They better have female soldiers...

[max power 21]

:(

No moar sexist crap, plox. If you have nothing to add about women soldiers in the sim environment, please refrain from posting.

I'll repeat myself one last time, and tell you the same thing I told n7snk in his warning.

This is not a private hang out with you and your friends to disparage people based on their sex or race for fun, whether you actually mean it or not. This is the public forum for a business.

There will be no more warnings from me in this topic. Public discrimination and humiliation is a problem. Further wanton sexist jokes or statements will accrue infractions.

Let the nude mods COMMENCE!!!

+ 1 infraction for spamming / failing to follow moderator instructions.

§5) No Spam

We deem spam as making a thread or posting a reply that has no real worth, is irrelevant, useless and offers nothing to a discussion. Messages of banned members are also considered as spam. If your post/thread is not able to illicit or sustain an in depth conversation then it's spam. This also applies to other areas of the forums such as leaving visitor messages on people's profiles. Spam may be dealt with by post count reduction, PR and/or WL.

§2) Follow the instructions of the moderators

When a moderator or BIS staff member asks you to do something or to stop doing something, please follow their instructions. If you have questions/complaints/comments about the forum or moderators please PM them to a moderator, we will do our utmost to reply to any that we receive. If you have an issue that you feel cannot be solved by another moderator then please PM the head moderator (Placebo), he will be happy to look into the matter.

[Evil_Echo 11]

Zalkovsky there is in the 101st Screamin' Eagles Airborne division. They do have support battalions in the 101st. I wonder what her job is. Too bad we can't (or I can't) identify her battalion.

Recall the Marine motto - "Every marine is first and foremost a rifleman." Which also applies to airborne units once they hit dirt - they effectively become leg-infantry. Given the lack of battle fronts in today's wars, all units are front-line.

As I pointed out earlier, there is an increasing chance these days of US forces finding opposing female units on the battlefield. From an emotional point of view putting a woman in the crosshairs is far worse than having a female compatriot hit/killed by incoming fire. We've already settled that female combat units exist, and at least some females are as capable as men of doing the job of elite forces. So what's left aside from that emotional element?

[max power 21]

I've learned that PFC Janelle Zolkovsky is of the Civil Affairs Unit of the 1st Battalion, 320th Field Artillery Regiment, 101st Airborne Division deployed from Fort Campbell, Ky.

[David Schofield 10]

I think it's a reasonable idea, but let's be honest, there should be a very visable disproportion if they are introduced as soldiers. As it stands now, the mass majority of the military is made up of males. This will probably not change much in the near future, and this fact should be reflected in ArmA 3. There should indeed be female warriors. Not in equal proportions, however. (Still have a plentiful number of different faces and whatnot to choose from).

In terms of spawing soldiers and groups, I'd say an female/male 18.67/81.33 ratio would be appropriate.

I cite this site as a part of the logic in the ratio idea.

http://www.womensmemorial.org/PDFs/StatsonWIM.pdf

Edited May 29, 2012 by David Schofield
Citing

[batto 17]

Štěpán Kment mentioned women in one of GDS videos posted by PurePassion. He talked about how number of animations grow with combiations of different stances, weapons, ... and gender! I take it for granted =). He talked specifically about ArmA.

[nodunit 397]

Nice as that sounds I'm going to keep my fingers crossed rather than throw up my hands. Animations for female characters are nice and all but if they can't use equipment such as vehicles and guns then it's all a moot point and they may as well not even be in the game to begin with since from a game mechanic standpoint they are pointless to have.

By the way, why is it that the majority of you immediately jump to first world armies, or generally established armies when female soldier are mentioned? Fighting one another tooth and nail to prove or disprove each others information rather than stopping to think "Hey, we have female character models, so why not give them the ability to use weapons and equipment?" Besides, NATO is supposedly in deep trouble in A3, so whose to say they wouldn't be trying to push every extra gun they can, be it male or female? Honestly I would be surprised if drafting weren't in progress.

Yes I know Arma is supposed to be realistic, that doesn't mean it has to be our world to the dot, and thinking in such a way limits creativity..

Edited May 29, 2012 by NodUnit

[scarecrow398 43]

Nice as that sounds I'm going to keep my fingers crossed rather than throw up my hands. Animations for female characters are nice and all but if they can't use equipment such as vehicles and guns then it's all a moot point and they may as well not even be in the game to begin with since from a game mechanic standpoint they are pointless to have.

They're useful during TvT senarios through team switching to confuse and anger enemy teams :D

[Dibuk 10]

So after one year since I made this topic I find it again (with 89 pages!) through a link in another forum.

Now the OP was not that long and not hard to understand I hope, but I do see ALOT of "U.S army dont have female infantry" or "NATO don't have..." etc.

