They better have female soldiers...

[r3volution 0]

::edit:: also CombatComm that is chauvinism of the first order... congratulations? ::edit::

I don't understand why the possibility of female soldiers in a game gets some of the community so defensive.

It has already happened in a lot of defence forces around the world, women are at this very moment on the frontlines in combat. This community would be the first to call anyone out for disrespecting members of the armed forces serving their country, so why is it so keen to ignore the contributions of women in that regard?

Hitboxes, cost etc are all issues that Bohemia Interactive can deal with, they shouldn't be used as some kind of smokescreen for sexism.

::edit2:: Also on the note of 'claiming things' we're talking about facts. Women ARE in the military. Deal with it. Just because you won't use them doesn't mean someone else won't want to. Its like white people claiming racism isn't a problem. ::edit2::

Edited March 15, 2013 by r3volution

[scrim 1]

If we're going to claim things, let's claim things that are actually true. There's a good reason CombatComm wrote that, and he's right, women and men are not created equally. This is a basic fact that has been agreed upon by most here, regardless of their view on women in combat/Arma. Can we not get this thing going again?

And seriously, I'd rather the devs focus on finishing things like vehicles rather than add female soldiers that hardly anyone will use ever, just because.

[r3volution 0]

Also I see a lot of stuff covered by THIS in this thread.

"Abusive, racist, sexist, homophobic comments (or any other type of bigotry), personal attacks and name calling are not allowed either on the forum"

[JoshuaEvil 1]

Yarr female soldiers for sure !

[Heradon 1]

I don't think this is a good idea. There will be a loads of guys out there that have to fulfill to their need to pretend to be a cute girl and flirt with other guys. There will be like 1% of the female characters that actually will be played by females. Having a bunch of transsexuals, girls or whatever you name it running on the battlefield ain't very much realistic neither. Anyway i bet most girls can play a male character, like guys can play a female character like Tomb Raider.

Edited March 15, 2013 by Heradon

[CombatComm 10]

Also I see a lot of stuff covered by THIS in this thread.

"Abusive, racist, sexist, homophobic comments (or any other type of bigotry), personal attacks and name calling are not allowed either on the forum"

R3volution, you can stop now, no hot female arma players are going to come calling cuz you came to there defense....im 100% sure.

As I said before, in the grand scheme of things whether or not militaries have authorized females to be in "direct combat" or not, 1 out of 20 woman will actually join up to do that!! I know this! All that money wasted to develop new privacy procedures and training and testing, my god. I hope the US DOD will rescind such a silly decision.

So with that in mind, follow me here, keep focused because I know you're raging right now. Again, with that in mind, WHY in the WORLD would BI devote ANY millisecond of time creating anims, models, legal/rating consideration etc etc etc on this BS??? Just so a few cheeto eating/rockstar drinking feminist can say, "hahaha, got em" and never even consider joining the military for combat positions! Like someone earlier stated the majority of the ones calling for female soldiers are sick men who like watching pixelated asses strut around in "combat shorts". Has anyone seen the kind of twisted crap that gets modded into Skyrim??

I bet you any woman who has served honorably in the military, and I have served with them, could give two Fs whether they where featured in a video game. They know whats sup, they know what they have done and seen in their supporting roles. They know infantry squad is no place for their different sized/strength bodies. I have seen and known women that have died in this war on terror. They deserve a place in the our hearts and history books, but the whole notion that they "better have female soldiers" is ridiculous. In a combat squad/platoon even more so. The majority are drawn to jobs that provide healing/helping support. Medics, nurses etc. Many of the female security forces personnel in the Air Force were all gunning for medical positions and were thrown in that career field to be "cops" against their desire.

The supported reasoning that they allow woman in front line combat in some countries is even more ludicrous. When you look at the raw data and talk to military service woman 1 out of 20 want to ever see combat. If they get into a bind because they are driving trucks in convoys etc many of them will serve as honorably or more so than the man next to them. But to say they want to ruck 20+ miles looking to make enemy contact and put lead downrange is just not the norm. They don't have the testosterone levels. All the girls that I know that play COD or any other FPS are petite little things that are more concerned with hello kitty or men than wanting to "live the game".

I think woman are smarter then men in the sense they are faster at realizing the pixelated bullet streak on screen is a lot more forgiving then the real thing.

And finally, no one is being sexist here, I am stating raw logic, fact and personal testimonies from woman. Noone can deny woman have neither the strength or Endocrinol make up of a man. Yes, I know real women and have gotten into my share of "discussions" about this topic.

Edited March 15, 2013 by CombatComm

[nodunit 397]

I don't think this is a good idea. There will be a loads of guys out there that have to fulfill to their need to pretend to be a cute girl and flirt with other guys.

What do you think this is, an mmorpg? Even then most guys playing as girls don't really give two shits about other guys, I've played WoW, Rift, Guild Wars 2 and I'm sure plenty of these characters were actually men but I never saw a single one flirting, no we were too busy on our little adventure sooo...presumptuous much?

Edited March 15, 2013 by NodUnit

[EuroSlave 1]

If BIS can make such an excellent war sim imagine what they could do with a sex sim...

HUGE MONEY

[NoQuarter 0]

Replying to: Would you like to see women in ArmA 3?Seriously?

Crane your neck (ingame) and look down at your FP-self. See any room for cleavage amongst your LBE?

Play with 3PV enabled? Seems they already have the hip sway taken care of.

Voice pitch can be edited within your Profile options.

____

If BIS were to want to make a stand (or buck a trend) in the genre I would like to see it made in another area.

That being a full civilian complement...to include child units.

