Why do you think the Developers do not incorporate mods?

[Morrow 1]

As the title suggests, why do the Developers not choose some addons that are a hit with the community try to contact the addon creators and try to incorporate the addons into the next build of the game? (a few that come to mind are the F/A-18 F/E, the U.C.S.V, the USS Nimitz, J.S.R.S, the FHQ M4/M16 mod pack, and the FHQ attachments pack) Now there are undoubtedly more that I never mentioned, but I think this would be an easy way to get more content that we (the community) have already "tested" and "approved" so everyone can enjoy in singleplayer missions, and multiplayer games.

This is just a little idea I had when looking at Armaholic, what do you guys think of this?

PS. maybe it could be a poll system (kinda like Steam greenlight)

Oh and if this is in the wrong area please move.

Edited December 10, 2013 by Morrow
Changeed wording form "mods" to "addons" to keep from confusions with overhauls.

[nicolasroger 11]

I heard it might be about copyright issue (you can't know for sure where the mod creator got the texture/model he used).

But that might change with http://makearmanotwar.com/

[instagoat 133]

Greatly varying quality, Use of 4th party assets in some mods, undesired implementation strategies, mod hyper-specificity and in the case of most complete overhaul mods that are often asked for (ACE), plain bad game design.

[Morrow 1]

This looks nice but I would love to see modders want to strive to get their Items in-game without Bohemia spending their money (after all most modders are not in it for money), maybe once every 3 moneths they pick the top 20 mods (5 from 4 different categories) and say here take a pick of 1 from each category and we will make it happen. Now on the copyright issue maybe the modders would have to provide proof they were allowed to use it?

---------- Post added at 23:35 ---------- Previous post was at 23:32 ----------

Greatly varying quality, Use of 4th party assets in some mods, undesired implementation strategies, mod hyper-specificity and in the case of most complete overhaul mods that are often asked for (ACE), plain bad game design.

That is why I said "choose some mods that are a hit with the community" so the quality would be good (after all we don't just play every mod out there do we?) and who said we would make ACE implemented that is an overhaul not a "single mod" per-say but a compilation of different mods that are used to make an overhaul. (Now before you say so I know in the situation of ACE its not a bunch of mods but still)

[Stiltman 3]

maybe its that their vision of the game and what assets should be in it does not match with said addons.

we all know that alot of us want the 2013ish setting with M4s, M249s, USArmy, USMC, A10s etc but maybe the future setting they painted arma 3 in

isnt the place for that.

if someone makes new nice models, units and such that really fit into the arma 3verse who knows maybe they will accept it.

in the end its their vision and our sandbox :P

[Kerc Kasha 102]

legal issues, legal issues everywhere

[Morrow 1]

I see where you're coming from, I personally would like to see some version of todays prototypes (not in service or recently introduced), something that looks nice and deadly (unlike the MX IMHO)

Edited December 10, 2013 by Morrow

[dm 9]

legal issues, legal issues everywhere

This, x10000000000000000000000000

I see where you're coming from, I personally would like to see some version of todays prototypes (not in service or recently introduced), something that looks nice and deadly (unlike the MX IMHO)

So basically this is another "I don't like the future setting, can we have M4's and AK's again plix BI" thread then, right?

[Morrow 1]

So basically this is another "I don't like the future setting, can we have M4's and AK's again plix BI" thread then, right?

I do not think you read that correctly, I said todays prototypes, meaning something along the lines of an ACR or XM series, not the M4/M16/Scar series. I do not know why you want to be so rude when you do not know what I was talking about.

[13islucky 10]

Quote from Make ArmA Not War

Besides the fun of creating new content, you can win cash prizes ranging from €20,000 to €200,000, and/or the Health Care in Danger Award. You’d also be awarded with a special forums badge, and possibly even a contract with Bohemia Interactive - if we would really like your work.

I guess that in a way that answers your question, even if it may not have been what you were expecting.

[Sandy* 10]

Also also:

- Something "tested and approved by the community" is no substitute for proper QA. Monetary things come into play at this point, and coupled with a possible reward for the mod's author, BIS would probably not save any money compared to doing everything in-house.

- Adding all sorts of good mods akin to the examples listed by the OP would really bloat the vanilla A3 installation. I just did some "cleaning" with my A2 mods a few months ago, deleting >30 gigs of stuff. We probably don't want the game itself to be like that.

- Even the popular/good mods can have really varying quality and detail, like noticeably lower polycount/textures and sound effects that really stand out compared to the vanilla content (I'm not trying to discredit any modders here, I use and love several mods that are like this). While this is ok with mods, it would be a rather weird and messy experience if they were added as core content.