But as I said last year, resistance forces should by all means have female troopers, there are plenty of examples or rebel/guerilla/resistance movments that have used females (and children. Not gonna poke that issue even with a stick) to fight. Desperation makes possibilities and that is not something new, even large countries will enlist females if they have the need (like the volksturm of 1945*] for it.

The important thing is that we have a working female model, the mappers and modders will do the rest. The more variety the better.

*http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=77&t=135725

[BinaryCode64 1]

Deleted

Edited March 10, 2013 by BinaryCode64

[Booster 1]

Now the OP was not that long and not hard to understand I hope, but I do see ALOT of "U.S army dont have female infantry" or "NATO don't have..." etc.

Well the first poll option is 'I would like to see female combat units for each/certain military faction(s)'

You are the person responsible for creating that option so why does it come as a surprise to you that the voters expressed different opinions about the topic?

I'd just like to add that I didn't vote for any of your options because Bohemia announced prior to your creation of this thread that Arma3 won't have female soldiers.

[SpunkMonkey 1]

The important thing is that we have a working female model, the mappers and modders will do the rest.

This observation is spot on. Even if female models aren't used in the game, they can be used in mods. I haven't played Day Z, but I have to imagine that it doesn't have any females, which just sounds bizarre.

[onlyrazor 11]

This observation is spot on. Even if female models aren't used in the game, they can be used in mods. I haven't played Day Z, but I have to imagine that it doesn't have any females, which just sounds bizarre.

I think an update gives you a one time chance to use a female model. Here's a PC Gamer article about the update.

[BinaryCode64 1]

Deleted

Edited March 10, 2013 by BinaryCode64

[Dibuk 10]

Well the first poll option is 'I would like to see female combat units for each/certain military faction(s)'

You are the person responsible for creating that option so why does it come as a surprise to you that the voters expressed different opinions about the topic?

I'd just like to add that I didn't vote for any of your options because Bohemia announced prior to your creation of this thread that Arma3 won't have female soldiers.

Yeah, that poll is not my doing, it have been added by someone over the year.

However in my OP I said: "No matter what you have say about the females in various countries today (Not only the US as so many refers to) the future story of Arma 3 seems to call for irregulars and desperate messures."

But people with a sexistic/matcho side, choose to disregard from that.

So They have said for over a year ago that there would be no women that can fight in ARMA 3? Where? If so, I can only hope they have changed thier minds by now.

[antoineflemming 14]

Yeah, that poll is not my doing, it have been added by someone over the year.

However in my OP I said: "No matter what you have say about the females in various countries today (Not only the US as so many refers to) the future story of Arma 3 seems to call for irregulars and desperate messures."

But people with a sexistic/matcho side, choose to disregard from that.

So They have said for over a year ago that there would be no women that can fight in ARMA 3? Where? If so, I can only hope they have changed thier minds by now.

Will an omission like this keep you from buying ArmA3? By the way, not wanting female soldiers is NOT a matter of being sexist or macho. The future story of ArmA3 does NOT call for irregulars and desperate measures, as the story of ArmA3 was changed. It's no longer post-WW3. It's like now on the brink of WW3. The first story had Iran occupying Europe. This story only has Iran occupying Turkey, part of Greece, and Limnos. That said, this discussion has gotten absolutely no where.

[batto 17]

Will an omission like this keep you from buying ArmA3? By the way, not wanting female soldiers is NOT a matter of being sexist or macho. The future story of ArmA3 does NOT call for irregulars and desperate measures, as the story of ArmA3 was changed. It's no longer post-WW3. It's like now on the brink of WW3. The first story had Iran occupying Europe. This story only has Iran occupying Turkey, part of Greece, and Limnos. That said, this discussion has gotten absolutely no where.

Female survivors in ArmA3 DayZ? ;) And of course female zombies too.

[antoineflemming 14]

Female survivors in ArmA3 DayZ? ;) And of course female zombies too.

There's a DayZ forum for DayZ discussion anyway...

[max power 21]

Will an omission like this keep you from buying ArmA3? By the way, not wanting female soldiers is NOT a matter of being sexist or macho. The future story of ArmA3 does NOT call for irregulars and desperate measures, as the story of ArmA3 was changed. It's no longer post-WW3. It's like now on the brink of WW3. The first story had Iran occupying Europe. This story only has Iran occupying Turkey, part of Greece, and Limnos. That said, this discussion has gotten absolutely no where.

Are you serious? Your country is occupied by a massive hostile force, half of europe is occupied, lines are drawn, and this is 'the brink' of world war 3, and it is not a time that calls for extreme measures? What?

Edited June 2, 2012 by Max Power

[Kilmannan 1]

Lots of exciting opinions in this thread!

I'm currently serving in the British Army as a Corporal with tours of Iraq and Afghanistan under my belt as well as various overseas deployments in liason or training roles.

I'll first of all clear up any mis-understandings insofar as the British Army's policy is concerned, on females in the front line.

