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Cover system for Arma3?

Would Arma3 benefit from having a cover system?  

309 members have voted

  1. 1. Would Arma3 benefit from having a cover system?

    • Yes, I think a cover system would make combat more immersive
      152
    • No, a cover system would detract from Arma's gameplay style
      127
    • Don't really care one way or the other
      31


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No special cover system is needed. Imo all cover systems that use a special button or gameplay object (crates & stuff for looking over) are just an easier way for the AI to notice the player is actually in cover and is not 'allowed' to be seen until he fires.

As an fps programmer its far easier to provide a key to the player for going into cover rather than make complicated AI - player - line of sight checks to find out whether the AI can see him or not.

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As an fps programmer its far easier to provide a key to the player for going into cover rather than make complicated AI - player - line of sight checks to find out whether the AI can see him or not.

Its not really the case in arma, as it would seem (according to my tests with CGA). ArmA2 seems to already acknowledge you are behind the wall and you are safe.

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In my oppinion the ability to automatically raise/lower your body to fit the wall you are kneeling behind is good enough. All 'cover issues' we currently have other than the inability to adapt our bodies to the height of a wall we are behind are caused by crappy animations and sometimes physics. A full cover system is deffinitly not needed in my oppinion.

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In my oppinion the ability to automatically raise/lower your body to fit the wall you are kneeling behind is good enough. All 'cover issues' we currently have other than the inability to adapt our bodies to the height of a wall we are behind are caused by crappy animations and sometimes physics. A full cover system is deffinitly not needed in my oppinion.

Maybe a suitable "rest on surface" feature would kill two birds with one stone - allow for stabalised weapons and allow for cover height adjustment.

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ACE already does that. It's a pretty cool feature and doesn't break anything. Just press shift+space and your weapon is rested (provided the object is high/low enough - which ACE somehow detects well) This is the thing I want to see in vanilla too.

That and gradual leaning like in Raven Shield (and with TrackIR in AA2) is the real improvement the game needs.

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Got to say I'm quite surprised by how many pro-cover system votes there are, I was expecting a pretty robust thrashing. Thanks to everyone for keeping it well civilised and useful! :)

I seem to be noticing a two key points in terms of the rejection of a 'cover' mechanic.

1) The capacity to do something approximating this already exists in mods and custom animation replacement sets.

*** My response to this would be that this is good, but that unless its implemented in the core game by the game devs it will remain in terms of the AI behaviour, a strap-on system which only human players can use, thus defeating the point of most of this which is increasing realistic AI behaviour in a firefight, as we people can very effectively position ourselves behind cover manually.

2) That a cover system would 'lock' someone into place and allow them to become a target from the rear, and thus is unsuited to an open world gameplay style where targets can come from anywhere.

*** Response to this would be that I don't think a 'velcroed to the wall' model of cover system would suit the Arma series at all. The last thing I would want to see is some kind of gears of war style cover hopping button mashing crap replacing the gameplay I love. I do however feel that there is benefit to having an ability to place yourself so that your avatar conforms to the cover without having to go into contortions ingame to stay down. Also that a proper cover system would allow you to actually FACE THE REAR WITH YOUR BACK TO THE WALL, thus meaning that you're less likely to die by shooting in the back.

I understand that you do have the ability to bend down to make the game's crouch more pronounced as someone said, but nobody takes cover like that in real life for very good reason, inspecting your shoelaces in a combat situation is not great observational behaviour and will likely get you killed in short order.

I have great faith in the ability of the BI devs. I think they have managed to consistently produce games of incredible scope and capacity, and so yes, I have the faith that if they chose to do a cover system it could be implemented in a way which didn't detract from the gameplay, something along the lines of a 'conform to cover' key which allows you to stay down behind the height of whatever you're behind, and allows you to pivot through 360 degrees whilst remaining in cover, as well as allow for resting of a weapon on surface to fire back more accurately...

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Not just leaning but stance also. That would eliminate the need for any 'sticky' cover thing. In fact, a specific 'duck behind wall' animation like in Smookie's mod would be nice as well. I don't mean being stuck to the wall and ducking, just a move you can perform anywhere, like the step over.

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Again having your back on the wall isn't really that helpful other then telling you that you are in "cover mode", if you happened having to back to a wall inorder to make you a smaller target then chance is that you are on the wrong side of the wall, i would rather have the ability that once you are just standing next to the wall your weapon became more stable because the wall is backing you. You may say that Hey, it acturally help when in a conder! Well it may, but at this point I'd have my rifle up and me looking down the sight facing poissible enemy while leaning left or right peeking around.

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Im going to sit on the fence but I dont think that it is a necessary part of inclusion in Arma 3. Focus on some of the more interesting aspects; eg Scuba Diving, Naval Combat, Air Vehicles before cover system, if it is included add a module to remove it from the gameplay when wanted.

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Maybe a suitable "rest on surface" feature would kill two birds with one stone ...

