geometry LOD and AI

[super-truite 54]

In Arma 2, the AI were often going through walls (particularly annoying with zombie mods for instance). Now that I began to make addons, I guess it is because they don't always take into account the geometry LOD of objects. It seems to be a problem in Arma3 too. Do you know why this is happening?

My guess was that it was made on purpose to avoid AI to get stuck because an object with a geometry LOD has been moved in the middle of its path, yet it seems to be "working" randomly so I am not sure...

Also, the other day, I was trying to make a "test building" and while my player was blocked by the geometry, the AI was jumping from the roofs, regardless of it, so I am not sure I understand the whole story since the BI buildings seem to work better (more reliable for buildings already defined in the map?).

I intend in the future to make some animations for the AI to move inside the Orlyonok (http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?157756-Ekranoplane-Orlyonok), but since they don't "see" the geometry of the plane, it will look buggy...

[[aps]gnat 28]

I think you need to look/test the VIEW GEOMETRY

The VIEW GEOMETRY affects the AI's pathfinding

My guess was that it was made on purpose to avoid AI to get stuck because an object

Yep

I intend in the future to make some animations for the AI to move inside the Orlyonok

Yeh, never had much success myself with AI INSIDE a vehicle ......

Good luck

[super-truite 54]

Thanks, I completely missed this LOD, will do some tests.

[redstone 14]

Hi, I want to make some tutorials to avoid non-functional models. For example models and their configuration to achieve AI_friendly buildings. Path lods in A3 are more functional and correct, so AI should have better behaviour there. Applied animation are problem. During the animation, AI ignore any geometry, animation is just "played".

With geometries... When p3d has only geometry lod, engine uses automatically this lod as Fire and view geometry, too.

What problem exactly do you have with?

[charon productions 10]

Applied animation are problem. During the animation, AI ignore any geometry, animation is just "played".

With geometries...

I have never been able to find a good reason why this is actually happening. And disabling the AI parts also

disables geometry LOD consideration for the particular model by the engine.

Do you know the reason?

Playing animations WITH geometry LOD considered can be desirable sometimes.

I was hoping that the introduction of PhysX would 'fix' this behaviour, as it has been always like it.

Models do still penetrate objects at times however even when they are not user-animated.

[super-truite 54]

In fact it was just my geometry lod which was wrong! Yet, the issue with animations is likely to be a problem for me...

Like charon, I don't see why it is so difficult to fix? I understand that most of the time, you don't want the geometry to interfere with the animation, but can't you give us the option to stop the animation if a geo lod is encountered (with an extra parameter in switchmove, playmove ect.) ?

[redstone 14]

I have never been able to find a good reason why this is actually happening. And disabling the AI parts also

disables geometry LOD consideration for the particular model by the engine.

Do you know the reason?

Playing animations WITH geometry LOD considered can be desirable sometimes.

I was hoping that the introduction of PhysX would 'fix' this behaviour, as it has been always like it.

Models do still penetrate objects at times however even when they are not user-animated.

That's something to improve, but there is a lot of things, which should be better. Now we have to adapt these conditions and make it in another-functional way.

Which exactly models do this "penetration"? From my view of some community object, there is a lot of bugs in models, so they couldn't work correctly.

I.e. Geometry has to have correctly generated component, weights and also have to be convex.

There is more "borders" which can break model, but that's something for another long story...

[[aps]gnat 28]

When p3d has only geometry lod, engine uses automatically this lod as Fire and view geometry, too.

What?!

I assume you mean, "If you dont have a separate Fire and View geometry" ... "engine uses automatically this lod as Fire and view geometry"

EDIT, sorry, re-read.

BTW, are you new here to support/help Mod'ers in the forums?

[redstone 14]

Exactly as you said.

Well yes. After some time in bis, I decided to help with some know how to the community to spread the bas of modders.

[meshcarver 12]

Redstone, if you are really going to help modders and more clearly explain a correct process for modelling structures to be more consistent with BI official objects I'm now your number 1 fan..!

Even BASIC information like minimum ideal thickness of a geolod so unit doesn't glitch through etc would be welcome... Actually it'd be fantastic for very basic things like that to be finally nailed down once and for all mate!

[Sealife 22]

When p3d has only geometry lod, engine uses automatically this lod as Fire and view geometry, too

Not in the latest development build it doesnt , was scratching my had yesterday then realised since ALtis Exe , without actual Fire GEo you get no Impact only Collision please remember the tools we use are probably older so our buildings dont have Geom Phys and may not experience what you do ;).

[redstone 14]

I am going to do something like "step by step" video tutorials, which help you to make A3 structure with all features, we can make on it.

I have to make some plan and begin with that. I want to begin with the basics, then go through all "special" lods such as geometries, roadways,...

We have many improvements and "knowhow tips", which can help a lot. (Breakable glass, correct AI pathfinding in buildings, AI always open the doors,..., destructions and many others. )

Some things will be available to do after some official tools will be distributed, but the basic I'll adapt to actual commnity tools.

[ProfTournesol 956]

I am going to do something like "step by step" video tutorials, which help you to make A3 structure with all features, we can make on it.

I have to make some plan and begin with that. I want to begin with the basics, then go through all "special" lods such as geometries, roadways,...

We have many improvements and "knowhow tips", which can help a lot. (Breakable glass, correct AI pathfinding in buildings, AI always open the doors,..., destructions and many others. )

Some things will be available to do after some official tools will be distributed, but the basic I'll adapt to actual commnity tools.

Brilliant :)

[maturin 12]

I don't mean to be snarky, but don't forget to make everyone at BI follow your tutorials too, Redstone.

Five minutes into playing Altis and I see an AI walk into a stone cottage through a wall or window.

[odyseus 19]

We salute you Sir! /:'):icon_dj::icon_dj:

[meshcarver 12]

That's excellent news Redstone, thank you!

[[aps]gnat 28]

Exactly as you said.

Well yes. After some time in bis, I decided to help with some know how to the community to spread the bas of modders.

Great :D

Good to see some further investment by BI in what makes this games series great.

..... now we just need the tools improved ;)

Thanks redstone.

[meshcarver 12]

To clarify more, it'd be great if you could do a REALLY in depth tut on how to get say, a 2 floor building with a ladder/stairs, working doors etc FULLY complete and ingame, so when we are creating these objects we know there's NOTHING we've left out maybe, like naming class and everything associated!!! :D

[Dwarden 1125]

we will try to provide that too ...

[meshcarver 12]

...that is music to many ears... Fantastic Dwarden, thank you all.

[redstone 14]

Described object is currently "barracks" building. There is a lot of features. There is 2nd floor, many doors, ladder,...

According to A2 models, I found some mistakes which are made during creating of the any buildings, so I'll make exactly pipe-line to make the correct one.

[cifordayzserver 119]

We are in the final stages of training two new modellers for A2 building modelling.

Our group has started a project of taking all the viable Arma 1 MLOD buildings and opening them up.

A sub-project born of that is "ArmaVersity" we hope to spread the knowledge of every level of modding so that it is less of a journey for only the brave at heart!

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?160746-ArmaVersity-Est-2013-Are-you-ready-to-go-quot-Back-to-School-quot

Our hope is to make the information widely available and accessible as well as provide a live environment where new modellers can share screens and get direct advice from experienced modders!

We hope to start holding "Hangouts" on a regular basis where anyone can join and help teach or learn.

[pierremgi 4886]

Hello BI community, developers and players. Any news about Redstone project or, at least, links for starting modelling?