potential to be fun, but it's always going to be those cry babies who frankly can't handle it. The so called elitists who are professionals and realism lovers yet can't even handle playing with elite AI or taking risks. And if you question their badness at the game that they play much more than you anyways then good luck, you're suddenly labelled a troll or banned for breaking some profanity rule. Like, if you say players are shitty because they can't even revive people when they are like 10 meters away and the area is clear, for the most part people won't even sympathize with you. Instead they sympathize with the bad players who are dumb as hell and have terrible situational awareness and say you're a troll for saying they are bad.. really? The playerbase of this game is to blame for all the complaining and I'm never going to find some elite players or just normal players who can run around and play coop or PvP in the old style (at least, without being somewhat restrained or weaker than expected). If I had 4 copies of me I would be like bet-worthy more effective in a PvP match than like 15 regular Arma players. And trust me, I barely play Arma, but I just make sure when I do play that I don't mess up cuz that involves a lot of wasted time and walking. If you played deathmatch or older co-ops on Operation Flashpoint as a kid you might understand that style of play. Frankly, it's died out and I get bored of Arma yet return to play it every once in a while nonetheless. There's no players who say 'hey lets play against like 100 elite ai in a town and win'; instead just some whiners as usual. And they still die to regular AI and this issue still remains, even though it's completely related to how you mod it and prefer it. I like to be that type of guy who you can send into a town as a saboteur and then you'll just see the sparks fly. Anyway, I type like 100 wpm so my quick rant is over.. No one is going to stop complaining whether the AI is tweaked or not. The AI are pretty good at the moment, it just depends on how good you want to set them at. Yet most of the time people want them to be laughably bad so that any joe-shmoe can kill 8 of them, and yet want them to be 'challenging' at the same time, which is contradictory to one another, and yet people always end up shot and complaining either way.. weird.

Edited June 8, 2014 by Leg

[jelskipro 32]

my biggest problem is the gl spamming. try to play the infantry showcase me and my squad get insta killed by gl fire

[faire 10]

Jelskipro: never had that problem. Sometimes I got hit, most of the times not or at least not killed. Fine by me.

I tend to agree with Leg in some points: the AI is not uber, it's rather that the players grew to expect to kill lot of AI without problems. The situations in showcases and some missions are crazy: you are going against greater number and the plan is stupid. Combined arms is the best example - as a commander you would never go for such a reckless rush, especially not when outnumbered and on offense. No matter that you die when 10+ people are shooting at you from under 100m...

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

The AI have no aiming problems. Yes, AI can occasionally one shot you, or Gl you which is more expected, its a freaking 40mm grenade. But think of it this way. It's not just that the AI in Arma 3 hit you with more severe consequences than say the Battlefield series or, CoD. That is because in Arma, the AI are supposed to prove a potent enemy. Just like in real life, i'm damned sure if you played war like you played Arma, you'd get one shotted by enemy infantry with IORN SIGHTS from 300 meters. No kidding. Im not talking about ill trained rebels. I'm talking face to face well trained opposition. The AI make up for the missing human elements with aiming to some extent, better than average. And AI in more Arcade games dont have a lick of realism, their scripted. They run to a box, go crouched half way exposed, and stand to shoot at you in an easily scripted manner. No advancing, flanking, or changing cover. But in Arma, it's different. I've engaged enemies and moved up on a Platoon like an idiot. I was moving through a building, opened a door to find out they advanced to kill me, and ended up having a wall of lead fly through that door. Me and my buddies remember this from back in Beta build. Anyhow, i think the AI aiming is fine. The only reason people complain is, well, because were gamers. Lol, i can admit that no one in my squad has admitted dying due to the oppositions skill. We learned to play it safe. I never put myself in a position where an enemy AI, much less, more skilled player can get a one shot kill on me. Play Arma well, and you wont end up dead so often. Now that's not to say AI don't need to be improved, why? Because their AI. They will need be Human like to perfection, therefore, they will always have a chance to be improved a bit here and there. That's my 2 cents.

Edited June 10, 2014 by DarkSideSixOfficial

[vegeta897 13]

Pretty much what DarkSide said. Every time I'm killed by the AI in Arma, I ask myself what I did wrong to cause that to happen. Every single time I can come up with a good answer.

[mamasan8 11]

Dying from a GL spamming AI is one of the most likely deaths I experience. They are dead accurate too.

I play a GL soldier all the time, have been for months. My first GL shot is never straight on the money. 1st shot is for calibration, 2nd and 3rd usually lands where the enemy is. Have to take into account distance, elevation and movement. Something which is not easy to do within 1 second. But AI does it.

And when it comes to silencers. It doesn't matter if you have silencer or not, AI knows exactly where you are as soon as you fire once.

Silenced snipershot from 500+ metres (works the same at 1000m)...AI runs straight towards you and shoots at you.

Can you do the same? By just hearing that bullet bounce near you? I bet you can't.

AI has two modes. Running around like headless chicken OR Terminator! =)

[roshnak 41]

Pretty much what DarkSide said. Every time I'm killed by the AI in Arma, I ask myself what I did wrong to cause that to happen. Every single time I can come up with a good answer.

Really? What about when you are maneuvering under fire and a stray round hits you in the head? Because the nature of this game is that you have to expose yourself to danger in order to engage the enemy, and sometimes they just hit you in the head.