Not if my chosen cover is a wall 2m high and i want to shoot around it. :D

Which happens to me 90% of all situations i use cover in ArmA2 tbh, but maybe i'm sexually attracted to walls and therefore its a personal thing... :rolleyes:

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)rStrangelove;1937386']Not if my chosen cover is a wall 2m high and i want to shoot around it. :D

Which happens to me 90% of all situations i use cover in ArmA2 tbh' date=' but maybe i'm sexually attracted to walls and therefore its a personal thing... :rolleyes:[/quote']

Well, it might be argued that a lean function already exists and it just needs to be more refined i.e. there's not much leaning vs clunky movements if you wish to shuffle, it's very easy to expose too much of yourself. I think maybe there should be a lean for leaning & shooting, and a more extensive "peep" lean which leans you further but with no weapon. But I think I might be unnecessarily overcomplicating the entire thing now :)

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)rStrangelove;1937386']but maybe i'm sexually attracted to walls...

In combat EVERYONE thinks a brick wall looks pretty sexy... ;)

That could be considered as one of the founding principles of this thread.

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Well, it might be argued that a lean function already exists and it just needs to be more refined i.e. there's not much leaning vs clunky movements if you wish to shuffle, it's very easy to expose too much of yourself. I think maybe there should be a lean for leaning & shooting, and a more extensive "peep" lean which leans you further but with no weapon. But I think I might be unnecessarily overcomplicating the entire thing now :)

In fact if BI improve the avatar collision detection I think a lots of problem will be gone.

In combat EVERYONE thinks a brick wall looks pretty sexy... ;)

That could be considered as one of the founding principles of this thread.

Not to a point that I would rub my back at that wall knowing that incoming bullet might hit the wall, bounce off and kill me.

Edited by 4 IN 1

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Im going to sit on the fence but I dont think that it is a necessary part of inclusion in Arma 3.

more like stuck to the fence and blind firing over it amirite guys ha ha ha ha ha

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more like stuck to the fence and blind firing over it amirite guys ha ha ha ha ha

Yup, i had this before. It's called Uncharted2. Getting into cover is like being glued there lol. :D

Uncharted2 is surely a very good example how a scripted coversystem should NOT be done. God knows if ArmA3 would include this system i'd put my order on hold until i read somebody makes a mod to get rid of it.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/1078-Uncharted-2-Among-Thieves

Edited by ])rStrangelove

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In fact if BI improve the avatar collision detection I think a lots of problem will be gone.

That would be great. You know, we'd actually have a use for shorter barreled weaponary.

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I don't like it when the AI are inside of houses and go prone. The hands and gun go through the wall. which means i can kill them. if they fix the player collisions and clunky movements it'll be enough for me.

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Realistic cover system - why not [for players and AI]. Arcade sprint-jump-backflip-slide to cover-like rubbish - nope.

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ArmA2 was a good leap forward with ai an cover but not what i expected. Also ai having 3d vision thru trees,bushes etc is kinda annoying but playable if u know how to get around there tactics. One of the disappointments in ArmA2 for me was no Durgs Vegitation Fix from ArmA1 it was so awsomeness.8)-

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What AI have is super-human hearing, not super vision.

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I personally like how the AI can see and hear you know. The problem is the shooting. They are WAY to accurate with every type of weapon.

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You do know you can control maximum AI accuracy via difficulty settings in your config?

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Doing it Vietcong style would be all what i would wish, for player. Meaning that there are high shooting positions for kneel and prone and low ready position for both as well. Low prone means hugging earth and making as flat target as possible, even roots of trees became potential cover (didn't have bullet penetration). I

Now days it feels unpleasant when i'm forced to go prone and back to kneeling position if i wish to shoot from kneeling position.

There's room to improve it, but even still almost 10 years ago it's most immersive thing for me. Easy to use and learn... Unlike MOH:Airborne's system which i haven't learned even still and i've finished that game three times already. :D

For AI? They should be able to use cover as firing position and as hiding position, they don't do that and usually they just lie behind rock wall unable to do anything. They should understand that in which position they can engage target and at which position they are hiding from enemies. And they should understand how to be hard target and when they have been shot at. OFDR's lousy AI had all of these (wink-wink ;) )

Not that i'd expect these kind improvements from BIS, i'm already far too skeptical with BIS and their game-improvement policy.

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A cover system if it is done as it is in RO2. As in, no over the shoulder, 3rd person junk.

keep it first person so you can accurately peak around corners, toss a grenade around a corner with minimal exposure. When resting against a surface, have it so you can stand up inch by inch to shoot over cover. This is more realistic than the 3 fixed heights in ArmA 2.

If you don't understand what I mean, look up RO2 videos. Very nice stuff with the cover/peak system.

Assuming it takes a realistic amount of time to peak around the corners and it is not clunky, then it will be greatly immersive and realistic.

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In fact if BI improve the avatar collision detection I think a lots of problem will be gone.

This and the ability to move slowly to the side. Right now hitting Shift does effect moving forward in ironsights, but doesn't effect moving left or right. I died many times stepping to fast out of cover, while i tried to adjust for leaning.

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