Multiplayer dying fast??

[Tonci87 163]

Check out gametracker Tonci. Arma 3 is rated #16 and Arma 2 is #21. So there's another sources telling you that Arma 2 does not have more players then Arma 3.

Interesting find while analyzing GameTracker data; I noticed that Germany is the country that plays Arma 2 the most, USA a close 2nd. However, when you look at Arma 3 the United States is #1 and Germany is #2 but they are far behind in #'s. This may be the reason (from your point of view) that you believe Arma 2 is played more then Arma 3; more of your countrymen are playing Arma 2. However the data clearly shows that Arma 3 has more players then Arma 2, and BTW....IT SHOWS NO DECLINE.

That is really interesting. I didn´t think of Gametracker. Now I ask myself: "what are the differences between the German and the US community?"

probably because they are well setup and easy to join? There was a lot of interest and momentum for MP from the Alpha that has gone absolutely no where, surely that would have been a priority even over the campaign that is never going to compete with triple A titles, disappointing.

Different people working on different things. When will people learn :rolleyes:

(And BTW, the Arma 3 campaign seems to surpass other recent AAA FPS games campaigns both in quality and quantity)

[spanishsurfer 58]

Now I ask myself: "what are the differences between the German and the US community?"

Strictly my opinion with ZERO scientific research: Players in the United States upgrade their PC rigs more often then other countries. I base this of my observations of seeing family and friends in both Spain and the USA. Here in the US, everyone wants to upgrade their smartphones, laptops, video cards as soon as they can...even if they have to do it on credit :rolleyes: but people in other countries tend to not feel the "rush" to get the latest and greatest; this includes games as well.

It's the reason my country is going broke.

Edited November 21, 2013 by SpanishSurfer

[iceman77 18]

probably because they are well setup and easy to join?

Yup. Also, the play style of those games are really popular. You spawn in, level up your rank, get gear upgrades, and run around a miniscule map head hunting. Though tbh, I don't mind playing BF every now and again. It's great fun if I've not much time to play. I can join real quick and get instant MP action.

However, I don't think it's the quality of those games that bring in massive numbers. It's just as you said. It's easy to join. As the learning curve is non-existent. Once you played one, you've played them all. I don't see any significant game play differences in say COD and quake or marathon. The innovation of those game types has peaked long ago.

Edited November 21, 2013 by Iceman77

[katipo66 94]

Different people working on different things. When will people learn :rolleyes:

Its not about people learning all the excuses its more about people being hungry for something more in MP... which appears to have no one working on it?

(And BTW, the Arma 3 campaign seems to surpass other recent AAA FPS games campaigns both in quality and quantity)

Right..

[bvrettski 10]

No it isn't dying.

http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/2185/3ahk.jpg

I disagree...

2PM MST

33 populated servers with a ping of less than 100 (playable)

13 with 5+ players

5 of those are BreakingPoint (Dayz)

4 or 5 are Wasteland

Others: Domination, Altis Life Annex & Hold

Of these how many are playable with any consistency especially if they are on the large map?

Edited November 21, 2013 by Bvrettski

[m1lkm8n 410]

...It's also important to note that there seems to be a rather sizable group of the community who don't consider ArmA as a multiplayer game but simply as a sandbox for single player/coop only. So I think that could contribute to why you still see more activity for other games vs. ArmA 3.

Speak for yourself. The fact of the matter is they released a game that missing much content and performs terrible in multiplayer mode right now. (Hopefully its fixed with the big mp update) also You tell me a company that is still in business with the business model 'we'll just release the game with very little to no content and leave it up to the modders'.

I would have been happy to wait another year for the game to release if it meant it would have been in a better state than it is right now.

[progamer 14]

Speak for yourself. The fact of the matter is they released a game that missing much content and performs terrible in multiplayer mode right now. (Hopefully its fixed with the big mp update) also You tell me a company that is still in business with the business model 'we'll just release the game with very little to no content and leave it up to the modders'.

I would have been happy to wait another year for the game to release if it meant it would have been in a better state than it is right now.

From content that is not realistically set by nationality, current real world use, fake names, push on "its a sandbox", the "its a game and doesn't have to be realistic" mentality some modders now have and the bug push on "authenticity" have turned off many Arma 2 players. Arma caters to players who like realism and then can be modded any direction, but Arma 3 appears to go away from realism towards generic tactical sandbox shooter that many games already due. Though no games try to simulate combined Arms warfare. The realism < balance crowd being drawn in from games like battlefield flooding the realism > balance players out.

Very different from the excited fans back in 2011 thinking a modern realistic sim like game was coming out with modern assets used right now by the US army.

---------- Post added at 02:11 ---------- Previous post was at 02:00 ----------

You also have to understand a ton of Arma players are waiting for mods like ACE, Blastcore, JSRS to either be released or be in a non WIP state.

