AI Discussion (dev branch)

[R3vo 2652]

Just wanted to report that AI uses 40mm grenades on tracked vehicles like MBTs, which makes not sense at all. Would it be possible to add a check if vehicle has wheels or is a tracked one?

[oukej 2910]

Can we pleeeease get the AI action menu sorted already? It must be a very easy fix, just push all the "take xxx" to appear after all of the other commands. Right now you need to browse through multiple "take xxx" pages to get to the more useful commands.

Infamous actions. Sry, it's not an easy fix :(, sorting also affects the player's action menu.

[mr_centipede 31]

Infamous actions. Sry, it's not an easy fix :(, sorting also affects the player's action menu.

Can we get at least contextual menu? Something like when you select an AI and point to a truck, GET IN command is already on top, along with other command in the quick menu, such as rearm, heal, or take xxx? Useful when trying to rearm your auto-riflemen at your assistant auto-riflemen (rearm)

[rübe 127]

Can we get at least contextual menu? Something like when you select an AI and point to a truck, GET IN command is already on top, along with other command in the quick menu, such as rearm, heal, or take xxx? Useful when trying to rearm your auto-riflemen at your assistant auto-riflemen (rearm)

This. Every time I order some of my AI to "open inventory" at some specific unit, the AI either open his inventory above/linke to the wrong unit, or even if the AI picked the right unit to loot from, half of the time I only see the primary weapon and nothing else (i.e. no uniform, no vest, no backpack).

If only I could select my AI, point at the unit supposed to be looted and then I could select the action from the contextual menu... oh how great would that be?

And there are many more such context-depending actions that need easy access. If your AI dude has some stachels, then I should have the option to "plant stachel right there" as a commander. And so on...

So the radio-menu (6-xxx) with its 1001 actions is useless and there is no hope to get this fixed.

Fine.

But that contextual menu is there, right here and now. Yet it doesn't get populated by needed and frequently used actions?! Why?

GetIn is there, it works fine. Yay for that one. Can't you guys expand on this? Depending on what guys I have selected and what I am pointing to, that menu could easily offer way more functionality before getting cluttered too much. And maybe let us customize it too?

[Variable 322]

Infamous actions. Sry, it's not an easy fix :(, sorting also affects the player's action menu.

Oukej, so why was it perfectly ok in OFP, Arma 1 and Arma 2? To make things clear - I mean ONLY the '6' AI action menu and the commands that appear under it.

In previous games in the series you didn't have to go through pages and pages of "take" command to get to the useful commands.

[Variable 322]

I made an FT ticket calling to fix the AI action menu (reminder - the useful commands appear only after multiple pages of "take" commands).

I suggest three alternatives:

1) revert the fix for the player menu (issue 21747) as it's not reasonable to render the AI action menu unusable just so the player won't have to scroll 3 or 4 options to "take" a weapon on the ground.

2) Limit the ai action menu's "take" commands only to weapons close to the AI unit. Weapons outside a 100 meters radius from the unit should NOT appear on the AI's action menu.

3) Remove the "take" commands from the AI action menu completely.

I suggest to go for options 1 and 2, and if that's not possible, go for option 3.

[froggyluv 2130]

That UI needs a complete revamp without question for as used to it as I am, I still dread it.

Pages of 'Close Door' and 'Take Weapon' is mind numbingly laborious and can quite literally get you killed.Which weapon? What door? There's ten thousand doors on Altis yet thru some miracle of luck I'm gonna guess the correct one for #2 to open? And wtf would I even want #2 to open a door??

/Endrant

If you can't change the system due to code Canon, how bout more information and function. Highlight the weapon or door or rearm spot with a red periphery dot as well as include the direction/distance in the text - for as it is we have no idea whatsoever where the listed item is located on top of it cluttering up the more useful options.

[chortles 263]

3) Remove the "take" commands from the AI action menu completely.

I suggest to go for options 1 and 2, and if that's not possible, go for option 3.

And if even that is not possible?

[Variable 322]

If you can't change the system due to code Canon, how bout more information and function. Highlight the weapon or door or rearm spot with a red periphery dot as well as include the direction/distance in the text - for as it is we have no idea whatsoever where the listed item is located on top of it cluttering up the more useful options.

Close/open door should be removed from the AI action menu as well. I never had any AI ordered to open a door nor can I come up with a reasonable reason for anyone to want the AI to do so.

And if even that is not possible?

All options are better than the current state, and option 1 is definitely possible since it means reverting a fix that was done to make the "take weapon" option first in the player's action menu.

[rübe 127]

Close/open door should be removed from the AI action menu as well.