There are no frontline female soldiers in the British Army.

There are however, females on the frontline, by virtue of being Medics and hence technically, non-combatants. Frontline soldiers aren't soldiers on the frontline, they are soldiers in Combat Arms of which there are only three in the British Army:

Infantry

Royal Armoured Corp

Army Air Corp

You wont find many females amongst those Arms serving on the frontline, but they are there.

Most people are aware of the reasons as to why females aren't permitted to serve as Combat Arm soldiers (which would make them frontline soldiers), from both the psychological aspect and the physical aspects.

Psychological: Females soldiers place a heavy burden on any male soldiers working alongside them. The male soldiers know what will happen if for whatever reason, that female soldier ends up as a hostage in the hands of a hostile force. They also find it hard to prevent basic instincts of preservation of the female from kicking in should she become injured. There is also an increased sexual and emotional tension which often creates rivalry between the male soldiers.

Physical: Females for the most part, cannot lift nor carry the same weight as a man. Their bodies are designed differently and it's a simple fact of nature that a female body is more frail than a mans. This is evolution over thousands of years. Hence when in an Operational environment, a female soldier will struggle to carry the 90lbs of weight on her back, the 20lbs of weight around her waist and her Individual Weapon. This has been proven time and time again.

However, as far as ArmA III is concerned......... Who cares? It's a game. :D

Also, funny stories of female soldiers attached to a Combat Arm unit serving on the frontline?

Operation Herrick 10 - A certain Infantry Regiment based in a Forward Operating Base returns to Bastion on a switch-over. Their RSM walks into the main AGC compound pulling their attached female clerk by the scruff of her neck and says to the female RAO:

"Can we have another one please, this one's full."

The Clerk had slept with the majority of the 100 strong male unit during their three months out at the FoB.

Arf. :D

[BinaryCode64 1]

Deleted

Edited March 10, 2013 by BinaryCode64

[jerryhopper 285]

I get why some people don't want to shoot women in a game because it feels a lot more real, then in lets say Unreal Tournament that does have women to shoot at.

i dont.

If you dont wanna shoot women, play a coop map with no women in it.

If you dont care, play anything.

it can be that simple, really.

[SpunkMonkey 1]

There's a DayZ forum for DayZ discussion anyway...

I only mentioned Day Z as an example of why it weould make sense to include female models.

I get why some people don't want to shoot women in a game...

How is shooting a woman any different than shooting at a man? Either way, you are trying to kill someone.

Edited June 2, 2012 by SpunkMonkey

[BinaryCode64 1]

Deleted

Edited March 10, 2013 by BinaryCode64

[antoineflemming 14]

Are you serious? Your country is occupied by a massive hostile force, half of europe is occupied, lines are drawn, and this is 'the brink' of world war 3, and it is not a time that calls for extreme measures? What?

half of Europe ISN'T occupied. Go look at the arma3 wepbage. That was the old story, when NATO was about to be driven into the sea, where CPT Miller was the last of his unit, washed ashore on Limnos, alone. The story isn't that anymore. It's been toned down. There are no more references to NATO being desperate, or about an Iran-NATO war starting in 2021, or about a Second Battle of Brno. All that's gone! BIS toned down the story a WHOLE lot. That's my point.

For example:

OLD STORY:

Col Vahid Namdar

Military commander of Limnos

Colonel Namdar, a career officer of the Iranian Armed Forces in his forties, is Supreme Military Commander of the Limnos task force. During his youth, he took part in The Lions Movement, joined the army and became an airborne officer; he led one of the Nationalist commandos in the Esfahan Coup d’état in 2024. His military record encompasses the Iranian campaign in Europe. In the First Battle of Brno, his airborne regiment assisted in the breakthrough in the NATO defenses. In 2030, he became a staff officer on an unidentified post in the European Theater Command in Izmir. His transfer to Limnos suggests an ongoing important military operation or facility development. According to several sources, Colonel Namdar lately became a subordinate of General Ostad Javeed Attar, one of the chief officers of the Iranian military research and arms production.

Note: General Ostad (title for academics, adopted by NI) Javeed Attar – research director, P8H8 during opposition, Red Pegasus

Sgt Evan Illing

Deep Reconnaissance Team “Ice-8†Commander

American, single, born in Cedar Rapids, Iowa March 15th 2001. Pursued a military career his whole life, he climbed the professional ladder due to his indisputable qualities, capable leadership and daring execution of missions behind enemy lines. He became a member of the 10th Special Forces Group in 2025, just to be deployed in the deadliest hotspots in the defense of Europe: Iraq, Caucasus, Turkey. After the European defenses broke, he and the rest of SOCOM elements were transfered to Great Britain, where Sgt Illing was assigned another duty. He became leader of a deep reconnaissance team, one of many under the European branch of SOCOM. In 2034, he was captured by Iranian troops during a mission on Crete, but was liberated by a joint NATO taskforce operating in the area.