Edited November 22, 2013 by ProGamer

[L3TUC3 32]

From content that is not realistically set by nationality, current real world use, fake names, push on "its a sandbox", the "its a game and doesn't have to be realistic" mentality some modders now have and the bug push on "authenticity" have turned off many Arma 2 players. Arma caters to players who like realism and then can be modded any direction, but Arma 3 appears to go away from realism towards generic tactical sandbox shooter that many games already due. Though no games try to simulate combined Arms warfare. The realism < balance crowd being drawn in from games like battlefield flooding the realism > balance players out.

---------- Post added at 02:11 ---------- Previous post was at 02:00 ----------

[/color]You also have to understand a ton of Arma players are waiting for mods like ACE, Blastcore, JSRS to either be released or be in a non WIP state.

Very different from the excited fans back in 2011 thinking a modern realistic sim like game was coming out with modern assets used right now by the US army.

You like thinking inside the box. Modding is not just simulating one experience repeatedly as prescribed by the base game. It encompasses a virtual infinity only limited by imagination and technical details. That's what makes A3 so interesting as a platform because, right now, no similar game offers that possibility any more. And it doesn't differ all that much from A2 in function. I seriously fail to see the problem other than "blegh, but realism". Anyone who seriously cared about this played with ACE 2 anyway, and A3 still outmatches the competition on it.

If you want current-gen army stuff, go play OA, AiA or wait until the previous content is forward ported. BIS is not beholden to you to provide what you want, and I can only applaud the decisions they've made on content selection as it's a fresh breath from the M4 norm that haunts all shooters nowadays.

[Hurtz72 10]

For all the guys that are looking for organized team based PVP keep checking here http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?163550-Tactical-Battlefield-A-PvP-Gameplay-Modification

We are hoping to have news about a release date soon.

Come join us at http://www.tacticalbattlefield.net

[progamer 14]

You like thinking inside the box. Modding is not just simulating one experience repeatedly as prescribed by the base game. It encompasses a virtual infinity only limited by imagination and technical details. That's what makes A3 so interesting as a platform because, right now, no similar game offers that possibility any more. And it doesn't differ all that much from A2 in function. I seriously fail to see the problem other than "blegh, but realism". Anyone who seriously cared about this played with ACE 2 anyway, and A3 still outmatches the competition on it.

If you want current-gen army stuff, go play OA, AiA or wait until the previous content is forward ported. BIS is not beholden to you to provide what you want, and I can only applaud the decisions they've made on content selection as it's a fresh breath from the M4 norm that haunts all shooters nowadays.

Arma 2 content is not the current modern equipment. It's in the times of M4s and unarmed vehicles.

---------- Post added at 02:49 ---------- Previous post was at 02:47 ----------

The general point is Arma is a realistic sim like game that can be modded from the current state to be an arcade game or as close as possible to VBS2. Right now the game is in a state were things are WIP, but just look at the feedback tracker top most votes for the first 10 pages. There are feature requests and tickets for making things more realistic. Not for making the game more like a tactical shooter.

[L3TUC3 32]

Arma 2 content is not the current modern equipment. It's in the times of M4s and unarmed vehicles.

---------- Post added at 02:49 ---------- Previous post was at 02:47 ----------

The general point is Arma is a realistic sim like game that can be modded from the current state to be an arcade game or as close as possible to VBS2. Right now the game is in a state were things are WIP, but just look at the feedback tracker top most votes for the first 10 pages. There are feature requests and tickets for making things more realistic. Not for making the game more like a tactical shooter.

You bounce all over the place.

BIS made that game, it's called Operation Arrowhead set in 2012. Did you skip that or something? It pretty closely reflects current war scenarios in terms of equipment. It didn't have everything and got a little silly with the mk16 and mk17 being ubiquitous, but certainly can't be mistaken for the cold war or 90's peacekeeping. Unarmed vehicles? You mean unarmored vehicles? Just slap some MRAPS in there and people would moan about A3 being a shameless copypasta from OA. No, you can definitely argue it's a different game with the current content. I really see little to add besides more guns and some weapon systems to OA to make more in line with today's armed forces as not much has changed the last two years. BIS' move to future tech is bolder and maybe a little overambitious.

Yes, things are currently WIP and I'm certain much will change to better reflect real world solutions including additions of features that would help immersion. But you can really only go so far before you make the game tedious. You seem to confuse BIS' attempt to make the base game more accessible with making it more arcade (or less 'real') like, which is not the case. Arma 3 can be a very arcadey shooter as witnessed by plenty of missions and mods, but it can be as real and detailed as the user wishes it. That's it strong point.

