More complex surrender system

[kcs 1]

Hi

I was thinking about the surrender behaviour of AI units in arma 2/3.

I tested the surrender module and noticed that the enemies surrender on very rare occasions.

I think it's unrealistic that even if I’m 10 metres away from an enemy that has no ammo left he would rather try to flee than to give up.

thought it would be more human like if AI units surrender in such situations.

As far as I know there is already a morale system implemented in arma. What does effect the morale of AI units at the moment?

Events that should increase the chance that an AI unit will surrender (or maybe already do):

• No ammunition left

• Surprised by an enemy unit from behind

• Being outnumbered

• High casualties

• Being heavily wounded

Of course, AI units should only surrender if they have no chance to escape in the first place.

Because im neither an experienced arma player neither a modder, I have a few questions about this.

First of all, I‘m wondering about your opinion on this topic. I think an extension like this would make the game more tactical.

Accomplishing missions with less enemies killed could be considered an interesting challenge. What do you think?

Is there already an existing mod that does affect the surrendering of units? And if not how difficult would it be to add this feature to the game,

in a way that it does not interfere with vanilla AI/other AI mods?

Greetings

kcs

[chrisb 196]

There are a couple of mods in A2, SLX & GL4, that have surrender and gl4 can be altered in the configs, so even more usable.

Both work really well using many of the things you mention as circumstances in which to surrender, but using these in A3 could be problematic..:(

[Zane 1]

I really would like to see something like that implemented in a realistic way :)

[Smurf 12]

It is something I couldn't care less in general play, might be handy on very specific missions. What are you suppose to do with surrended enemies within a mission? If you could tie\arrest them just for the sake of removing them out of the field, fine, other than that?

[mr burns 131]

In SWAT4 i´ve seen suspects drop a weapon and surrender, then when not being held at gunpoint anymore, pulling another weapon and attacking.

Would be neat to have similar surrendering fidelity in ArmA :bounce3:

[kcs 1]

@Smurf

It could be a greater challenge to defeat enemies without killing them, as already mentioned, and you'd need to choose unconventional tactics on the battlefield. The gameplay would be different.

Moreover, i like the idea of having alternative ways of winning a mission than just killing the enemies.

Surrendered enemies could become civilians, as far as i know its already possible to arrest civilians and to transport them.

@ChrisB

Thanks for your tips. Why is it problematic to use these features in A3, are the mods not ported to A3 yet or is it because the AI is different in A3?

Edited May 21, 2013 by kcs

[ProfTournesol 956]

Surrendered enemies could become civilians

That's basically what the setcaptive command does.

Edited May 21, 2013 by ProfTournesol

[fragmachine 12]

I like this idea and I remember that it was in modded since OFP. I remember having problems with ending some campaign missions because I didn't killed ALL enemies because they became prisoners, but I dont want to talk here about war crimes ;) Simple solution would be to add just after the so called death sentence "or setcaptive" etc. Otherwise would be nice to see this in core game.

[chrisb 196]

@ChrisB

Thanks for your tips. Why is it problematic to use these features in A3, are the mods not ported to A3 yet or is it because the AI is different in A3?

I have, for my own use, been looking at a mix I use in A2, being able to work in A3. At the moment with the dev builds I use, it’s a little hit and miss, they do some of what's meant to happen, but not all. If it could be used in A3, then I would be the happiest player around, its just getting it to work correctly.

AI is very important, the most important, for me anyway, so I just keep testing it in different forms. At the moment there are a few problems , it would probably be better to let the game become Beta, then things might settle down a little.:).

[Maio 293]

In SWAT4 i´ve seen suspects drop a weapon and surrender, then when not being held at gunpoint anymore, pulling another weapon and attacking.

Would be neat to have similar surrendering fidelity in ArmA :bounce3:

I once opened up the SWAT 4 AI.ini and took a look. Their tendency to pull out the pistol was linked to their skill level and morale (if I remember correctly) which were both set by the mission designer. The SWAT 4 AI was not that complex, they used path nodes to navigate and when they retreated, it was to a predefined spot(s) placed by the mission maker.

[Ghillie 10]

They should really implement a sort of "flex-tie" system where each soldier has a certain number of flextie cuffs. It would be extremely realistic as well considering most combat units carry gear accustomed to holding prisoners of war in general.

[dissaifer 10]

surrender and arrest system could be better, as in add animations for walking while arrested