There should be multiple jets in the release version

[kylania 567]

i'll marry a czech girl

If umm, Internet research has taught me anything it's that we should all be so lucky as to marry a Czech girl. ;)

[GottyPlays 10]

I'm not going to let the quality of the OP detract from the message here. Don't let his subtext about subscribers side track the issue.

The fact remains, in terms of playable content, this game is going to release with way less that A2 or A1 did.

The real lack of proper fixed wing is disturbing. I've read all the bollcoks about how we've got drones and don't need manned aircraft and although I'm only an armchair expert, I think we can all see that this simply doesn't stack up. No army, particularly one with current or near future western military doctrine is going to war without air superiority. It's inconceivable.

Apart from the essential control of the skies over our troops, both these arenas are islands. So that means every piece of kit arrived by ship or plane and given that the story is of a drawdown, they are all going out in the same manner. Yet we have none of these assets.

I appreciate that the chaps have come clean, and it's refreshing that Jay doesn't use some of the hideous marketing speak I've read from some of the others, but this is still a bad let down, that good given reasons can only assuage so much. This game will be released considerably unfinished. Gorgeous, but unfinished. And that's a real shame.

I have noticed the phrase 'combined arms' seems to have been replaced by 'infantry focussed'. That, for me isn't ArmA. If I wanted infantry focussed, there's a billion other games that do that pretty well. Not as well, granted as A3 or even A2/OA, but with the same limited scope we're going get next month. That's a shame too.

I find it distressing that some users here are attacking the OP because his threat to stop spending is clearly a spent one. He's already paid. We get that. Everything else he says is top drawer and I really hope there's more people about to say "YES! Damnit he right". There's too much arse kissing going on here.

Agreed.

[no use for a name 0]

i hope so. but certainly im sure if you guys start with that litany: "ooh!111! arma 3 is so cool1!1! everything is perfect1!11! ihihi i love bis, i'll marry a czech girl and ill call my soon Marek in your honor!111!111" they will not be so stimulated to add news vehicles and jets, noone would be.

or steel beasts if you love tanks. so lets play just with 2 teams, a bunch of new rifles and nothing more. let's go!111!! CTF here i come!!!!1!!

nope.

maybe it's because most people realize that we were never promised anything, and that anyone is free to make all the aircraft they want for the game. You're hyperbolic statement of fans kissing BIS's ass is asinine and just troll bait. From what I've seen, the fans are the biggest critics. It's just that they tend not to rattle off stupid posts and insults, and instead follow the proper procedures to get the dev's attention.

[comp_uter15776 1]

maybe it's because most people realize that we were never promised anything, and that anyone is free to make all the aircraft they want for the game. You're hyperbolic statement of fans kissing BIS's ass is asinine and just troll bait. From what I've seen, the fans are the biggest critics. It's just that they tend not to rattle off stupid posts and insults, and instead follow the proper procedures to get the dev's attention.

Another "community will fix it" post.

This fractures the game so badly, for say, take the A-10 (or maybe A-15?! in A3 land!)... If that was a community mod, only some servers would have it. Only some would use it. Because BIS made it and it's there for everyone, it's used a lot and everyone is so much happier. My solution: either get an autodownloader, or add more content. Community will fix it is not the correct attitude.

[Beagle 684]

Another "community will fix it" post.

This fractures the game so badly, for say, take the A-10 (or maybe A-15?! in A3 land!)... If that was a community mod, only some servers would have it. Only some would use it. Because BIS made it and it's there for everyone, it's used a lot and everyone is so much happier. My solution: either get an autodownloader, or add more content. Community will fix it is not the correct attitude.

That's right. The Community did never fix anything in the game All it ever did was splitting up into ACE, DayZ, Clan MOD and vanilla branches.

Currently there are barely any "serious" servers left that allow to join without any mods.

