Please don't make this M

[scottydoo 10]

Sorry but if this game was teen it would loose more people than it would gain... This game should simulate the harsh reality of war not some friendly kids shooter.

[maddogx 13]

friendly kids shooter.

That sounds wrong in so many ways. :D

[max power 21]

The point is, killing is okay but words aren't? It's topic for a discussion not needed on this site but we as humans need to evolve past "bad" words anyway.

The killing is fake. The cursing is real.

Maybe that can be a new slogan.

[[aps]gnat 28]

That's true. I think many games misuse swearing these days. Incorporating it into a story should make the characters seem more gritty and believable. Most of the time it just comes off as childish and inappropriate in games, movies and books.

+1 Agree.

Another point I will stick out there but ......

With all their games, I've never felt BIS was ever targeting the early teen demographic.

Definately the mature gamer who will spend time absorbing the HUGE possible scope/sandbox. Not the short attention span/instant action seekers.

Now, before you start flaming me, yes, not all teens want those instant action games, I agree, but the fact is EA and Ubisoft etc make $Millions from the others who do, the majority.

Edited May 13, 2012 by [APS]Gnat
typos

[dmakatra 1]

Reading this thread and many others on this forum makes me sad. I was 10 years old when I started playing Flashpoint in 2001. I reached my Flashpoint/Arma-peak around 2004-2005 - that is, in my early teens. Playing, scripting and editing, and contributing what I could to the community by helping out and beta testing. Administrating gaming groups and other loose constellations. Helping newcomers play 'tactical'. I grew up with this game, with everything to which that entails.

Today, when I'm 21, I hardly ever touch the game more than a couple of times each year when the craving hits me. I've forgot more or less all of the knowledge that I used to have about sqs, which I guess is obsolete now anyway.

I find it sad that certain, major, parts of this community cannot realise that what Arma has to offer has nothing to do with what age you have, what your other interests are or if you actually enjoy CoD-games occasionally. There is such an elitist atmosphere in this community which makes me worried for the future of BI and the development of future Arma-games, as newcomers are not always welcomed with opened arms. I find it sad because this sends the people that are 'looked down upon' running away from this game, instead of being guided and helped see what an amazing experience it is.

That being said, I think BI should use whatever means necessary to create the game that they want to create - whether it be rated 3+ or 20+. But aiming for a high age rating to actively scare off teens from the game would be very destructive.

[dmarkwick 261]

The killing is fake. The cursing is real.

Maybe that can be a new slogan.

I was going to make this point :) the killing is pretend but the swearing is not. I'm fine with no swearing. It always sounds dumb in a game anyway. IMO for the purposes of non-campaign gaming swearing is entirely unnecessary. I don't mind my child seeing me kill a videogame soldier then running around the house with a toy gun. I just don't wish for him to call me a m*th*rf*ck*ng *ssh*l* while he does it :)

[50.cal 10]

:391:

Common, we've talked about that already.

We want it whore, violent and immoral. :icon_twisted:

Seriously you should not play this game with children. Neither COD or any other games that is based on killing.

I remember playing strategy or race games while I was a child...and that was all I wanted!

But of course if you propose that to him...your responsibility...

[metalcraze 290]

I've played Carmageddon, Blood, UT and Soldier of Fortune as a teenager - BIS needs to add gore and flying body parts if anything

[myshaak 0]

No way this could get a lower rating than M. I mean, the blood'n'guts is OK I guess... but the chicks in bikini! It could seriously damage the fragile little minds of our children, our future! The game has a potential to turn nice behaving kids into murdering lunatics who view women as mere sex objects!

/ FOX News mode off

On a serious note, one BI member (not sure if Lord Buchta or Mr. Pražák) once mentioned in some interview how ridiculous those ratings are and that the people from those agencies didn't have any problems with the shooting and killing, no no, they had problems with the girls dressed as hookers and the in-game ad featuring a girl smoking a cigarette. That saying, there is only a very little chance this could get teen ratings (from my point of view) simply because you can shoot civilians and friendlies and given the sandbox nature of Arma 3, probably with no immediate punishment.

Just look at the ESRB rating of Arma: OA, which is much "cleaner" when it comes to portrayal of violence (no torture, no mass graves etc.) compared to Harvest Red, yet still, M.

And regarding the usual portrayal of violence in games, ironically, I think it's the kids and teenagers ONLY who are most impressed by swearing and gore.

[Cpt.Burger 10]

I was probably 7-8 when I first played OFP, good days.

Anyhow, ARMA3, like the other titles in the series and OFP, are military simulators, trying to bring real-life warfare into a game. War in real life is not friendly ;)

Personally, I think it should stay M rated. But by M rated I mean for gamers who are mature, not by age. (Then again, I'm sure the person selling the game would have no idea that the teen their selling it to is mature or not).

