Any one interested in a ak-47? reeeal cheap!

[red oct 2]

i would like to take a colt comando over any ak, but i dont know if they are leagal in my state, and if they are they probaly be to much money.

[red oct 2]

is there any one else that think that the age requirement of 21 to purchase handguns in the US is kinda stupid? i mean if a 18 year old can get a shotgun/rifle why not a handgun? an adult is just as (if not more) likley to misuse or abuse the weapon then a teenager? besides, rifles and shotguns can do more dammage so shouldnt it be the otherway around?

[Renagade 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Red Oct @ June 10 2002,06:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">is there any one else that think that the age requirement of 21 to purchase handguns in the US is kinda stupid? i mean if a 18 year old can get a shotgun/rifle why not a handgun? an adult is just as (if not more) likley to misuse or abuse the weapon then a teenager? besides, rifles and shotguns can do more dammage so shouldnt it be the otherway around?<span id='postcolor'>

more easy to conceal a handgun than rifle ?

or same reason why pistols are banned here though any chance they get they`ll ban more  

[akm74 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Hey, we didnt make em. Blame Mother Russia <span id='postcolor'>

Actually real (old USSR or Russian original) AK will cost you 2.500 – 3.500 $. If you manage to find one in US. I don’t recommend you to buy cheap China or Romania AK, they will last only 600 – 1000 shots.

[RedRogue 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Red Oct @ June 10 2002,06:27)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">is there any one else that think that the age requirement of 21 to purchase handguns in the US is kinda stupid? i mean if a 18 year old can get a shotgun/rifle why not a handgun? an adult is just as (if not more) likley to misuse or abuse the weapon then a teenager? besides, rifles and shotguns can do more dammage so shouldnt it be the otherway around?<span id='postcolor'>

Because handguns are alot easier to conseal. If you want a horriffic way of looking at it it would be very difficult to conseal a rifle in your backpack or under clothing without looking very suspicious to school. A snubnose .38 however is very easy to.

And as for changing a AK-47 into and AK-74, it wouldn't be all that difficult you would need to change the barrel and chamber but they both use the same firing mechanism so there wouldn't be that much work involved. But in reality it would be a bit pointless as you could have simply bought a AK-74 for the price of a new barrel and chamber.

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">besides, rifles and shotguns can do more dammage so shouldnt it be the otherway around? <span id='postcolor'>

Rifles and Shotguns aren't concealable.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">That would be a bit hard since the 74 uses a smaller caliber bullet.<span id='postcolor'>

Change the barrel, mainspring, bolt face, and bingo!

I am just speculating here, but it seems that other than calibre and furniture (plastic v. wood), the AK-47(AKM) and the AK-74 are the same thing.

Honestly, I wouldn't bother with an AK or an AR-15, I would have no use for them, I'm not a 'plinker'. Why spend more on an AR-15 when I can spend less on a Bolt-Action rifle that is more accurate? Sure, there are very accurate AR-15 systems out there, but they will cost you an arm and a leg.

Tyler

[Renagade 0]

Id rather get an FN-FAL/SLR though the chances of getting one would be slim and none:)

[FetishFool 0]

Let's straighten some things out:

Romanian and Chinese AK47s only last "600-1000 shots"!?!

You were obviously bullshitted to. Maybe by a gun dealer trying to hustle you out of some cash.

I think you meant "600-1000 shots before a jam."

Chinese AK47's include Norinco, which is a high-end AK47 clone.

"Real" AK47s from Russia are great for collecting, but aren't more reliable than high-end clones: Polytech, Norinco, and the SA-M7s come to mind.

Lower calibres: Lower calibers are great because of lower recoil, higher velocity, lighter carrying weight and longer range, but their drawbacks exceed their advantages.

The major drawback isn't the power of the calibre, it's the penetration.

Smaller cartridges also don't have enough weight to keep a constant speed. The end result is a cartridge that actually has a hard time killing.

