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mondkalb

MBG Window of opportunity

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Just a reminder:

Though you are not allowed to modify and redistribute this mission, I encourage

everyone who is interested to convert this mission to a different mod or

addon-compilation. For example make WOO use Star Wars units.

Meaning, you are not allowed to edit and redistribute, only add different units and buildings....

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Just a reminder:

Meaning, you are not allowed to edit and redistribute, only add different units and buildings....

OK Link removed so I don't get in trouble with the interwebs cops

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Is anyone reading what I say?

Dice, which mission did you play SP on with AI attacking, and do you use mods?

I only played the Utes island mission and had no AI attacking, but haven't fully gone through the pack of missions, so it could be me.

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Having WOO work as a plug and plug commander module for ANY gametype (warfare, CTF, etc etc) would be amazing ! Having it work for AI commanders and it's jizz-in-the-pants time !

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Dont think the mission was designed to have the AI build and attack, I believe it was said that this is a PVP type mission or no?

In this release the enemy AI commander is not doing anything, so for most fun you need to play it pvp. The enemy ai seems however to be on the todo list.

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:eek:

People got a bit confused there, sorry.

WOO does currently not provide "enemy AI" as in "The enemy base is managed and producing units to fight the human players".

This is currently amongst my highest priorities and probably also the most difficult I have done so far.

If you want to fight someone, you currently have to play against friends, or play the included "Shapur raid" mission, which has preplaced enemy units. This was the mission type I was referring to as "COOP". It is similar to a normal mission.

These two are, sadly, currently the only options you have if you want to see some combat action.

Regarding the disclaimer I put in every script and the manual:

You are allowed to release new versions, as long as you don't alter the WOO core files.

This is to prevent usually badly-made spin-offs that take the whole credit for work that is not their own.

Toadball is for example currently porting WOO to new islands and makes occasional changes to the available list of units and their pricing. And that is perfectly fine and I do not object if someone else would do that and release it afterwards, too.

I hope that un-stirrs things.

Edited by Mondkalb

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to play custom games in SP, just depbo whatever mission file, rearange what you need and place down enemy AI, groups etc, or script them and then play Woo, no "required" PvP to play it.

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Yeah ,upsmon or Dac is perfect for this job.^^

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DAC will probably make an excellent opponent.

Meanwhile I've been cracking the whip on the enemy AI. This is what I have so far, and it is working good.

52934558.th.jpg

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Hi Mondkalb,

I realised about the AI enemy things, no problem easy to sort out for SP personal.

Talking of personal editing, I took the liberty to set the camera script so it only focused on the player. I set my own team and also a high command team, and it all worked pretty well, effectively your scripts latch onto high command and overlay it so your map view in camera acts perfectly to run a high command situations while still in top down camera mode. I can then switch to top down view and use all the functions to move teams, and so on and then back to first person play to be part of the battle.

So, I was wondering, if you expanded the script interface so that as well as go prone/hold fire, you had pretty much every command for AI that mirrors the waypoint settings in high command (all modes like danger/stealth also formations / get in vehicle etc) we would actually be back to a very nice COC/CEX Chain Of Command situation like in Arma1. And it also doesn't have to be top down only and can focus on player as part of the game in FPS.

Obviously at the moment your scripts latch onto high command and stop if from setting waypoint commands (in and outside of the camera/interface view if I return back to first person and go to map and try waypointing with high command) and I can only use the limited ones in the cam/interface.

Again, personal edits and strictly no distribution, but thought I would post what I tried plus thoughts.

The commands to mirror high command way-point info settings would still be beneficial to the RTS modes anyway.

COC/CEX in arma1 was effectively RTS / FPS (so you could switch and play any team in the battle first person and still command everything). Although your interface / icons and movement of camera is far more sexy :)

Also ... can you hold the team as you place waypoints at the moment? I notice you mention chaining them (in the "todo" readme) so I guess this could have chained waypoints with high command style setting for the waypoints and then a "go" to run them, currently chain of command doesn't have a "hold as I place the waypoint then go when I tell you afterwards".