But it's base has to be fun and technically up to par in order to draw people in and keep multiplayer going. If a killer mod comes along, great. If not, there's really not that much draw as it currently stands. Making it more 'realistic' is not an end all solution, nor is it what's wrong with the game for a healthy multiplayer environment. I really hope that new gamemode will kick it into gear. I'm truly curious.

[dnk 13]

You must have skipped the underlined part of my post.

Remember that Steamgraph only keeps track of the people who play the game through steam. 100% of the people who play Arma 3 in MP use Steam to do so. How many % of Arma 2 CO Players start the game through steam? (I believe you can launch a Steam copy of Arma OA without starting steam, am I right?)

Clearly, most of the new players bought through Steam. Those new players make up a preponderance of OA players because they're specifically DayZ players (that big mid-2012 spike...). I love how this whole argument ignores the undead elephant in the room.

You can look at swec.se (have I not already linked this in this thread?). It breaks down DayZ/normal players, and it's vastly DayZ players and servers for OA. I believe swec.se includes all online players, not just Steam clients. When you factor this DayZ into the equation, A3 is slightly ahead of OA in MP players(excluding DayZ, since A3 doesn't have it). That's despite not having ACE (for the big private/pub COOP groups), a solid Warfare, more than 1 map (in comparison to 3 maps for OA), and the game very much being a WIP at present. Give it 6 months, and the community will be much stronger, and OA will slowly fall from grace (save DayZ since the standalone will never be released). And that's how it seems to always happen with new BI releases.

But, DOOM AND GLOOM

[.kju 3239]

It is about getting BI's attention to improve the MP side of the game. Not more, not less.

[maffa 29]

You bounce all over the place.

BIS made that game, it's called Operation Arrowhead set in 2012. Did you skip that or something? It pretty closely reflects current war scenarios in terms of equipment. It didn't have everything and got a little silly with the mk16 and mk17 being ubiquitous, but certainly can't be mistaken for the cold war or 90's peacekeeping. Unarmed vehicles? You mean unarmored vehicles? Just slap some MRAPS in there and people would moan about A3 being a shameless copypasta from OA. No, you can definitely argue it's a different game with the current content. I really see little to add besides more guns and some weapon systems to OA to make more in line with today's armed forces as not much has changed the last two years. BIS' move to future tech is bolder and maybe a little overambitious.

Yes, things are currently WIP and I'm certain much will change to better reflect real world solutions including additions of features that would help immersion. But you can really only go so far before you make the game tedious. You seem to confuse BIS' attempt to make the base game more accessible with making it more arcade (or less 'real') like, which is not the case. Arma 3 can be a very arcadey shooter as witnessed by plenty of missions and mods, but it can be as real and detailed as the user wishes it. That's it strong point.

But it's base has to be fun and technically up to par in order to draw people in and keep multiplayer going. If a killer mod comes along, great. If not, there's really not that much draw as it currently stands. Making it more 'realistic' is not an end all solution, nor is it what's wrong with the game for a healthy multiplayer environment. I really hope that new gamemode will kick it into gear. I'm truly curious.

ACE has been the killer mod all htis time, and if BIS would have ever managed to put it inside the engine the number of people drawn from this realistic framework would have been much larger. The more mods will be required in order to play a satifying game (which is of course something very personal) the less people will play it in PUG and pub servers, and the more the "advanced" game mode will be played in private clan servers, away from sight.

Is it good? Is it bad? It depends. From my POV it's oh so bad, because i have to juggle between tons of mods and launchers and folder adjusting and tweaking and wasting time cohordinating with people i play with on what and what not use and waste time trying compatibility, whereas i could just doubleclick an icon and play -yes of course not everybody uses the same mods, but it would be safe to assume that once you put ACE and ACRE inside the game engine 80% of "serious gamers" will be satisfied. From BIS POV it's pure WIN, because all they have to do is launch a barely sketched game in the arena and see it being completed by masses of enthusiastic paying volunteers. In this scenario, BIS move on futuretech is LAZINESS in its purest form: no licences to owe, no real objects to relate and be compared to, it's a designer bliss. If they placed it on another planet they could have also solved all physics problems (Hey this is Zanussi, gravity works differently here).

My peace of mind comes from the fact that i bought in in alpha, saving lots of money, and that maybe in a couple of year A3 will have enough mod content to make me leave A2. How many people like me are there out there? Dunno. But if in the next year or so someone would come up with something like A2+ace im jumping their wagon. It happened with falcon, flight simulator and battlefield, i wouldnt be suprised if it happened again.

[CHB68 10]

;2561793']It is about getting BI's attention to improve the MP side of the game. Not more' date=' not less.[/quote']

Fully agree, not more, not less!

What ever they focus their efforts on; once you finished the single player campaign after some hours, there is only the mulitplayer left, as nobody plays a single player campaign twice!