- Gameplay changing/enhancing mods, even though optional, would confuse new players. People who download a mod usually read the descriptions and know what they're getting into.

[progamer 14]

BI respects modders a lot.

---------- Post added at 17:05 ---------- Previous post was at 17:04 ----------

Also also:

- Something "tested and approved by the community" is no substitute for proper QA. Monetary things come into play at this point, and coupled with a possible reward for the mod's author, BIS would probably not save any money compared to doing everything in-house.

- Adding all sorts of good mods akin to the examples listed by the OP would really bloat the vanilla A3 installation. I just did some "cleaning" with my A2 mods a few months ago, deleting >30 gigs of stuff. We probably don't want the game itself to be like that.

- Even the popular/good mods can have really varying quality and detail, like noticeably lower polycount/textures and sound effects that really stand out compared to the vanilla content (I'm not trying to discredit any modders here, I use and love several mods that are like this). While this is ok with mods, it would be a rather weird and messy experience if they were added as core content.

- Gameplay changing/enhancing mods, even though optional, would confuse new players. People who download a mod usually read the descriptions and know what they're getting into.

Those reasons for content should not be an excuse. There are other reasons.

[Sandy* 10]

Those reasons for content should not be an excuse. There are other reasons.

These are probably just little things for BIS, but big reasons why I'd personally not want random mods incorporated to the game. As for BIS' agenda, I'd speculate that the legal/contractual complications as well as a desire to keep the base game simple and firm are the biggest reasons.

[Heinrich Kramer 172]

These are probably just little things for BIS, but big reasons why I'd personally not want random mods incorporated to the game. As for BIS' agenda, I'd speculate that the legal/contractual complications as well as a desire to keep the base game simple and firm are the biggest reasons.

Also BI would be spammed with "lolz i rippd dem gunz from gaem XYZ, give me $$$" mails.

[dm 9]

- Even the popular/good mods can have really varying quality and detail, like noticeably lower polycount/textures and sound effects that really stand out compared to the vanilla content (I'm not trying to discredit any modders here, I use and love several mods that are like this). While this is ok with mods, it would be a rather weird and messy experience if they were added as core content.

Those reasons for content should not be an excuse. There are other reasons.

Really? Wow...

Quite clearly you are one of the quantity over quality crowd...

[PuFu 4600]

This looks nice but I would love to see modders want to strive to get their Items in-game without Bohemia spending their money (after all most modders are not in it for money), maybe once every 3 moneths they pick the top 20 mods (5 from 4 different categories) and say here take a pick of 1 from each category and we will make it happen. Now on the copyright issue maybe the modders would have to provide proof they were allowed to use it?

Why would I, as a modder, strive to get my addon into BI vanilla? I do it first for myself, then for anyone else.

It just won't happen. When BI wants something done, they do use (from time to time that is) modders for outside sourcing. Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it's not happening.

That is why I said "choose some mods that are a hit with the community" so the quality would be good (after all we don't just play every mod out there do we?) and who said we would make ACE implemented that is an overhaul not a "single mod" per-say but a compilation of different mods that are used to make an overhaul. (Now before you say so I know in the situation of ACE its not a bunch of mods but still)

look at the amount of butthurt BI modding competition created. Imagine the same at a larger scale.

i hate to repeate this, but you are again obviously forgetting the legal issues. Who would own the IP? BI? The original addon creator? I charge a minimum of 30EU/hour for advanced modelling and mograph commercial work as a freelance. My company about 2-3 times as much. So where do you draw the line?

Also also:

- Something "tested and approved by the community" is no substitute for proper QA. Monetary things come into play at this point, and coupled with a possible reward for the mod's author, BIS would probably not save any money compared to doing everything in-house.

Contrary to what you would think, BI externalizes more and more with each release when it comes to content, instead of doing it all in the house. It is cheaper on the long run to contract certain assets than to keep a number of 3d artits employed. It happened, it happens will happen.

- Adding all sorts of good mods akin to the examples listed by the OP would really bloat the vanilla A3 installation. I just did some "cleaning" with my A2 mods a few months ago, deleting >30 gigs of stuff. We probably don't want the game itself to be like that.

- Even the popular/good mods can have really varying quality and detail, like noticeably lower polycount/textures and sound effects that really stand out compared to the vanilla content (I'm not trying to discredit any modders here, I use and love several mods that are like this). While this is ok with mods, it would be a rather weird and messy experience if they were added as core content.

- Gameplay changing/enhancing mods, even though optional, would confuse new players. People who download a mod usually read the descriptions and know what they're getting into.

