A Large Fixed Wing transport aircraft for Arma 3

[progamer 14]

I would prefer the YMC-130

I linked those two videos because one of them shows a HEMTT, HUNTER/ MRAP, Artillery, an attack chopper like the Comanche, and a few other vehicles we have in the game already. The A-400M is the C-130's replacement, a STOL and can back up on its own like the C-17.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

LOL, the YMC... no. Not practical. As we see what happened to it when someone ended up hitting the stall button too soon.

[maffa 29]

@progamer, i hope you will believe me if i say i know a thing or two about planes and warplanes.

Now i would like that you would pick up an Atlas, or google map, and look for Majorca in the Balearic archipelago. Look at it. I would like to convey my frustration in seeing you people insisting on the feasibility of operating a cargo plane inside the perimeter of a 50x50 km island such as Majorca (actually, Majorca is bigger than Altis, and has more land mass). Can you see what i mean?

Your fixed wing cargo can be a Cessna Caravan or a Pilatus PC-12, both in use to different militaries, but again, why using a fixed wing plane when a chopper does everything more efficiently, has all the bonuses and no penalties? It is simply useless to have an A400M or C130 C17 C27J, because the island is too tiny for that. Would you take a A320 to go from Palma to Alcudìa? No, no you wouldnt. You wouldnt even take it if there were enemies down in the middle, you wouldnt even if you had to transport one (1) tank, or that 116 AIs. It's useless, no matter how you turn it. It's overkill.

You want it just the same. I can understand that. I hope you will get it, eventually, when all the other more pressing, important, priority stuff has been made, and people at BIS are idle (a human playable cargo plane, i mean -i hope some Ai controlled paradrop module will come out soon or late) . Or, as it is right that will happen, a mod will do it, because this kind of whim screams for mods.

This is my opinion.

[progamer 14]

@progamer, i hope you will believe me if i say i know a thing or two about planes and warplanes.

Now i would like that you would pick up an Atlas, or google map, and look for Majorca in the Balearic archipelago. Look at it. I would like to convey my frustration in seeing you people insisting on the feasibility of operating a cargo plane inside the perimeter of a 50x50 km island such as Majorca (actually, Majorca is bigger than Altis, and has more land mass). Can you see what i mean?

Your fixed wing cargo can be a Cessna Caravan or a Pilatus PC-12, both in use to different militaries, but again, why using a fixed wing plane when a chopper does everything more efficiently, has all the bonuses and no penalties? It is simply useless to have an A400M or C130 C17 C27J, because the island is too tiny for that. Would you take a A320 to go from Palma to Alcudìa? No, no you wouldnt. You wouldnt even take it if there were enemies down in the middle, you wouldnt even if you had to transport one (1) tank, or that 116 AIs. It's useless, no matter how you turn it. It's overkill.

You want it just the same. I can understand that. I hope you will get it, eventually, when all the other more pressing, important, priority stuff has been made, and people at BIS are idle (a human playable cargo plane, i mean -i hope some Ai controlled paradrop module will come out soon or late) . Or, as it is right that will happen, a mod will do it, because this kind of whim screams for mods.

This is my opinion.

You are thinking like the rest if the planet is ocean in the Armaverse. Not every mission starts on runways on the island. We had a C-130 in A2, and the A-400M is essentially the c-130's replacement.

[chortles 263]

when i say "old weapons and vehicles" i mean stable and up to par with A3, not crude crtl+c crtl+v just-as-they-are portings . I would like a dedicated artist and programmer to do M16's and M4's and Ak74s and M110s and Humvees and Dragunovs etc. I can only hope.

... so you missed the part in my post where Maruk was saying in his interview "nope, not happening"?

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Why not use brand new 21st century weapons, equivalent to those in arma 2? Masada ACR, medium snipers lie the T-5000, or Sako TRG M10? Hell, we might as well, we got the good stuff like the Intervention .408 already. Lets get some more new tech.

7,62мм ÑнайперÑÐºÐ°Ñ Ð²Ð¸Ð½Ñ‚Ð¾Ð²ÐºÐ° СВ-98

Edited October 18, 2013 by DarkSideSixOfficial

[maffa 29]

You are thinking like the rest if the planet is ocean in the Armaverse. Not every mission starts on runways on the island. We had a C-130 in A2, and the A-400M is essentially the c-130's replacement.

You are asking, on october 18th 2013, as per release 1.03, for something that has to be modeled, shaped, coded, implemented in the game, tested and released to be used only in the first 30 seconds 1 mission out of ten at best . Am i right?

Dont you feel like there could be something a little more important than that?