[vegeta897 13]

Really? What about when you are maneuvering under fire and a stray round hits you in the head? Because the nature of this game is that you have to expose yourself to danger in order to engage the enemy, and sometimes they just hit you in the head.

You just answered your own question :P

[roshnak 41]

You just answered your own question :P

Well, what would you say that the player did wrong in the situation I outlined?

The only reason I'm really harping on this is that there are games out there where you have a great deal of agency over whether you live or die in any given situation. Arma is really low on that list. It's not a game where there is a counter for every situation and if you had only made the right decision you could have gotten out alive. It's a game where the same situation can play out extremely differently every time you go through it and there isn't always a correct answer.

Darkside said that he never puts himself in a position where he can be killed by a single shot. That's not possible. In order to see and shoot at the enemy you have to expose the only part of your body that basically guarantees a one shot kill.

[vegeta897 13]

Sorry, perhaps I spoke a bit brashly, because you're taking my post a bit more literally than I intended. Of course there are going to be random occurrences where you're killed while in relative safety. You're never invincible no matter how cautiously you play. My point was more oriented against the people that get angry every time they die without knowing where the enemy was, or if they were killed "too quickly" for it to feel "fair", without actually considering the factors that may have lead to their death. I guess I'm just saying that I put an emphasis on trying to analyze what happened when I died instead of simply blaming aimbot AI, or something.

[-Coulum- 35]

I pretty much agree with vegeta and darkside. The ai is generally pretty fair. They have limited abilities, and you can position yourself in relation to the ai in order to gain the upper hand. Generally if you lose, at some point you made a mistake. Whether it was sticking your head up too long or simply attacking a force that outnumbered you too much, at some point you fucked up (minus the rare stray headshot). It is important to remember that often when the shooting starts it is too late. No amount of repositioning is going to save you if the ai catches you exposed and outnumbers you. People need to recognize this and focus on planning their assaults, movements and defences. The planning and preparation is pretty much when success is decided against the ai.

Despite them being relatively fair they still aren't realistic/human human (ability wise). Spotting especially needs alot of work. As for accuracy, the ai is well balanced but a bit on the easy side right now. And it needs to be more dynamic. I am hoping that it will be increased a bit but player actions will effect it more. Ie. Ai will be less accurate the more incoming fire they are receiving (sonic cracks, impacts explosions casualties), and their accuracy will also be effected by how well they can see the player (peaking out of a bush vs standing in the middle of the road.) I am really hoping that the devs will achieve these things by continuing to expand the "dynamic error calculation". What they have done already with that has really helped make the ai more balanced.

[ace-gaming 10]

BIS has achieved a huge development in the field of ai, comparing the first year of arma 2 and now arma 3. Of course there is pretty much work to do - but they have to keep focused on the real big issues. At this point I'm not talking about karts or fun-stuff like that, i can hardly wait to see balistics fixed, improved choppers, correctly working windows (topic of grenades which cant fly through specific one) and many little things.

I do think it is easier for the community to improve the ai, than trying to fix things which are rooted deeply in the engine (like the chopper flight-model).

I could imagine that many people think that they bought a product, stuffed with everything you need - to have a fabulous playing experience ; but thats not the case!

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Well, what would you say that the player did wrong in the situation I outlined?

The only reason I'm really harping on this is that there are games out there where you have a great deal of agency over whether you live or die in any given situation. Arma is really low on that list. It's not a game where there is a counter for every situation and if you had only made the right decision you could have gotten out alive. It's a game where the same situation can play out extremely differently every time you go through it and there isn't always a correct answer.

Darkside said that he never puts himself in a position where he can be killed by a single shot. That's not possible. In order to see and shoot at the enemy you have to expose the only part of your body that basically guarantees a one shot kill.

Aye, i see what your saying. It's complicated and comes with many hours in Arma. Not just patterns of AI I have literally down pat, but players. Either way, i predict what their next move is, stay in cover until i'm sure they are the first to move so i can pop out and take a shot or two. Or, as you said, moving and walking into a bullet, well that is simply Luck on your enemies part. NO one can stop that. Luck, and timing will always be a factor. As for having a counter for every situation, Arma isn't a regular game like others. When you design a game you make an objection and ways to complete it. Usually that includes things you can do to counter something conveyed against you. But in Arma, its open, sandbox, and dynamic. The only counters you have, is your actions. What can you do to make sure that the enemy doesn't have the upper hand. Its basic and advanced infantry combat. Well, i take back my statement, "never", and ill reiterate. I rarely place myself in a position to be over come by the enemy. This means that i always prepare for combat in a way to ensure my survival. Example, im in combat and the enemy is moving up. Ill get out of their site, and fall back to more solid cover where they now have to expose themselves whilst i wait. Or, i could fall back even more, that way, if they were to be like me and out flank, i would have already beat their flank, by falling back to a distance that they would never have suspected, giving me the upper hand. Essentially 3 steps ahead of the enemies thinking. I think i've shared too much of my Infantry knowledge. Lol

[Ironman13 12]

Something to note that hasn't been posted in this thread, the AI have no weapon sway. When aiming there weapon is ridiculously still, when firing they seem to not have any recoil at all.