Those reasons for content should not be an excuse. There are other reasons.

Really? what other reasons if you don't mind?

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

I think instead of going to our friendly Community devs for things that should be in Vanilla, is not a good idea. Let our devs to what they do their work for. If you want something, try requesting it, but be forewarned, it should be in a category, capable of being Vanilla. Not only that, but it shouldn't be a request, but more of a suggestion, of something that should be there because it fits. If you want an example, you can check my General Conversation thread about the two CAS aircraft. But before you even think about requesting something be added, think about it this way. It's about to be 2014, and they've its finished adding some things to the AAF (Drops tomorrow), the second episode will drop at the end of january, and after that, i'm sure theres even more content to come. After all, i heard they promised 5 years of committed support for A3, including improvements. Speaking of improvements, i wonder if they're gonna implement more simulweather.

Back more on topic though, the Competition, though it has ups and downs as we all know, could create division, but create an environment for the strong devs to thrive, it's possible we could see some amazing work come through this challenge, whether its for money or a job possibility, or just for modding sake. Other than that, it's unlikely devs work will be used, due to many reasons already mentioned.

[Sandy* 10]

Contrary to what you would think, BI externalizes more and more with each release when it comes to content, instead of doing it all in the house. It is cheaper on the long run to contract certain assets than to keep a number of 3d artits employed. It happened, it happens will happen.

Outsourcing your stuff to professional artists is quite different from picking mods made by random community members. Remember, the OP suggested BIS integrating all sorts of popular mods into the game, not just some hypothetical rarity Bohemia finds excellent.

[wipman 1]

Hi, IMO... they don't incorporate the hi-qual mods/addons because leak of testing, what works in a PC may not work on another, also because add X weapon, unit, vehicle or whatever should or may require 'em to rewrite the SP missions or the campaigns; but mainly i think that's because they should make a full test of the content, it's functionality, possible impact on the game performance and gameplay, how it fits into the whole package and if it have a counterpart in case of be designed for a single side as i.e NATO. Then, as last part of the thing... i think that there's also the money thing, they should have to pay every person involved in the creation of an addon and in a proportional way and this opens two problems, A) communications management. B) Time. That's what i think 'bout the thing. Let's C ya

[maturin 12]

Something "tested and approved by the community" is no substitute for proper QA

It's a damn sight better than the QA BI pays for. Amirite?

[PuFu 4600]

Outsourcing your stuff to professional artists is quite different from picking mods made by random community members. Remember, the OP suggested BIS integrating all sorts of popular mods into the game, not just some hypothetical rarity Bohemia finds excellent.

i am talking about outsourcing mods to community members here. What is a professional artist in the end? One that can deliver on quality on time.

But truth be told, i do disagree with OP, and his vision about what addons/mods are and how they could gathered by BI and implemented in the vanilla.

Besides, this is being a looping thread, comes back into discussion year, at least one

It's a damn sight better than the QA BI pays for. Amirite?

no.

[-Coulum- 35]

It's a damn sight better than the QA BI pays for. Amirite?

Sarcasm? No I don't think you are right.

IMO the whole reason for trying to get arma 3 on steam workshop is so that BIS doesn't have to add favourite mods into the vanilla game but it is so easy to get and use them that to the user it pretty much feels like it is part of the vanilla game. Combined with "make arma not war", I think that BIS is pretty much going to allow addons to be apart of the game.

For example Tactical battlefield seems to be picking up steam as a mod. Imagine how big it will be when it is up on steam workshop. Much like Dayz or ACE, people will forget that there was ever a vanilla. Mods will define the game even for the average/casual user. Thus there won't be much need for BIS to make mods apart of the base game.

[nicolasroger 11]

All they have to do is allow automatic mod downloading when you join a server and this entire thread become irrelevant.

[roshnak 41]

It's not quite as simple as adding automatic mod downloading. For one thing addons range from megabytes to gigabytes in size. The game has to be restarted to load addons. How do you manage file locations? How much server bandwidth is allocated to uploading addons to people, or does it redirect to another server? There are all sorts of things that make automatic downloading something of a logistical nightmare.

[galzohar 31]

He said "automatic mod download when you join a server". Why do you assume he thinks it's a viable solution to have the server send you the mod files or be forced to restart the game? It is not. The solution is not simple, but if there was a working solution then this game would "gain quite a few levels".

Heck, just look at TacBF. Their instructions tell you to use the in-game mod launcher, which results in 1/2 the people not being able to get in without direct 1-on-1 personal support. The player count would probably be at the very least double on this mod's servers if mods would have been downloaded automatically.