When fighting in cities, you'd want all the penetration that you can get. So G36's, AR-15s, AK74s, Galils are all insufficient.

What you need is an AK47 or a FAL-type rifle.

Don't be discouraged about the low range of the AK47. Odds are that you won't even try to shoot a target beyond 70 yards.

[Mister Frag 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (timmy @ June 09 2002,18:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">guns are way to cheap and way to easy to get in america. some sick guy could easily buy that gun and some body armor. and pull off what those two bank robbers did in los angelos.<span id='postcolor'>

This has been discussed at length in these forums before.

One suspect, Larry Philips, died from a self-inflicted gunshot wound to the head, and Emil Matasareanu died from a loss of blood after receiving more than 20 puncture wounds despite the home-made head-to-toe body armor worn by both suspects.

There is no point in trying to outlaw the weapons used by these two criminals, because they were already illegal at the time of the North Hollywood shootout. Prohibiting law-abiding citizens from owning firearms will do nothing to keep career criminals from using them.

[Mister Frag 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Red Oct @ June 09 2002,18:38)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (FetishFool @ June 10 2002,03:25)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">"though you could find parts to convert them to full auto"

Don't say that.  If the BATF or FBI reads this thread, they're going to do an investigation on you.

They've done it before.<span id='postcolor'>

no they wont cause its leagal, if it wasnt than gun mags wouldnt have ads in theire mags/sites for the parts. i dont know how it is leagal i will have to ask a few friends of mine on how its legal, or ask a gun dealer.<span id='postcolor'>

Unless state or municipal law prohibit their ownership, it is generally legal to possess semi-automatic versions of some military rifles.

However, the mere possession of a semi-automatic rifle and the parts necessary to convert it to full-auto fire, even if completely separate and in different locations, is a felony.

So while it may be legal to provide machinists drawings of full-auto conversion parts (First Amendment), or even to sell the parts necessary to perform the conversion, the possession will be illegal for most people who buy them.

[pathfinder 0]

I own 3 AKM's/47 (did have 4 but sold I sold my MAK-90), and they work fine for my needs. If you want an AK get one, but if it's to pricey for ya get an SKS. The 7.62x39 round works great in either weapon ,the AK will just hold more unless you got single stack mags....ewwwww.

About Ak's lasting 600 shots is a load of shit! There are some very bad AK's out there like B-WEST ,but even they will last alot longer than 1000 rds. Leave it to us to make peice of crap AK. B-west is the worst, and it was manufactured in the U.S.A

I deer hunt with my Polytech Legend after I take afew things off ( 75rd drum ,flashhider,sometimes the M2bipod) and add a 5 rnd mag full of softtip ammo and I'm ready to hunt.

I own 3 AR-15's but I don't go plinking nearly as much as I would like with them ,as I try to save as much ammo as I can.

And why would anyone even want a full auto ak? If you need the weapon for an emergency survival situation (which the ak excels at) you would want every round to count.

I go to KNOB CREEK KT for my full auto jollys

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">When fighting in cities, you'd want all the penetration that you can get.  So G36's, AR-15s, AK74s, Galils are all insufficient.

What you need is an AK47 or a FAL-type rifle.

Don't be discouraged about the low range of the AK47.  Odds are that you won't even try to shoot a target beyond 70 yards.<span id='postcolor'>

  The Russians changed their main round from 7.62x39mm to 5.45x39mm because of the 7.62x39's 'looping' trajectory. The 7.62x39mm round is very short and fat, it has a heavy bullet with little powder to back it up. This keeps the bullet from having a flat trajectory. By necking down the same cartridge to accept a smaller round (5.45mm) you get the same amount of powder pushing an even lighter round, resulting in a flatter trajectory, which gives you a slightly longer range.