EDIT:

To clarify high command works as normal and you can use the camera as normal too, its starts to conflict when you then set waypoints via the interface or on map click to move camera position, at this stage if you exit from interface then go back to high command it wont set commands on way points any more. Obviously this is becuase you haven't set it for this, but if yours did take over and mirror high command with way point settings it would be very powerful indeed. Or if it detected high command units and recognised this to not conflict would work also.

Edited by mrcash2009

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Sounds like a dream come true here hearing COC/CEX again !

These sound like wonderful edits too mrcash! Perhaps you could share your edit with Mondkalb and see if it fits in with his vision.

but if yours did take over and mirror high command with way point settings it would be very powerful indeed

AMEN !

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The whole purpose of why I am currently "prohibiting" user modifications is because WOO will still inevitably change. Most certainly also in it's core functions.

And if you create something based on the current version, your work might be not functioning with the next release. The only file that will remain unchanged is the UnitConfig.

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Perhaps you could share your edit with Mondkalb and see if it fits in with his vision.

I wouldn't go to those lengths, was a basic cut & shut job just to see only.
The whole purpose of why I am currently "prohibiting" user modifications is because WOO will still inevitably change. Most certainly also in it's core functions.

And if you create something based on the current version, your work might be not functioning with the next release. The only file that will remain unchanged is the UnitConfig.

No problem completely understand, I personally just wanted to see how that worked, sure it will be old with a new update. Im done with just "peeping" mainly it was just to add some feedback here only. Hope you cool with that mate.

Edited by mrcash2009

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Just played the Shapur single player version and it is WICKED ! I love it.

Some things I found -

Troops wouldn't load into vehicles

Prone/stand up was a little buggy and didnt seem to do a lot once they were in danger mode

It would be WONDERFUL to have the numbers of troops actually on the icon (for instance if I have a SF troop with 4 members I get the SF 4 icon, but if I lost one SF then I would love to see SF 3 icon. I know it means messing with icon but it would look sweet if you have time.

WASD (with maybe QZ up and down, XC rotate left and right) would make me cry with simplicity :)

This is awesome Mondkalb - keep it up mate. I may even have tempted my brother into playing Arma2 because of WOO !

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It would be WONDERFUL to have the numbers of troops actually on the icon (for instance if I have a SF troop with 4 members I get the SF 4 icon, but if I lost one SF then I would love to see SF 3 icon

That would be wonderful.

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And there I was about to play Men of War today.. bloody awesome!

My only major gripe is the inability to pan the camera, so at some engagement ranges (especially when working with vehicles) it's difficult to keep situational awareness

Edited by DaveP

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Hello,

your "WOO" is the idea of the century :)

I love it... but i´ve to learn the "tabs".

Also a great manual thats shows "how to use" the WOO and helps a lot, also the vid you´ve made!

I´m real glowing of this new gameplay for Arma and i have informed the community from Arma2Base about the release!

For your eyes only... ;)

http://www.arma2base.de/include.php?path=forumsthread&threadid=463

Take my deep respect and all my credits!!

Best regards

McLupo

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Hi Mondkalb,

first of all great mod, very enjoyable!

Plays very much like world in conflict for me, which is a very good thing in my book.

What would make it even better IMHO would being able to use WSAD keys to move the camera, (like in RTE for example).

Also nice would be more support options, like the ones provided by the mando support console from some sort of comm terminal in the base.

Adequately priced not to distract from the primary action of the inf and armored units, of course. (think of ion cannon control for instance ;)

Keep it up!

Crusader

EDIT:

Speaking of world in conflict, a smokescreen action for tanks would be sweet!

Edited by TheCrusader

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As im liking this more and more here are some things I would love to see added or happen, I admit im not the one coding it and some of it might be a big ask or not what author wants to add but this is my brain dump (some of it maybe a repeat) :)

ISSUES SPOTTED:

1) I have found when selecting cruise missile I get a large fps drop and big pauses while selecting my zone, once selected its fine again, using arty doesnt do this. This was in the COOP BAF mission BTW. Also if im in this selection process and I pressed ESC the icons would still show and would be stuck in the low FPS mode. It happens repeated on my system.

EDIT ... after running again it did not happen, odd, it would happen every time, must see what else may cause it to do this.

2) When mounting a UAZ truck with canopy I notice that on map click waypoint or 3D view the truck would ... move a bit ... wait for 5 secs or so, move a bit ... wait and so on. I then had a small UAZ Jeep on the map at the same time and that moved perfectly fine and very fast, will test this more.