---------- Post added at 21:30 ---------- Previous post was at 21:27 ----------

Why not use brand new 21st century weapons, equivalent to those in arma 2? Masada ACR, medium snipers lie the T-5000, or Sako TRG M10? Hell, we might as well, we got the good stuff like the Intervention .408 already. Lets get some more new tech.

Oh, love those .408. I found them just a month before my clan sold their souls to A3. Damn.

... so you missed the part in my post where Maruk was saying in his interview "nope, not happening"?

in my wishful thinking reading, i understood "NOW we dont have enough time to make it ALL", that roughly transaltes in "maybe later we may do something later"...

[progamer 14]

You are asking, on october 18th 2013, as per release 1.03, for something that has to be modeled, shaped, coded, implemented in the game, tested and released to be used only in the first 30 seconds 1 mission out of ten at best . Am i right?

Dont you feel like there could be something a little more important than that?

The first 30 seconds? So we have limited ideas for missions now? There are many uses that could last the entire mission, you are not thinking creatively enough. Even realistically speaking there are many options that would be a lot longer than 30 seconds.

---------- Post added at 23:31 ---------- Previous post was at 23:30 ----------

Why not use brand new 21st century weapons, equivalent to those in arma 2? Masada ACR, medium snipers lie the T-5000, or Sako TRG M10? Hell, we might as well, we got the good stuff like the Intervention .408 already. Lets get some more new tech.

This is getting off topic from the thread.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

If im not mistaken, BI stated that they will be supporting A3 for 5 years. Look, they don't have to make it now, i mean there was limited content for Arma 2 as well. But in due time, i do believe all these neat and useful tech can, and more than likely sketched, modeled, tweaked, and put into the game as free DLC.

---------- Post added at 21:35 ---------- Previous post was at 21:33 ----------

That is enough time for all our hopes and dreams to be thoroughly looked over.

[maffa 29]

The first 30 seconds? So we have limited ideas for missions now? There are many uses that could last the entire mission, you are not thinking creatively enough. Even realistically speaking there are many options that would be a lot longer than 30 seconds.

Uh? what do you want to do with a cargo plane coming from off map with a load to discharge? Either you land and unload it, or paradrop it as you go away offmap again... Tell me i am sincerely curious. I may change my mind on the whole issue.

[progamer 14]

If im not mistaken, BI stated that they will be supporting A3 for 5 years. Look, they don't have to make it now, i mean there was limited content for Arma 2 as well. But in due time, i do believe all these neat and useful tech can, and more than likely sketched, modeled, tweaked, and put into the game as free DLC.

---------- Post added at 21:35 ---------- Previous post was at 21:33 ----------

That is enough time for all our hopes and dreams to be thoroughly looked over.

Maybe we can go back to having a more sim like game, like arma 2 was as well.

---------- Post added at 23:40 ---------- Previous post was at 23:36 ----------

Uh? what do you want to do with a cargo plane coming from off map with a load to discharge? Either you land and unload it, or paradrop it as you go away offmap again... Tell me i am sincerely curious. I may change my mind on the whole issue.

For usermissions:

Vehicle transport player operated.

Realistic aesthetics parked at the airports.

Story line, loading the aircraft.

AWACS - This is a really good one.

Para-drops.

Supply drops.

Deliveries.

Airiel combat related missions.

Escort missions - Another good one.

Looks a million times better dropping troops out of a proper plane than a helicopter.

modern D-day like missions.

Recovery

Rescue missions both civilian (Coast guard) and military.

Remember "get to the downed plane" in Arma 2's OA campaign?

And I could still go on.

Edited October 18, 2013 by ProGamer

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

!!!IDEA!!! - This will have to have some serious modder/dev backing though. Look at a map. If you look at Limnos (Altis), Stratis is not that far away. Why not have a map, where Altis, and Stratis co exist? I think it is possible. Do't know how many errors or issues, or bugs would come about, but someone must be mad enough to try it. What i am getting at, is place Stratis the same distance as it is away from Altis, as it is in real life.

Here, a diagram.

[maffa 29]

1) what do you mean with vehicle transport player operated?

2) static prop, total waste of time ATM

3) wot

4) AWACS? for what? just admit it you dont know jack about military airplanes and how they operate, do you?

5) paradrops and supply drops: back to 30 second at the beginning of the game

6) see above

7) aerial combat related missions in a 50kmx50 map: you are crazy see 4

8) escort mission see 4 5 and 6

9) you and your 30 friends and a million AI's? why not but go back to 5.

[edit]

10) static prop, see 2

11) static prop see 2

[edit end]

So, strictly speaking, either you go back to that 30 seconds usage, or cosmetic purposes, or complete misunderstanding of planes and their use. So no, you havent convinced me yet.

Feel free to go on.