Sgt Illing commands the last surviving team of operation Ice Shard, the EJSOC’s attempt to gather information about the Iranian weapons test range on Limnos. His team, codenamed “Ice-8â€, is still stationed on Limnos as the critical asset of operation Magnitude.

Georgios Akhanteros

Regional Director of Limnos Island, New Greece

Greek national, age 60-65, marital status and children unknown. G. Akantheros is the head of the puppet government on the Limnos island. In the past, he was a mayor of Myrina for several terms (as a member of a right-wing party), ran local businesses and owned several hotels and other tourism-oriented companies. After war broke out, he gathered remnants of the Greek police and military personnel on Limnos and became a dictator and a warlord of no-man’s-land. He now runs a fairly capable paramilitary force and a petty regime in Myrina and its vicinity. According to the available resources, he tries to maintain basic security on the area under his control, maintains a self-sustainable economy with occasional Iranian support, and systematically fights against the concurrent smuggling networks, the resistance movement and the independent marauding groups. Unconfirmed Intel claims “cleansing†operations in the refugee enclaves.

New Story

Col. Vahid Namdar

Military Commander of Limnos

Career officer of the Iranian Armed Forces, age ~40; Supreme Military Commander of the Limnos Task Force. During his youth, partook in The Lions Movement, joined the army and became an airborne officer. Led a Nationalist commando in the Esfahan Coup d’état of 2019. Became a staff officer on an unidentified post in the newly established European Theatre Command in Izmir.

Transfer to Limnos suggests an ongoing important military operation. According to several sources, Col. Namdar lately became a subordinate of General Ostad Javeed Attar, one of the chief officers of the Iranian military research and arms production.

Sgt. Evan Illing

CTRG Deep Reconnaissance Team “Ice-8″ Commander / SHAPE

American, single, born in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, March 15th 2001. Indisputable combat qualities, capable leadership and daring execution of missions behind enemy lines. Became member of the 10th Special Forces Group in 2025. Deployed to Takistan, Iraq, Caucasus; later, anti-IAF black-op strikes in Turkey. Post-Jerusalem Peace Accord, 10th SF Group and other SOCOM elements transferred to GB.

Captured by Iranian troops during an operation on Crete in 2034; returned in Iranian political prisoner exchange. Commands last active element of Operation Ice Shard, SHAPE’s attempt to gather intel about the Iranian weapons testing facilities in the European/Mediterranean Theatre.

Georgios Akhanteros (“Tyrantâ€)

Former Mayor of Limnos

Greek national, age 60-65, marital status and children unknown. Former mayor of Limnos, now collaborating with Iranian occupation. Previously mayor of Myrina for several terms; ran local businesses and owned several hotels and other tourism-oriented companies.

According to the available resources, runs smuggling and confident networks. Tolerated by Iranians; provides information against resistance weapons traffickers.

See the difference? It's not as desperate a situation as the story once was. That was the point of that post. It's no longer a situation that "calls for irregulars and desperate measures". IDK why BIS toned down the story. Maybe they figured that an Iran conquering all of Europe wasn't realistic or something. IDK

I'd maybe agree with you if you were talking about the Greek resistance, but I mean, in countries today where there are revolts and civil wars, there aren't women taking up arms. There's nothing that would say that the Greek resistance would have men, women, and children fighting. I mean, think about it practically. These resistance members who are against Iranian occupation have families. Someone has to take care of the children. So the men will fight while the women will take care of their families.

This post nor the one you quoted aren't meant to make an argument for or against female soldiers in-game.

1) I was just wondering whether this issue of female soldiers ingame is a game maker or breaker to some people, as I don't know.

2) I was trying to point out to everyone that the story indeed has changed from a year ago.

Edited June 2, 2012 by antoineflemming

[max power 21]

Flooded with profits from the rich export markets of a resource-thirsty SE-Asia and the rising price of oil, bolstered by strong ties with China and strategic entente with Russia, Iran sought to expand its influence.

Deployed under the auspices of a swift humanitarian response, Turkey – decimated by a series of devastating and unprecedented natural disasters – fell within months to ruthless Iranian Armed Forces. Iran’s aggressive expansion – spilling over into Greek sovereign territory – was brought to a halt in Rhodope Prefecture with the ratification of the Jerusalem Peace Accord of 2034, which crystallised a new strategic front along the shorelines of the Aegean Sea.

With the US locked into its own proxy-wars against aggressive Chinese expansionism in the Pacific, with each year more member-states leaving NATO on the promise of Russian oil, the fragmented alliance faces the growing risk of a global conflict that they can ill-afford.

I dunno. It sounds like greece is being occupied to me.

But also, yes, I see what you're saying about the change in storyline.

Edited June 2, 2012 by Max Power