[maffa 29]

*

couldnt say better. i really dont understand the little funboy army that whatever bis does they are happy with.

we have less weapons, less vehicles, less jets than before but its all good. for someone...

this is true and i cant understand how people can cope with it. less armies, less variants... if there were at least a scheme of completion, like "we are at 40% of release version". Moreover they dont really need to take any documentaion, they are just making things up...

first of all im totally against this "lets stay more focus on infantry" politic, but that's just my opinion. second even if we accept it that's not a good excuse to not implement some jet. this game is not based on asymmetric warfare but on a conventional war. so jets could play a primary role in many missions. and last but not least important it should be the map maker to decide what vehicle should play a primary role on his mission.

edit:

also...what about CAS. we will not have an A-10 or something similar to deal with tanks. and is not acceptable: CAS has the primary role to support infantry on the ground, an "infantry focused" option not avaible anymore, at least from fixed wings.

Jets are the top of the food chain in arma because you dont know how to play it, and/or arma dont have any instrument to let you play it right as well. You would need AA batteries, offensive and defensive CAPs, E3 , all in an area as big as the aegean sea as a whole. In order for your A10 to operate there must be a couple F15/F22 hoveing over it some thousand feet above. You can have it supporting whatever your SOFLAM may light up, but AI controlled, why not?

Symmetrical war means that two conventional armies are facing each other. If one side has tanks i cant see why the other cant deploy its own tanks, instead of A10s. And if the war is asymmetrical (i.e. you are guerrilla fighters or other kind of irregular troops) all the more reason for not having an attack airplane at your disposal. The answer for a tank doesnt need to be an airplane, it could also be an attack helo like the Apache, or another tank (or two, for that matter).

Just giving out options, see? In any case in general all those arguing that there's less than A1&2 are right, fixed wing or not.

I'm just laughing at the thought of an infantry only battle across 270km^2 landmass from opposite ends :P

cos you keep forgetting about helicopters...

Another "community will fix it" post.

This fractures the game so badly, for say, take the A-10 (or maybe A-15?! in A3 land!)... If that was a community mod, only some servers would have it. Only some would use it. Because BIS made it and it's there for everyone, it's used a lot and everyone is so much happier. My solution: either get an autodownloader, or add more content. Community will fix it is not the correct attitude.

oh that i wholly agree. it seems BIS found its little cache of slaves that will finish their job and make it complete for free, and they get the €€€... this is luck! (until someone goes to review what happend to FSX and MS flight, again, and how little long this little trick can go forth)

[progamer 14]

this is true and i cant understand how people can cope with it. less armies, less variants... if there were at least a scheme of completion, like "we are at 40% of release version". Moreover they dont really need to take any documentaion, they are just making things up...

If you don't want to use jets in game, whats stopping you from not playing with them? Nothing! :p

Jets are the top of the food chain in arma because you dont know how to play it, and/or arma dont have any instrument to let you play it right as well. You would need AA batteries, offensive and defensive CAPs, E3 , all in an area as big as the aegean sea as a whole. In order for your A10 to operate there must be a couple F15/F22 hoveing over it some thousand feet above. You can have it supporting whatever your SOFLAM may light up, but AI controlled, why not?

Symmetrical war means that two conventional armies are facing each other. If one side has tanks i cant see why the other cant deploy its own tanks, instead of A10s. And if the war is asymmetrical (i.e. you are guerrilla fighters or other kind of irregular troops) all the more reason for not having an attack airplane at your disposal. The answer for a tank doesnt need to be an airplane, it could also be an attack helo like the Apache, or another tank (or two, for that matter).

Just giving out options, see? In any case in general all those arguing that there's less than A1&2 are right, fixed wing or not.

cos you keep forgetting about helicopters...

oh that i wholly agree. it seems BIS found its little cache of slaves that will finish their job and make it complete for free, and they get the €€€... this is luck! (until someone goes to review what happend to FSX and MS flight, again, and how little long this little trick can go forth)

If you don't like Jets in Arma, why don't you just not use them or play with them? :P

[maffa 29]

that i already answered in several posts, but thank you for asking :)

[comp_uter15776 1]

I was merely jesting at the thought of a 270km^2 staged battle, of course we'd use the transport available most of the time.

[pressytcn 10]

somewhere earlier in the thread someone posted that jets werent realy used on missions well i disagree on almost every server i been on we had an a10 in the air and varius other mod jets even in arma if control the air you control the battlefield and drones can never replace a skilled pilot and his judgement so ofcause there will be more jets and if not theres a huge devoted community probaly already working on it

[comp_uter15776 1]

somewhere earlier in the thread someone posted that jets werent realy used on missions well i disagree on almost every server i been on we had an a10 in the air and varius other mod jets even in arma if control the air you control the battlefield and drones can never replace a skilled pilot and his judgement so ofcause there will be more jets and if not theres a huge devoted community probaly already working on it

That user was on about campaign missions and that air assets was featured rather little in them, I think.