Anything requiring *context* needs to be removed from that stupid radio menu/list.

Still, close/open door should be available in the contextual menu (that thing to your left) in case you've selected some AI and are hovering over a door (which should work in command-screen/-view, as well as on the map!).

[R3vo 2652]

You should have the Open/Close door option only when pointing at a door. As it is right now, you don't even know which door the is going to be opened.

[chortles 263]

You should have the Open/Close door option only when pointing at a door. As it is right now, you don't even know which door the is going to be opened.

And this is something that VBS2 (which besides the Interact With Vehicles GUI kept the action menu with most of its issues) solved simply by having a line pointing to what the currently highlighted action menu entry is going to interact with...

[doveman 7]

I've thought of a radical approach to getting AI to re-arm that might be worth considering.

I assume the engine knows what weapons and ammo are scattered about or on bodies everywhere on the map. Let's say the menu provides options such as "Re-arm with ammo", "Re-arm with AR", "Re-arm with MG", "Re-arm with Launcher", etc.

For the first option, the AI can be told by the engine if there is any ammo suitable for it's primary weapon within x meters (there needs to be a sensible limit, so it doesn't go running 1km to pick up a weapon), so doesn't need to go to each body to check and can either go to where that ammo is or reply "No suitable ammo available".

Likewise with the weapons, it can either go and grab that weapon and ammo for it, (even if they're in different places) or reply "No AR/MG weapon with ammo available", or alternatively it could display a list of the available weapons of that type which are available (and signify which of them there is also ammo available for) and let the player select from that list which one it should get. The only reason to include weapons without ammo available nearby is because one of the players might be carrying spare ammo for that weapon and might wish to give it to the AI after he's picked up the weapon.

To avoid it seeming too artificial by having the AI instantly "know" what is available in the area without looking, you could do something like insert a reasonable delay before it replies, or have it go to two or three of the locations where there are weapons/ammo/bodies before replying, or have it go to all of them before replying, or have it report after it's found one weapon of x type and ammo for it, etc.

[madrussian 347]

This is long but near and dear to many of our hearts. Was going to start a thread entitled "Discoveries on Getting the AI to suspend default combat behavior while in COMBAT mode", but given the pitch at the end I figure posting here is probably better:

I spent a couple days straight trying to get the AI to cooperate (with my scripted commands) while in COMBAT mode, and made a series of discoveries. Here are my findings.

First of all, some context. I wanted to create a handful of scripts to get the AI to enter buildings intelligently (to garrison & and to separately enter to eliminate known threats vs enemy AI and player alike). Fundamental to this endeavor is getting the AI to temporarily suspend its regular cover and start/stopping during COMBAT while moving. After reading through most of the AI Dev thread, I set out to defeat this hard-coded default COMBAT behavior. A fools-errand? Perhaps, but I did learn a thing or two and I might as well share.

To simplify things, my experiment involved only two units, the player (west) and an AI Loon (east). For observation purposes, the Loon is placed in Combat Mode "BLUE" (so he never fires). I monitor Loon's Ready status (via unitReady), Behaviour (via behaviour), Combat Mode (via combatMode), expectedDestination results (Position, Planning Mode, & Forced Replan), and FSM AI state (which I track and update every time I disable or enable "FSM" AI component, via enableAI and/or disableAI). Expected Destination position is monitored via a mark. Loon is ordered to move between two marked points (with sufficient cover in-between), on my command via various methods (mostly move & doMove depending on the experiment), and I watch the Loon in-game to see if he's doing the regular cover/start/stop combat shuffle or not.

Note that I decided to only use a single AI in a group, to avoid the "Go, I'll Cover" mechanic of multi-unit AI groups in Combat. In my experience, that's half the battle of getting AI into buildings effectively. Again though, the regular Combat mode cover and start/stopping applies and must be overcome, even with single-unit-AI groups.

OK, now to the perhaps minor, perhaps potentially significant discovery. After trying (most?) everything in the book: experimenting with forceSpeed -1, doStop, doFollow, various disableAI/enableAI components, creating my own FSM and running it on Loon via doFSM, using FSM specific move commands (moveTo and setDestination), having my FSM run quick and exiting, having my FSM run for longer (including indefinitely), regrouping Loon into new group via join, regrouping Loon into new group in combo with setBehaviour, etc... all of this in various combination based on the experiment. I learned a lot but finally:

I managed to get the AI to MOVE with suspended cover & no starting/stopping WHILE IN COMBAT MODE.