As for the range, all assault rifles have an effective range of 300m, this applies to the AK-47, AK-74, M-16A2, G36, and any other intermediate cartridge firing rifle. If I was fighting in a city (ie: room to room) the last weapon I would want would be a full sized battle rifle like an FN-FAL which fires the 7.62x51 NATO round.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">What you need is an AK47 or a FAL-type rifle<span id='postcolor'>

The AK-47 fires: 7.62x39 Russian.

Muzzle energy: 1509 ft.lbs.

The FN-FAL fires: 7.62x51 NATO.

Muzzle energy: 2680 ft.lbs.

The two aren't even comparable.

Tyler

[NOTE: images are not to the correct scale, the 7.62 NATO round should be even bigger ]

[FetishFool 0]

Hey, Pathfinder, you go to Knob Creek?

That's where I learned everything I know about assault rifles.  AK47's especially.

@Assault:  You're right that the AK47 has a range up to 300 meters.  But don't bet on hitting anything beyond 100 meters.  It's not the capability of the rifle, it's what a human can actually do with it that matters.  (I've heard stories of guys hitting man-sized targets at 300 meters with an AK47, but I've never witnessed it myself.)

I didn't mean CQB combat.  I meant street to street.

So rifles chambered in .308 are a good choice.

And a .308 and 7.62x39 are comparable.  They're the only heavy cartridges for rifles.  Excluding exotic calibers like 7.62x54R and .30-06.

[pathfinder 0]

FetishFool Posted on June 10 2002,10:22

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey, Pathfinder, you go to Knob Creek?

That's where I learned everything I know about assault rifles. AK47's especially.

Yep 99 was my last visit and I still got some ringing in ma ears I always tell people thats going there take a video camera , as noone will believe you how loud it gets there unless you show em

[WKK Gimbal 0]

If I where to choose one full-automatic I could buy, it would be the AK47. First, you know what you pay for, second it has some symbolic/historical value which no other assault rifle has.

As for the weapon I'd prefer to have purely for it's functionality, it would be the H&K Mp5a3 SEAL version.

[red oct 2]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Assault (CAN) @ June 10 2002,07:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">besides, rifles and shotguns can do more dammage so shouldnt it be the otherway around? <span id='postcolor'>

Rifles and Shotguns aren't concealable.  

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">That would be a bit hard since the 74 uses a smaller caliber bullet.<span id='postcolor'>

Change the barrel, mainspring, bolt face, and bingo!

I am just speculating here, but it seems that other than calibre and furniture (plastic v. wood), the AK-47(AKM) and the AK-74 are the same thing.

Honestly, I wouldn't bother with an AK or an AR-15, I would have no use for them, I'm not a 'plinker'. Why spend more on an AR-15 when I can spend less on a Bolt-Action rifle that is more accurate? Sure, there are very accurate AR-15 systems out there, but they will cost you an arm and a leg.

Tyler<span id='postcolor'>

but they are concealable in a dufflebag, a overcoat, under a car seat. but a fork is concealable too so should that be banned from minors? and as i said a adult would probaly be more likely to missuse/abuse a handgun than a minor would.

[ralphwiggum 6]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Red Oct @ June 10 2002,23:25)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Assault (CAN) @ June 10 2002,07:10)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">besides, rifles and shotguns can do more dammage so shouldnt it be the otherway around? <span id='postcolor'>

Rifles and Shotguns aren't concealable.  

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">That would be a bit hard since the 74 uses a smaller caliber bullet.<span id='postcolor'>

Change the barrel, mainspring, bolt face, and bingo!

I am just speculating here, but it seems that other than calibre and furniture (plastic v. wood), the AK-47(AKM) and the AK-74 are the same thing.

Honestly, I wouldn't bother with an AK or an AR-15, I would have no use for them, I'm not a 'plinker'. Why spend more on an AR-15 when I can spend less on a Bolt-Action rifle that is more accurate? Sure, there are very accurate AR-15 systems out there, but they will cost you an arm and a leg.