---------- Post added at 21:49 ---------- Previous post was at 21:47 ----------

!!!IDEA!!! - This will have to have some serious modder/dev backing though. Look at a map. If you look at Limnos (Altis), Stratis is not that far away. Why not have a map, where Altis, and Stratis co exist? I think it is possible. Do't know how many errors or issues, or bugs would come about, but someone must be mad enough to try it. What i am getting at, is place Stratis the same distance as it is away from Altis, as it is in real life.

Here, a diagram.

http://www.sy-thetis.org/Thetis2002/ToLimnos/ToLimnos.gif

that looks a new map altogether, much bigger. Of course the bigger we go, the more sense it gets to have planes. Of course if you playin sardinia or sicily instead of Majorca everything makes a little more sense.

Edited October 18, 2013 by Maffa

[progamer 14]

1) what do you mean with vehicle transport player operated?

2) totally waste of time ATM

3) wot

4) AWACS? for what? just admit it you dont know jack about military airplanes and how they operate, do you?

5) paradrops and supply drops: back to 30 second at the beginning of the game

6) see above

7) aerial combat related missions in a 50kmx50 map: you are crazy see 4

8) escort mission see 4 5 and 6

9) you and your 30 friends and a million AI's? but go back to 5.

So, strictly speaking, either you go back to that 30 seconds usage, or cosmetic purposes, or complete misunderstanding of planes and their use. So no, you havent convinced me yet.

Feel free to go on.

---------- Post added at 21:49 ---------- Previous post was at 21:47 ----------

that looks a new map altogether, much bigger. Of course the bigger we go, the more sense it gets to have planes. Of course if you playin sardinia or sicily instead of Majorca everything makes a little more sense.

Arma 2 had a C-130, anything less is a downgrade. I also did put "usermissions" and not realistic missions. The whole supply drop scenario could easily be related to getting aid to a people in a hostile area.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Yeah, but were are only looking at Limnos in the ceneter and Psara. Those are both Altis and Stratis. Making one map with them both same distance like that on map, being an Airfield installed on Stratis, that could be where the NATO air base is. Idk, just a wild idea.

---------- Post added at 21:55 ---------- Previous post was at 21:53 ----------

A full blown AWACS i don't think would be necessary. Ahaha, but maybe we could use the Carrier based Hawk AWACS/Patrol. Maybe give it a larger radar to enable real AWACS functionality?

[maffa 29]

its a whim. a useless whim. all you need is a nice interior and a script for parajumping people and supplies, and maybe a static prop as a gate guardian. all the rest is useless whim. You want to play single mission plane pilot go fly on a flight simulator. If you want to be in the same scene with infantrymen either you are a chopper pilot or a downed TacAIR pilot. Besides i doubt anyone would like a 10-20 minutes ferry flight from Stratis to Altis. Planes warfare and infantry warfare are TWO DIFFERENT WORLDS. They move to different paces, in different areas, with different doctrines. We have 1 attack chopper for 4 factions. 1 tank. 2 MRAP and a truck. What is the use for a cargo plane?

[/color]

Yeah, but were are only looking at Limnos in the ceneter and Psara. Those are both Altis and Stratis. Making one map with them both same distance like that on map, being an Airfield installed on Stratis, that could be where the NATO air base is. Idk, just a wild idea.

---------- Post added at 21:55 ---------- Previous post was at 21:53 ----------

A full blown AWACS i don't think would be necessary. Ahaha, but maybe we could use the Carrier based Hawk AWACS/Patrol. Maybe give it a larger radar to enable real AWACS functionality?

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_ej5kQwZWlzM/TPsZOZHFxGI/AAAAAAAABR0/5C7_YeLSFy0/s640/PLAN%2527s_AWACS_.jpg

or just use ships with a radar, for jeez sake? as i said a third of the map is water. there are turtles in it. Lets go kick some turtles!

Edited October 19, 2013 by Maffa

[oldbear 390]

@ DarkSideSixOfficial : 1° Stratis and Altis terrains are not based upon same parameters -terrain grid size- so you can't mix them on a single larger terrain.

2° Altis is already an xtra large terrain, playing an "over-Xtra" large one featuring two islands such as Altis and a rebuilt Stratis will be too high a challenge for most of Arma3 players rigs.

There is no need for large fixed wings transport aircraft, but only for agile short take off and landing ones such as :

- Embraer KC-390

- Airbus Military C295

- Airbus Military CN-235 (ex-CASA)

- Multirole Transport Aircraft (MTAL) project (Russia-India)

- Alenia Aermacchi C-27J Spartan

- AN-2-100 (An-2 turbo retrofit)

Edited October 19, 2013 by Old Bear

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

@ DarkSideSixOfficial : 1° Stratis and Altis terrains are not based upon same parameters -terrain grid size- so you can't mix them on a single larger terrain.