Here's how: By disabling "FSM" AI component via disableAI prior to the AI entering COMBAT. They still go into COMBAT mode per normal but completely suspend the cover/start/stop shuffle. This seems significant because the only other way (I'm aware of anyhow) to get the AI to move with suspended cover/start/stop shuffle is via setBehaviour "CARELESS", and in that case they don't shoot back!

That's the good news. We can achieve AI movement in COMBAT mode with suspended shuffle, and they will shoot at you. The bad news is that because the shuffle is suspended, on the way to their move point, they won't stop to turn and shoot at you. So really, we need a way to turn the shuffle on and off. Fortunately at this point, doing a simple enableAI "FSM" turns the shuffle back on. Unfortunately and here's the big kicker, if you do a disableAI "FSM" while the AI group is in COMBAT and the AI is in cover, the AI will get stuck in cover and not proceed to his move point. At this point with AI stuck in cover, enableAI "FSM" unsticks him and gets him on his way (but he's back to doing the cover/start/stop shuffle).

I'm sure one of you AI-savy coders can take these findings and run with it. What we really need, is a clean way to enable and disable "FSM" while AI is in COMBAT / potentially in cover (i.e. without him getting stuck).

Alternately (and hopefully this shouldn't be such a major undertaking oukej :cool: ), we need another behaviour:

• CARELESS
  
• SAFE
  
• AWARE
  
• COMBAT
  
• COMBAT_FAST (Just like COMBAT but with cover/start/stop shuffle suspended, for scripting purposes like getting AI into buildings quickly; or rather just like AWARE with transition to COMBAT blocked, again for scripting purposes only)
  
• STEALTH
  

Longer term, (ideally) we should be able to suspend the combat shuffle on an individual unit basis.

But in the here and now, being a programmer it seems to me that "AWARE with transition to COMBAT blocked" should be relatively straightforward to implement and would make so many of us happy, and right away. Lots of bang for your buck. Lots of bang for our buck.

[oukej 2910]

The bad news is that because the shuffle is suspended, on the way to their move point, they won't stop to turn and shoot at you.

That could be partially caused by disabled dangerFSM. Try removing only the behavior FSM.

At this point with AI stuck in cover

That's probably similar to or the same as http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=23847

- there are two my previous comments related to this topic.

...there are two FSMs...

- behavior (formation) FSM, running all the time, defined in "fsmFormation" property of a class in cfgVehicles

- danger FSM, triggered by a danger cause, defined in a property called "fsmDanger"

The FSM can be scripted (in vanilla that goes for danger or civilian FSMs) or "native", using engine functions (now used for behavior (covers, bounding overwatch...) of soldiers). Disabling them is possible via the mentioned scripting command or defining an empty string in the property. Currently it can help the AI move faster through an area with a lot of cover positions (urban areas).

an issue with the behavior (formation) FSM, which - admittedly - has some of it routines severely bugged (AI falls behind, has problems finding a good cover, gets stuck in a cover).

[seba1976 98]

What we really need, is a clean way to enable and disable "FSM" while AI is in COMBAT / potentially in cover (i.e. without him getting stuck).

You can join the unit to a new group to force him out of combat mode, and then disable FSM, if what you need is a way to disable FSM before they go into combat mode. You have to be fast though :).

[madrussian 347]

Thanks oukej for the response and all your efforts. Your previous FSM comments you mention are actually what inspired me to attempt to try out the FSM-related commands.

That could be partially caused by disabled dangerFSM. Try removing only the behavior FSM.

I would like to try this! Handful of clarifications (might help others with understanding FSMs as well):

1. When we do a Loon disableAI "FSM", which FSM gets disabled? Your comment suggests this disables Danger FSM?
   
2. How do we disable the Behavior FSM in-game? (You mention in your comment it's running all the time...)
   
3. Which of the two FSMs get halted while a doFSM is running? Or are both halted?
   
4. Regarding doFSM's halting of one or both of the unit's standard FSM(s), are they merely suspended while the doFSM's FSM runs? Or, are they actually stopped and then restarted upon doFSM completion?
   

Also, is there any reason not to allow blocking the transition of AWARE to COMBAT modes (on a per group basis), strictly for scripting purposes? (I don't want to push it, just curious...) Thanks again. :)

[froggyluv 2130]

Keep going MadRussian this is all music to my ears!

:o::bounce12:

[R3vo 2652]

AT soldiers still sometimes refuse to attack enemy vehicles, lost five good man today because of that. May they rest in peace.

[h - 169]

oukej, does rain affect the vision/spotting abilities of AI with NVG?

Because a human player at pitch black night with NVG and full overcast+rain (well, rain above like 0.6) can't really see much but the AI seems to spot targets as it was pure daylight w/o NVG....