Tyler<span id='postcolor'>

but they are concealable in a dufflebag, a overcoat, under a car seat. but a fork is concealable too so should that be banned from minors? and as i said a adult would probaly be more likely to missuse/abuse a handgun than a minor would.<span id='postcolor'>

primary use:

fork: to eat

rifle: to shoot.

get the difference?

[red oct 2]

well now a days you can hyjack aircraft w/ forks. they banned silverware on all american airliners. havent you watched those prision movies, they make shanks out of that kinda stuff.

[ralphwiggum 6]

that's called abuse/utilization. for a trained person, even a harmless thing can be a deadly weapon, like a pen.

[jawk2 1]

selling AK...

The last i heard from that was from a story from a teammate in the army, he was in french op in mogadiscio and told me that the AK was sold cheaper than the food

Well cruel world

[Tex -USMC- 0]

Last time I heard, in Africa an AK47 went for about $50. On the black market that is, and Im fairly sure that that is a bulk rate.

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">And a .308 and 7.62x39 are comparable. <span id='postcolor'>

Hardly.

The .308 round is more compareable to the 7.62x54r Russian round than the 7.62x39.

.308 (168grn. BTHM), Max effective range: 800-1000m

Muzzle energy (ft.lbs.) : 2678

Distance yards 100: 2318

yards 200: 1998

yards 300: 1713

yards 400: 1460

yards 500: 1239

7.62x39 Russian (125grn.), Max effective range: 300m

Muzzle Energy (ft.lbs.): 1552

Distance yards 100: 1180

yards 200: 882

yards 300: 652

yards 400: 483

yards 500: 370

.223 Remington (5.56NATO) (62grn),Max effective range 300m

Muzzle Energy (ft.lbs.): 1260

Distance yards 100: 911

yards 200: 643

yards 300: 442

yards 400: 298

yards 500: 204

The 7.62x39 Russian is closer energy wise to the 5.56x45 NATO than it is to the 7.62x51 NATO.

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"> They're the only heavy cartridges for rifles. Excluding exotic calibers like 7.62x54R and .30-06.

<span id='postcolor'>

I would hardly call either of them exotic by any means. The .30-06 is probably one of the most common civilian rifle rounds in the U.S. The 7.62x54r can be found anywhere in former Communist Bloc countries, just as easily as any AK round. The 7.62x39 round isn't a heavyweight in my books.

Tyler

[FetishFool 0]

I italisized 'exotic' because I couldn't think of a better word.

Since these boards have members around the world, saying your best bet was a rifle chamberd in .30-06 would only benefit half the members.  Same thing with the 7.62x54R.

You can find a rifle chambered in 5.56x45, 7.62x39 or 7.62x51 in any part of the world.

And it also means that you can most likely restock on ammo through dead enemies.

You have very little option when it comes to choosing the right rifle for a street-to-street war.

You need lots of penetration, but something that you can carry around individually.  And you want to choose a rifle that uses a common cartridge.

I narrow it down to 2 choices:

.308 or 7.62x39(M43)

.308 might be too heavy. So you'd have to resort to 7.62x39.

It depends on personal preferance. But still the same two choices.

[Sweeper 0]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (timmy @ June 10 2002,03:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">guns are way to cheap and way to easy to get in america. some sick guy could easily buy that gun and some body armor. and pull off what those two bank robbers did in los angelos.<span id='postcolor'>

If i wanted to do something criminal i would never use a Shotgun or a pistol for it.

Assault rifles and Light Machine guns are what you need.

[Assault (CAN) 1]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">If i wanted to do something criminal i would never use a Shotgun or a pistol for it.

Assault rifles and Light Machine guns are what you need.<span id='postcolor'>

LOL, too bad more than 80% of crimes involving a gun in the U.S. are with people who use handguns.

Light Machine Guns are illegal anyway, so are full-auto assault rifles. Well, it depends on the state, but you need to have a high qualification level to buy one. People who go through the trouble to get a legal full-auto weapon usually don't commit crimes anyway.

Tyler