[maffa 29]

I was merely jesting at the thought of a 270km^2 staged battle, of course we'd use the transport available most of the time.

LOL my faoult then!

somewhere earlier in the thread someone posted that jets werent realy used on missions well i disagree on almost every server i been on we had an a10 in the air and varius other mod jets even in arma if control the air you control the battlefield and drones can never replace a skilled pilot and his judgement so ofcause there will be more jets and if not theres a huge devoted community probaly already working on it

LOL voice-to-text it's all the rage these days!

[sproyd 2]

LOL OP can go back to the BF3 fixed wing campaign mission that we all know was so amazing and awesome ;)

[Alistair 10]

So, posted in another thread but this fits better in here:

MV-22's would work fine as HALO units.

And, theres a new cargo plane in development by brazilian EMBRAER.Its supposed to compete with the Hercules in the international market.

And they look great too. :D

[b00tsy 28]

I will be really really disappointed if the release will only have one jet in the game and thus have to depend on mods. This whole time I was looking forward to creating nice air combat missions, that aint gonna happen thus with the official content I payed for... hence the single airfield on the huge map Altis.

[dale0404 5]

hence the single airfield on the huge map Altis.

If you look at some of the videos that have Altis in them, especially the helicopters one you will see that there are numerous smaller airfields all over Altis, in fact a Dev has even stated this.

[b00tsy 28]

If you look at some of the videos that have Altis in them, especially the helicopters one you will see that there are numerous smaller airfields all over Altis, in fact a Dev has even stated this.

Those are just soft airstrips if I saw it correctly, not suited for fixed wings.

I am atm still shocked at the lack of content with the official release so maybe I am not thinking straight.

---------- Post added at 03:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:26 PM ----------

Please also understand the we *may* see additional content be added in through the campaign episodic DLCs. That *may* include additional aircraft, armored, and small arms coming our way through the coming months after the full release of the game.

Then don´t call it a final release when half the content is still missing. I am not looking forward to wait an other year before they may or may not decide to add a couple more jets in the game. I would even be satisfied with upgraded A2 jets as placeholder, but one jet at release, come on. Thats an insult to all the ArmA pilots.

[*LK1* 10]

maybe it's because most people realize that we were never promised anything,

this is not correct at all. they promised to give us a wargame. jets are part of the war. end of the story. you guys are a really strange kind of costumers, that kind of that every company wish to have...they also never promised to give us many other things, probably because they are obvious?

what is implicit in any future game of the same serie/company is that we should have more contents than before or at least, and i repat AT LEAST, the same amount with a superior quality. here we have a superior quality in terms of graphics and engine fluidity with less content. not enough.

and that anyone is free to make all the aircraft they want for the game.

as already pointed out, that's just another no sense "community will fix it" post.

also it's easy to understand, and it was already explained, the side effects of using mods to fix lacks/problems. splitting the community.

You're hyperbolic statement of fans kissing BIS's ass is asinine and just troll bait.

its what a good part of this community thinks of another part of the community. telling someone that he's a troll who's using asinine statement is disrispectful and childish.

From what I've seen, the fans are the biggest critics.

well im 1 of those.

It's just that they tend not to rattle off stupid posts and insults, and instead follow the proper procedures to get the dev's attention.

you are suggesting that your posts are being ignored? instead of jumping in the thread with no argumentations and flamming with the first guy you found out try to be more constructive and tell us what you think about the argument. because for the moment you are OT.

we are discussing the lack of jets here and there's to main theories on that:

1)we dont need them, 1 is enough.

2) we really need more jets.

what the fan of the first theory are forgiving is that satisfing the supporter of jets cannot create problems to the others.

dont you like them, dont use it. simply.

feel fre to give us your opinion on that.

Edited August 10, 2013 by *LK1*

[cpl_hicks 2]

Is it me or are we all secretly hoping that they are just trying to perfect one thing at a time and we will see more and more stuff added including jets and dogs over the next few months.