[Choki 10]

Not possible as long as there is killing, blood and harsh language included.

And I doubt that there are many players around who agree on removing that to attract more kids players.

Besides that, there are enough 13 year olds around already who are not able to write one sentence without errors, have no manners and screw up games whenever they see a chance. We surely don't need more of them. :)

yes the same

[noubernou 77]

This game is already pretty tame for what it represents... In a lot of ways its almost offensive how tame it represents the most horrible thing human kind can engage in.

War is not nice. :p

[Ragid1 1]

My only point is that you can still have the realism without making it M, i mean i know that you can't have every little bit of realism but you cab have enough without having to make it M look at Project reality for bf2 it is still regarded as one of the best realism simulations out there, and yet did that with a teen rating . and you might say that if i don't want to see that stuff than just don't play but the problem is that there is nothing out there that is even close to as cool and realistic as this and i am soooooo tired of the unrealistic crap nowadays like COD or even BF3 (by the way i have played none of these games but my friends have and i thought they would be good examples of the dilemma in our FPS society today) i want a good game and this is exactly what i am looking for, unless it's rated M, so that's just my point you can debate about it all you want but my opinion is not gonna change however as i said in my last post i really do respect your opinions of what you think is right. so thank you for your time.

[noubernou 77]

Project Reality was a mod to BF2, not a stand alone product sold... Doesn't matter what mods people make. I could mod Arma to have a giant smiling sun and play xylophone music when you walk around and instead of russians and guns you have giant rabbits and carrots. Doesn't mean it would get a All Ages rating.

[Ragid1 1]

no in know that but my point is that the stuff in PR defiantly would not have earned a M rating, and so i think it would be nice if they could make this game as realistic as possible without making it M too. you can have a little blood in a Teen game, in fact i love games with some sort of bleeding feature so that if you get shot you can die if you don't get it fixed up, but you don't need to show massive amounts of gore to do that.

[sgtice 10]

You're arguement is going to be shot down at every turn, stop trying to advocate for something that will never happen. The game is designed for adults, played by adults, enjoyed by ADULTS. We don't want the game watered down so kids an play regardless of their maturity level and it will be rated M simply because of the violence, that's how ESRB rates things. If you can't play it because of an M rating, wait a few years, there will be a lot more content/fixes. BIS won't water down a game that is meant to simulate something that would be taking a step back from where they've gone. As they put it in Iron Man "That's like a toy factory not making toys!"

I actually play PR, the reason it dosen't have an M rating is based off of the content, BF2 dosen't really have gore and the devs saw no reason to add it, and it dosen't have a campaign. If it had a campaign with swearing that would be an instant M rating, the rating really dosen't matter at the end of the day once you go into multiplayer.

[noubernou 77]

Personally I hope that the tools are available in A3 to add in more realistic wounding.

[Ragid1 1]

I think (and correct me if i am wrong about this) that the reason most of you don't want to see the gore taken away is because you think that if you take that away you will have to take away the realism as well, and i think that that doesn't have to happen, i also think that you think that if it is rated teen that a lot of whiny and stupid kids will play it and then the multiplayer will be ruined, but i think that just making it complex and realistic, which i defiantly think ARMA has done, that those kids will try it and then after sucking at it they will just leave and only the players you would be okay with will remain. look at (and i know these are mods but) the BF2 mods forgotten hope (a WW2 mod) and project reality both are realistic mods for an otherwise unrealistic game rated teen, however you will never find those snotty whiny kids playing those games because they are to hard for them, so i think the online community would be pretty much the same except that any only Teen rated gamers (such as myself) who fit into your good players category would be able to play it. just my 2 cents. and i know that this is probably not going to happen, it's just that i want so badly to be to play such a good game like this, since so many games nowadays have gone to the arcade style shooter, and to see such a good game like ARMA 3 i really want to play it. thank you

[pathetic_berserker 4]

Though I think the OPs request unrealistic, I set up a litle mission with a selction of vehicles for my kids to play about in,they race each other , fly each other about etc, and its been a blast watching them and playing with them. I've simply removed all the ammo, and set wound textures low, a respawn and keep a close eye on them. Now I know this is is a bit unconventional and understand why it isn't everyones cup of tea, but at least they have kept any default swearing such as the gasping 'fuck' when you get wounded nice and vague. On the rare occasions it pops up I can atleast convince them it's saying 'yuck' (don't know if they believe me but I'll stick to it). A little more control over such things as swearing, may sound cool, but realy it would be a waste of time. It would be unfaithfull to the game to remove wounding effects, and though I'm all for good levels of control over these things there is no way to effectively turn these into parental controls, and I dont think it should be attempted.In terms of campaigns, and story telling (wich my kids aren't allowed to touch) ArmA requires a certain level of maturity to convey some of its more prickily moments.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Pathetic_Berserker

[billybob12 0]

To me, I don't care whether it is an M rating or not due to the nature of the Arma series in general: war, shooting, blood, destruction, violence, etc.