I spent 659hrs online, running two dedicated servers but actually I'm going to lose interest in ArmA 3 as there is no MP improvement at all, just cosmetics.

Unfortunately.....

[m1lkm8n 410]

;2561793']It is about getting BI's attention to improve the MP side of the game. Not more' date=' not less.[/quote']

+1!

Exactly this thread has gotten pretty derailed from what it was intended

[bvrettski 10]

;2561793']It is about getting BI's attention to improve the MP side of the game. Not more' date=' not less.[/quote']

+1 on that. ^^^^^

Any A3 fanboy that thinks we are here just to trash the game is glossing over the fact that this is the game we want to be playing. There is just very little game TO play. Otherwise we wouldn't be wasting our time posting, giving feedback and suggestions.

User created missions and gametypes are most often WIP (Works in Progress). I would venture to say many of them in the Steam Workshop are unplayable, glitchy, broken due to patches or are just plain poorly designed. This happens with any game that can be modded or mapped. There is a lot unplayable junk created and only the top 1-3% ever draw any attention.

This makes another argument for solid professional MP missions and gametypes that need to come with the game. Developed by BIS, monitored, fixed and upgraded as the game matures..just like any other AAA game release would. Leaving your entire P vs P multiplayer to the open community means there is no consistency. If the next patch breaks Sa-matras Wasteland and he says, "Screw it. I'm tired of fixing what BIS breaks with every patch." then his game is dead until someone volunteers their time to try and patch it along.

That's no way to support a game or build a player base.

Edited November 22, 2013 by Bvrettski

[Varanon 892]

;2561793']It is about getting BI's attention to improve the MP side of the game. Not more' date=' not less.[/quote']

Especially since it made a step backward recently, some missions that used to run fine now have very bad framerates...

[galzohar 31]

The biggest problem is that those who don't like the currently popular game modes simply can't agree on what they would actually like. So even if BIS do end up making something, and even if it isn't completely terrible for multiplayer and is actually maintained, it's still likely to not get any players actually playing it. So far, anything that isn't a "roam around hunting, collect money and equipment" just doesn't get played by enough players, and it seems like it doesn't matter how good it is.

So I'll ask this - What do YOU actually want to play, that you aren't the only one that would be excited to play it?

[progamer 14]

;2561793']It is about getting BI's attention to improve the MP side of the game. Not more' date=' not less.[/quote']

You already have: http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=15987 Try to only post notes that link to tickets that need to be set as related though please.

---------- Post added at 18:17 ---------- Previous post was at 18:13 ----------

ACE has been the killer mod all htis time, and if BIS would have ever managed to put it inside the engine the number of people drawn from this realistic framework would have been much larger. The more mods will be required in order to play a satifying game (which is of course something very personal) the less people will play it in PUG and pub servers, and the more the "advanced" game mode will be played in private clan servers, away from sight.

Is it good? Is it bad? It depends. From my POV it's oh so bad, because i have to juggle between tons of mods and launchers and folder adjusting and tweaking and wasting time cohordinating with people i play with on what and what not use and waste time trying compatibility, whereas i could just doubleclick an icon and play -yes of course not everybody uses the same mods, but it would be safe to assume that once you put ACE and ACRE inside the game engine 80% of "serious gamers" will be satisfied. From BIS POV it's pure WIN, because all they have to do is launch a barely sketched game in the arena and see it being completed by masses of enthusiastic paying volunteers. In this scenario, BIS move on futuretech is LAZINESS in its purest form: no licences to owe, no real objects to relate and be compared to, it's a designer bliss. If they placed it on another planet they could have also solved all physics problems (Hey this is Zanussi, gravity works differently here).

My peace of mind comes from the fact that i bought in in alpha, saving lots of money, and that maybe in a couple of year A3 will have enough mod content to make me leave A2. How many people like me are there out there? Dunno. But if in the next year or so someone would come up with something like A2+ace im jumping their wagon. It happened with falcon, flight simulator and battlefield, i wouldnt be suprised if it happened again.

BI has put many ACE features into Arma 3, which shows you how well made and popular ACE is. It's more of provide support for large mods like ACE and others with scripting commands and new features complimenting the mods.

[Tacti-Cool 10]

BI has put many ACE features into Arma 3, which shows you how well made and popular ACE is. It's more of provide support for large mods like ACE and others with scripting commands and new features complimenting the mods.

Name ten.

[progamer 14]

Name ten.

Cannot remember at the moment but I know having weapons and equipment have actual weight is from ACE.

[Varanon 892]

Cannot remember at the moment but I know having weapons and equipment have actual weight is from ACE.

... and reality :D

[iceman77 18]

+1!

Exactly this thread has gotten pretty derailed from what it was intended

The thread is about how "MP is dying fast".

[Tacti-Cool 10]

Im not sure why its not in the Multiplayer section of the forum.