Well, I'll answer this myself: No, it doesn't. At all.

The AI spots enemy at the the same distance whether there's human sight blocking rain or not. Not that FAIR...

Edited June 26, 2015 by h -

[otrebla_snake_ita 2]

Hi there, first of all I apologize for my english. If you don't understand something, I'll try explaining it better! :)

Yesterday and today I've played again Arma 3 SP campaign after some time (due to university I've been playing less intense videogames) but I've noticed the AI is still very very buggy.

Proper feedbacks are already in the feedback.arma3.com site, but I'm writing here because after many patches and much time because I uselessly hoped to see a "slimmer", more effective and less stucking AI.

I've noticed that many bugs I found many patches ago (1.39, maybe?) are still there and some of them are there since the first OFP.

I know you already know about AI driving: it's very bad and often vehicles run over allied soldiers!

AI moving: it'sstill very slow when you're moving in formation. It happens you need to run with your squad but the AI starts stopping, looking around, moving again exc even if not in Combat mode. Often happens that this "move-stop-cover-move again" behavior is counter-productive also when you're fighting and you're in combat mode: if you need to move fast in formation and the ground in front of you is clear, the AI is slow again, breaks formation, waits exc...

AI medics: they won't try healing a wounded soldier asap. If ordered to do this while in combat mode, you need to say them "stop shooting" so they go healing the wounded guy. Moreover it happens that they walk in front of you and the other shooting men (I've noticed this while shooting in Line formation).

AI soldier behind a cover: you take a man, order him to crouch, send him behind a cover and after he reaches it, if you ask him to go prone, he will never do this and will stay crouched unless you move him away, tell him to change his stance and send him back to the cover.

Cover system (I don't know if this is on the forum the proper place to talk about this. I'll report on the feedback site if there's still no ticket about, anyway): there are many objects which would be useful covers which can't be used for this purpose from the AI.

For example the trees: there are many of them, but often you can't order your men to go behind them (the proper marker won't show up). It also happens that you can order your men to take cover in only ONE position behind a useful cover object; often happens that the single position you can send him is placed in the wrong direction (exposed to the enemy fire)...

Mix these problems with other bugs and the single player experience is ruined almost at all. It would be an awesome military sandbox, if only it would work properly!

PS: I'm a BIS fan since the first OFP, I'm not here to flame, offend or something else!

[gammadust 12]

;2958142']

Cover system (I don't know if this is on the forum the proper place to talk about this. I'll report on the feedback site if there's still no ticket about' date=' anyway): there are many objects which would be useful covers which can't be used for this purpose from the AI.

For example the trees: there are many of them, but often you can't order your men to go behind them (the proper marker won't show up). It also happens that you can order your men to take cover in only ONE position behind a useful cover object; often happens that the single position you can send him is placed in the wrong direction (exposed to the enemy fire)...[/quote']

Yes... this frustrates me too. And since the cover spot selection routine has an area of influence, more often than not, in order to prevent it altogether one must pick a position too far from the cover to be meaningful. If using it in building interiors it also presents itself too limiting.

[oukej 2910]

WThe AI spots enemy at the the same distance whether there's human sight blocking rain or not.

I'm sorry I missed your question. The AI's spotting at night in NVGs gets worse if there's low ambient light (no moon, overcast weather). But you're right, that rain drops themselves don't change it. But also it's been only quite recently this has become fair for players.

---------- Post added at 22:55 ---------- Previous post was at 22:34 ----------

;2958142']Cover system (I don't know if this is on the forum the proper place to talk about this. I'll report on the feedback site if there's still no ticket about' date=' anyway): there are many objects which would be useful covers which can't be used for this purpose from the AI.

For example the trees: there are many of them, but often you can't order your men to go behind them (the proper marker won't show up). It also happens that you can order your men to take cover in only ONE position behind a useful cover object; often happens that the single position you can send him is placed in the wrong direction (exposed to the enemy fire)...[/quote']

This is admittedly an unfortunate issue we won't be able to fix and we are truly sorry about it :( It would require readjustment of massive amount of objects on our already released maps. But to give you at least some hope - we'll make sure the new terrain is more optimized for the dynamic cover creation.

[ImperialAlex 72]

This is admittedly an unfortunate issue we won't be able to fix and we are truly sorry about it :( It would require readjustment of massive amount of objects on our already released maps. But to give you at least some hope - we'll make sure the new terrain is more optimized for the dynamic cover creation.

If I were to create my own terrain, what would I need to do to optimize it for dynamic cover creation?

[Tyl3r99 41]

please fix the medic system, he takes too long to heal people :( and my squad ends up dying lol