3) In BAF COOP mission, select a unit and click next to the empty 3 Jeeps, if you click slightly off you dont get a on board vehicle marker it will show the icon/marker for non enter-able vehicle (cross in a circle) when this happens all the AI will start attacking it until its destroyed (and you cannot tell them to disengage). You may have to try it a few times but it does happen, I think its boarding an empty vehicle and your clicking direct in the middle.

EDIT ... later on in the mission I tried to get team to re-board the empty vehicle and I clicked near to car and this happened again, so its something to do with where you click as to getting no board icon which will make team start shooting the empty vehicle to death :)

EDIT2 ... fix ... I notice this happens when you select a vehicle to board with the camera view more to the side angle and further away, if at this angle you right click on empty vehicle at its center it triggers this bug. So to avoid either move cam directly above (more top down) and right click its center, or if you are in a more side angle and further away view, right click side of car not middle. I suppose a fix would be a more open click area to stop the no entry & units destroy it bug. If this happens I also find the units wont command right after sometimes.

4) Also in BAF COOP which is the mode I was looking for to make it more player centric, I notice if I enter a vehicle I cant access the command menu, so Im wondering if that could be set so I can access it, I assume in mission init via radio? I mean in situations where I might enter a transport vehicle with AI and get them to move with me in it.

5) Couldn't see a quick way to cancel a waypoint if I made a mistake, say if I had a unit off the 3d map that was still selected and I placed a waypoint and they started to move and I realise that's a mistake, I could cancel it fast (see point 16 in requests),

REQUESTS & AND THINGS AS I PLAYED

1. AWSD control for interface without a doubt

2. The ability to shift and click on multiple teams to highlight multiples, then when right clicking a way-point they move as one.

3. Ability to use heli transport for drop load/load unload of units & fixed wing for para drops? Maybe ammunitions drop for teams to rearm also for FOB on larger playing areas?

4. Ability to set a unit to target something ... IE if I have a tank and I see a target, rather than waypoint to it & it will go into danger mode, have an icon show from a target option in the team menu to notify that highlighted unit "this is your target" (this would show continual on the target when highlighting that unit so you can see what they are going for) a bit like arty icon selection for arty drop but for specific targets.

The reason this would be good is if you see a heavy vehicle threat, rather than waypointing you can direct target a tank or heavy armour direct to that enemy armour so you know its focus is on that. Arty etc would be good I guess but Im thinking about tank battles and armour to armour threats ina situation around infantry.

5. When right clicking to lay a waypoint down an option while pressing say shift would give a drop down (to mirror high commands drop down) so that waypoint can have setting within them if you wish IE formation/danger/stealth etc (more logical on map view).

6. Ability so no conflicts to switch to any team as leader, so in your menu you have a "switch to" icon or something, and that selected unit has the control to goto command view also? I assume just setting up a mission with switch-able units would do this anyway although I was thinking about control inside camera mode.

7. Maybe the system could detect if high command module is active in a mission and thus use high commands controls along side waypointing from cam view of your system, but in a way that they dont conflict (which they do currently with my test I posted about previously).

This way you could have the power and option of your RTS system with great camera view but can then switch to map view and continue using high command features.

8. Ability to set waypoints down for a team (maybe right click and control key) which will place multiple waypoints and the team does not move to them, then an option to tell team to "go" / advance.

9. Abilty to select one or more teams (see option 2) to click on a vehicle so they all get in at once (rather than selecting / clicking on vehicle one by one).

10. Like option 2 but be able to hold multi selected team(s) grouped up and then un group them later. Not just for vehicles or creating convoys but also in infantry moves also.

11. Map view ... ability to multi select the icons like in High command (using shift select?) and use map view that way to control than switching back and forth per unit selected in 3d view or one click only.

12. As mentioned before some icon showing unit type and size above the unit for quick view of the battle field (like the icons are shown in map view/tab overlay unit list, but in 3d view, plus showing current units left in that group in real time. Maybe this option toggled like tab option is at the moment.

13. All formations types / squad modes (stealth, danger etc etc) under unit controls to complete that area, plus an order to disengage.