The scary part is, are they not announcing this just to keep it as a surprise? Or they might not do it at all for the next year?!.

I wish they could just alleviate us fixed wing fanatics fears by confirming this.

To those telling us just play flight sims, the only problem with that is no other product offers this level of simulation of jets in combination with helos, navy and ground features that have humans also controlling and engaging these other scenarios all at the same time. Battlefield series is a joke in comparison...

Bohemia is doing a great job but they really do have us by the balls as they are the only game in town in this respect....

[Lucasmnunesk 2]

I believe the content to be low, even though its to early too say, and i wish the best just as anyone else, im just afraid because it looks like it won't meet some expectations, but just time can tell that! And some suprises that they didn't announced would be really cool! I just hope the best, surely the more quality content is added the best, and 1 jet is really weird. Even though i don't like the later added content for me its better than a buggy release.

The bad thing is what i and what i believe most people want is impossible, the game full released at september with lots of contents fully working and with outstading quality.

I just hope the best, i really like BIS and they did a nice job until now, lets hope A3 will still be a nice work!

[chortles 263]

Check tomorrow's livestream and the next SITREP re: fixed-wing, you're not going to get official statements until then.

[b00tsy 28]

Check tomorrow's livestream and the next SITREP re: fixed-wing, you're not going to get official statements until then.

I do hope BI will be more clear about if and when more jets will be added to the game. It is one of the main things I was looking forward too, specially with the new clouds and stuff.

[*LK1* 10]

I do hope BI will be more clear about if and when more jets will be added to the game. It is one of the main things I was looking forward too, specially with the new clouds and stuff.

hell yeah.

[CptMacMillan 20]

Okay, after reading through the thread (and all the non nonsensical/sensical stuff that goes with with) I think there are two sides of the coin.

For one, I should remind people that this is not chernarus, neither takistan, ergo things like the Su-35/A-10/C-130 will be decommissioned by 203X, however it is planned that the F-35A would take over the chair of Air Support roles that the A-10 lefts behind, so I find it odd to have it out of the list. Another reason while I mention Chernarus and Takistan is because of the CAS purposes that each aircraft was build to do, i.e. something like an A-10 in the future is non-viable due to more advanced AA systems, it just can't get close enough without being engaged by Titan or RPG-42 missiles, same for the Su-25's that were introduced mostly due to replicate the Georgian war of 2008.

Landmass of the map would certainly be not enough for semi-realistic engagements between ... say F-22 and Su-35MBs, so the map is big, but not big enough for that kind of thing, however mid range mutirole fighters (Rafale/Grippen and F-35) are suitable for that kind of terrain due to their speeds and roles, which makes me think that is an odd decision by BI to remove the F-35A from the list, is an ... odd decision.

However what people forget the most is the new helicopter range, and ... voilà those things called helicopters, they are suitable for landmass, manoeuvrable enough and suited for that kind of land size and terrain, there is not point in having fighters when you have the new Hind and the Blackfoot already covering 7+ miles of terrain.

I'm a bit baffled by the lack of the F-35A TBH (having an opfor counterpart), however I do get where they are coming from, and TBH I find little purpose with what people is purposing here (F-22/PAF-KA/Eurofighters) which are designed for battles of much much larger scale, and even the SU-34 demonstrated how odd CAS work in such an overpowered plane in ArmA 2.

I had dogfights between SU-25s and A-10s, but that's the closest to an enjoyable dogfight, and even then I was using Gatling gun, so 70 years of advance were reduce to fighting like 1944, maybe an F-35A vs Opfor plane might work in such scheme, but other planes just .... doesn't.

+2cents, Bohemia please do try to incorporate the F-35A again, it was a balanced framework for bluefor/opfor assets(or it seems that way).

[pharoah 65]

which ever way we look at it...if we are truly trying to replicate RL...you won't have any wars between major powers without jets in some form or other. This isn't 1915, people or Angola vs Namibia...but even they had a/c. You can't tell me that in 203X, we simply did away with jets - thats ridiculous. Thats why they employ a/c carriers.

I just think BIS got a little lazy. Someone must've raised at the planning meeting 'hey, what about jets', then the project manager (who was too busy) said something like 'ah, its the future, small island and we don't have the time...leave it out and replace it with something small....next.