2° Altis is already an xtra large terrain, playing an "over-Xtra" large one featuring two islands such as Altis and a rebuilt Stratis will be too high a challenge for most of Arma3 players rigs.

There is no need for large fixed wings transport aircraft, but only for agile short take off and landing ones such as :

- Embraer KC-390

- Airbus Military C295

- Airbus Military CN-235 (ex-CASA)

- Multirole Transport Aircraft (MTAL) project (Russia-India)

- Alenia Aermacchi C-27J Spartan

- AN-2-100 (An-2 turbo retrofit)

Well thanks, it was simply a thought. But at that, only a few of those are small transports, the first and second ones seems to be more large/medium transport. But yeah, i agree, maybe not "Large Transport" but something more compact. Simply tactical HALO operations maybe.

[progamer 14]

Well thanks, it was simply a thought. But at that, only a few of those are small transports, the first and second ones seems to be more large/medium transport. But yeah, i agree, maybe not "Large Transport" but something more compact. Simply tactical HALO operations maybe.

We had small transports and large transports in Arma 2.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

True. I think we need something better looking than the An-2. I think it's days have long passed.

[chortles 263]

The interesting thing about the C-27J is that while in real-life the "AC-XX" program (to buy and refit a C-27J with "proven/known" weapons to act as a potential AC-130 successor) foundered on the funding rocks, Arma 3's official theme tends towards the "almost was" or the "in non-American service" instead of the actually fictional actually would mesh with it... and Alenia/ATK ended up continuing development of the "MC-27J" concept anyway with an armament similar to that in the AC-130J, combining precision-guided weapons with a roll-on/roll off ("RO-RO") 30 mm gun-on-a-pallet... although the MC-130W Dragon Spear (renamed MC-130W Combat Spears with installed weapons) and AC-130J Ghostrider/AC-130W Stinger II are already both doing the "PGMs+30 mm gun" thing.

[oldbear 390]

Something better looking than the An-2-100 ?

Looking quite good :cool:

[oldbear 390]

Of course, I found what we need on Altis Island and on Stratis as well : Beriev Be-200 amphibious aircraft !

The Beriev Be-200 is a multipurpose amphibious aircraft manufactured by Russia-based Irkut. The aircraft was developed under Irkut's first full-scale civil programme. The Be-200 cooperation programme includes key aviation industry companies such as Beriev Aircraft, Airbus, EADS-Irkut Seaplane (EISP) and EADS.

http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/berievbe200multipurp/images/3-img_6250s.jpg

Edited October 22, 2013 by Old Bear

[marksinnerdemon 11]

I doubt you will see this, and I'll forget to check it, but whoever told you the C-17 take of distance is less then the C-130J is smoking, injesting something. I have spend 6+ years of life in logistics and worked around C-130H, J, Talons series, the spartans, and not to mention C-17s etc. I haven't flown them but observation of them most of my adult life proves otherwise, and add to that the specs.....

C-130 J - Takeoff distance: 3,127 ft (953 m) at 155,000 lb (70,300 kg) gross weight

C-17 - Takeoff run at MTOW: 7,600 ft (2,316 m)

A-400M - Tactical takeoff distance: 980 m (3,215 ft) (aircraft weight 100 tonnes, soft field, ISA, sea level)

Not to mention no one is sending in the C-17 into any place not very secure. The aircraft isn't as rugged and field friendly to fix. I have unloaded enough of those engines and watched the mechanics work on them enough to tell you that. I can't say much for the A-400M. Being between the C-130 and C-17 in size I don't see much value other then a "bigger" C-130 (which granted has its benefits). However your assumption either are better seems kinda false (especially in the C-17 case) and with the cost of the C-17 and 400 I don't see them being a big thing. Also I unless the USAF picks up the A-400M I doubt it will have much impact in NATO other then being in NATO countries fleets. From a purely carry capacity to FOB locations with non-improved runways I just don't see your argument being valid even 1- years from now with the aircraft discussed.

[CaptainAzimuth 714]

Of course, I found what we need on Altis Island and on Stratis as well : Beriev Be-200 amphibious aircraft !

http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/berievbe200multipurp/images/3s-img_6250s.jpg

http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/berievbe200multipurp/images/3-img_6250s.jpg

This is absolutley perfect. Since Arma 3 has better implimented the technology for Air-Sea vehicles,

It would make sense to implement it in the Vanilla, could be used not only as an asset and part of the game, but it could be one of those things that displays the capabilities of the engine. Russians make some great sea planes. Would be nice to see that BE-200 on the opfor side or something.