What bothers me is the excessive swearing, which is my opinion and in no way means I am trying to force this view upon others, nor does it mean I want this out of the game completely just to satisfy my personal tastes. I just find much of the swearing in Arma 2 cheesy and unnecessary... so I quickly downloaded the no-swear mods when I saw them available on Armaholic. This was a great solution for me and my gaming community for Arma 2. However...

I do think the swearing in many games and even Arma are unnecessary to a large degree, particularly outside of the single player missions and campaign where I don't care how the story or characters play out since it is a story and meant to be immersive in the manner Bohemia wishes to do so. In multiplayer, I'm enjoying the game with friends and family and would like to have some control over the swearing. A small wish I have that I know is difficult to do... is having an option to filter out the language in the game. Now, I know that may not be a simple task for the game designers and not the best use of their time, but for what it offers I do think it would be a nice gesture and it doesn't affect the game ratings if that is an issue. I was glad to find addons on Armaholic for both Arma 2 vanilla and Arma 2 OA that removed the swearing, which may be another solution for Arma 3, but wished it didn't require waiting for someone to put together a mod to do so. I'm open to learning how to modify this in the future for Arma 3 if necessary.

I guess my point is that I respect the fact that other folks don't mind the swearing, but I do think there are many solutions to letting users control whether swearing is imposed in their game settings or not. I just want those options to be available, and easy to implement, whether its a game setting or mod.

[Leon86 13]

Yeah, the swearing is cheesy. If you see real life combat footage, sure the soldiers swear quite a lot, but in arma it just isnt believable.

[NeMeSiS 11]

Yeah, the swearing is cheesy. If you see real life combat footage, sure the soldiers swear quite a lot, but in arma it just isnt believable.

Well, none of the voice acting is. ;)

Swearing should be done with a purpose, not just for the sake of swearing. But no swearing at all is pretty lame, i was quite annoyed when i joined a DayZ server were you got auto kicked if you swore 3 times, even my mom would allow that.

EDIT: Where is the swearing in A2?

[Mr. Charles 22]

EDIT: Where is the swearing in A2?

There's quite a lot of it in Harvest Red, but military is 18+, so that's only realistic ;)

[billybob12 0]

Where is the swearing in A2? The games original soundfiles for units when they are injured frequently drop the F bomb when hurt and moving about. That to me is one of the unnecessary issues I mentioned above, whereas the swearing found in just about every mission in the single player campaign and such is a different matter that I personally don't care about...again I think it is too excessive but no big deal when considered in the context here.

I don't have to hear the single-player-related swearing constantly, as it is part of the created story/dialogue Bohemia Interactive wanted to use for their game. But the swearing continually coming from injured units in other scenarios or multiplayer (which in my home more time is spent on multiplayer) is something that makes it difficult to control, and that is something I personally wished could be filtered out and at least have had to use mods to do that. Mods solved that problem for me personally in Arma 2. When you've got several people injured in a game session, suddenly my living room was filled with profanity and nobody could control that.

Another example that is unique, but I at least have control over, is some of the revive scripts that users have made (which are awesome by the way! Thanks to those scripters who work so hard to do this!) One in particular adds additional sound files that include swearing when units are down and calling out. Ok, I don't like that as a default setting, but I can at least modify the script to remove that part and voila! I, and the people I game with, don't have to be subjected to that. Granted, this is a user made content and not part of the original game, but my point was to show that at least it could be controlled if that was my personal preference.

I also know that playing online will subject the gamer to swearing from other gamers...which is expected and you can't control... unless you are a server admin who doesn't tolerate that (and you have every right to do what you wish as a server admin), BUT unlike the game's core files, you can at least control that within your household to a degree. My main point is it would be awesome to have an option to filter out unnecessary swearing, as opposed to the game's core files including swearing at every single opportunity that you can't stop or control. There's a balance that can appease most people.

Speaking for myself, I am sure it'll probably result in having to modify the games sound files to adjust this since a feature to filter out unwanted profanity probably won't happen. But it would be a nice feature!

[NoRailgunner 0]

Hmmm... A3 units should act always political correct eg "Oh hello Sir, could you get me some of these magic bandages? I just got hit and this wound is bleeding a little bit here and there.... and thank you very much.... God bless you!" Are we playing a military game or something with unicorns and fluffy bunnies? ;)