14. In COOP mode that is set to view player (as in BAF COOP mission) could I still have ability to set a base and build more units? I realise this is for not reinforcing, but it would be nice to see a demo where its this mission type WITH reinforcements.

15. The Tab overlay unit list, possibility to have it so if I right click (or left click and key combo) the unit icon it will move cam to that unit, as opposed to selecting and pressing space only. Also a selected unit in this overlay maybe change to a different color than white to know what's selected.

EDIT .. I notice you mention this one in "Todo" txt.

16. Ability to cancel a placed waypoint somehow other than accidentally placing, pressing stop then re-assigning. Maybe the waypoint icon stays when you highlight a unit to see in 3d where its heading then right click on the waypoint to kill it?

17. Ability to lock camera to selected unit so it will follow not just in 3D mode but also when switching to map view, so if you switch back your still directly following that unit without having to space bar move or manual move camera.

I admit there isn't need for high command as your system latches onto teams to use them if they exist, but as the way pointing control and settings isn't of high command that's why I mentioned copying it or working so you could have both.

I know I go on about it like a mad man but if you ever played Chain Of Command aka COC/CEX in Arma1 it was basicly RTS/FPS on steroids.

COC/CEX USE IN MAP VIEW AS AN EXAMPLE OF MORE POWERFUL MAP VIEW

Here a video of it working, its what BIS covered with High Command for arma2 but not as powerful plus it had RTS ability (tried to embed but wouldn't work for some reason):

As you can see from this it has a way of placing waypoint and what you want in that waypoint, but more flexible than High Command had the ability to chain them, set them & THEN set the unit to "advance". Perfect for both High Command and RTS control.

I think that you have covered alot but this might be more to do with more control within the map view and waypoints than 3d view (or both if it could be done). You can see it has move selectable waypoint path making and more right click options to set what each waypoint setting will be. This would add a little more power to map views controlling along side 3d cam view.

Anywone who can match COC/CEX to some degree overcoming some drawbacks of High Command, plus using this loverly style interface and camera combined in a RTS mode would be king :)

Looking forward to any updates, really liking it so far :)

Edited by mrcash2009

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Now Mondkalb... the question is: Can you make a squad based shooter with dynamic pausing a-la x-com/Silent Storm :D

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One last post apart from war & peace post on previous page ...

Would you consider upping this into a module format using sync functions as opposed to manual edits of scripts to include units? I realise that's probably some kind of re write and config setup is fine, just a thought.

EDIT ... On the more COOP side of the mission type like the BAF COOP example, why is there a need to enter the full unit type in the config array (as they are pre layed down units in the editor)?

IE:

[[POWERcost, CRATEscost,BuildTIME,"Display Name", "Icon","PanelPicture"],["unit", "unit", "unit"], "Vehicle"]
I can understand this for spawning when building groups in other mission types, but pre layed down units it seems quite a fiddle to add each and every unit description here, or can this be left out? I have been simply copying and pasting and changing ID and description only so far.

Would it possible to have it that pre layed down units use a different set of recipes (without the unit lists and other unrelated parts)?

Ive made a bunch of edits to my long post on previous page if any of it helps as feedback BTW.

Edited by mrcash2009

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[[POWERcost, CRATEscost,BuildTIME,"Display Name", "Icon","PanelPicture"],["unit", "unit", "unit"], "Vehicle"]

That array is used to spawn units when an order is given. The requirement for preplaced units to have this is to maintain compatibility with the side-panel. More specific with the unit count comparison.

You can plop in any value you want into that array for preplaced units.

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Just a few more updates for feedback ...

After playing more fluent and a longer session I found that that Tab overlay unit list would be better to stay switched on in command view mode (or option to have it fixed on), as opposed to having to keep tabbing it on, more often than not im looking for that right away in the 3d view.

Could the Tab overlay also show on map view so you have option to select icons on map and the overlay for quick ref?

I also noticed (and this is probably nothing you would support but here goes) that in SP play I saved and reverted, all works well until you then try to press ESC to exit command view, basicly it doesn't and then all functions of command view wont show or work and its a show stopper. This is all to do with reverting from a save.

I guess it wasn't intended for SP & Saves, but if there's some possibility for support then I thought I would post what I noticed.

Well after some great play and loads of feedback, I think I will shut up and wait for any updates :)

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