Those who look at children depicted in (any) game only as targets are missing the point, and that point is environmental realism.

Seems out of sorts to move a convoy through a small village without a bunch of kids tagging along, tossing soccer balls -or rocks- at the carriers as they roll past.

I know, I know...don't start.

[nodunit 397]

If BIS can make such an excellent war sim imagine what they could do with a sex sim...

HUGE MONEY

I understand the sarcasm but still..just...no.

[r3volution 0]

Well Combatcomm if that was indeed my rationale for attempting to curb a pretty blatant display of sexism I'm sure I'd get the lack of success I would deserve.

So what you're saying is that women should be happy that they can serve their country and don't need to be represented. That's a bit patronising.

Interestingly enough you're also stating indirectly that only men play Arma, because you're referring to the only demand being from men. There's enough women out there who play Arma, I hate to break it to you.

Also I assume you're referring to the nudity mods that Skryim has when you talk about 'twisted crap'. Because obviously a naked woman is FAR more 'twisted' than shooting a guy in the face. Obviously.

You're not stating raw logic, you're hiding your sexism behind a confused pile of illogical contradictory arguments. As most bigots do.

You have also completely failed to address my point, women ARE in your country's military and mine. So we're not arguing about why women can and can't be on the frontline anymore, that argument is over and sexism lost.

Now it's a question of whether a game that positions itself as the most realistic infantry simulator is willing to be realistic and have women as soldiers.

That is all.

[Guest]

I don't think this is a good idea. There will be a loads of guys out there that have to fulfill to their need to pretend to be a cute girl and flirt with other guys. There will be like 1% of the female characters that actually will be played by females. Having a bunch of transsexuals, girls or whatever you name it running on the battlefield ain't very much realistic neither. Anyway i bet most girls can play a male character, like guys can play a female character like Tomb Raider.

Why is that a problem?

It's a huge difference being forced to play a specific protagonist in a game and being forced to play a generic character that is supposed to represent you (if you want) or a character that you want to play. Similar to a RPG. I.e if people want to add their own face to the soldier they can, and have been able to since OFP.

[joebopie 1]

what about female officers, bomb disposal, pilots, tank crew, UAV operators, things were the physical difference's between men and women don't really matter.

[Droikka 1]

what about female officers, bomb disposal, pilots, tank crew, UAV operators, things were the physical difference's between men and women don't really matter.

You do realize you're putting their inclusion even farther away with making them even more niche group than most people here?

I'd prefer that their modellers put their time in better looking tanks, over 10k polygon asses like in PlanetSide 2 ;)

[FREEMASON 1]

if they make some female soldiers i wont fight just watching the characters :))

maybe it's good for pilots but not the others.

[scrim 1]

I feel that it is religious discrimination that there are absolutely zero orthodox Jewish characters available to pick right now. You know, with those two curly locks on the sideburns, whatever it's called, forgot the name.

Seriously, this thread has gone to heck even worse now. R3volution, just don't play the realism card here, because the fact is that men and women are built very differently, and that less than 1% of women are actually capable of the physical demands required by the infantry, artillery, tanks, etc. even in basic training. Why do you think females have considerably lower PT demands? Yes, I see why you can argue for having women in this game, I agree, but realism is a false argument.

[Bee8190 10]

You do realize you're putting their inclusion even farther away with making them even more niche group than most people here?

I'd prefer that their modellers put their time in better looking tanks, over 10k polygon asses like in PlanetSide 2 ;)

What kind of excuse is this? Just because they added snakes or whatever doesn't make it a waste of time, just because you spend most of the time locked in tank.

I don't think this is a good idea. There will be a loads of guys out there that have to fulfill to their need to pretend to be a cute girl and flirt with other guys.

Than let them for all I care but I'm not sure if thinking along these lines are any different than those guys themselfs.

[joebopie 1]

I feel that it is religious discrimination that there are absolutely zero orthodox Jewish characters available to pick right now. You know, with those two curly locks on the sideburns, whatever it's called, forgot the name.

Seriously, this thread has gone to heck even worse now. R3volution, just don't play the realism card here, because the fact is that men and women are built very differently, and that less than 1% of women are actually capable of the physical demands required by the infantry, artillery, tanks, etc. even in basic training. Why do you think females have considerably lower PT demands? Yes, I see why you can argue for having women in this game, I agree, but realism is a false argument.

First, nice sarcasm at the start. made me laugh. (but they shave their heads anyway)

but if we were playing the realism card with your statistics then 1 in 100 solders should be female.

personaly I would like to see it, I don't know why maybe just to add some variety. also I think it would be funny at times(thinking of my clan) maybe it would make more sense to have them as navy or just pilots.

[r3volution 0]

Scrim if you desire the developers to add peyot to the character head choices then I say go for it! It should be pretty easy.

Also you seem to have confused my previous statement which said this thread wasn't a place to argue about whether women should be in the military. I don't honestly care what you think about physical gender disparity. Women are in the army and that should be reflected in the game. Simple really. I mean if someone objects to the fact that people of african descent can serve in the military, should that stop it being reflected in a game? Just because that's not YOUR view?

Secondly. This is a game. A female AI will be every bit as good (or shite) as a male one.

[scrim 1]

See, that's what I'm saying. Whilst I don't believe that women fit in combat arms due to physical differences, that is irrelevant, and thus you're bad off playing the realism card, which is what you did. However, playing the "it's a game" card is what I agree with.

[Kerc Kasha 102]

Judging by the mentality shown by some in this thread, I'm surprised there's' not a 'No girlz allowed' banner stuck to the top of the forum. Seriously why is there so many posts so passionately against it? It doesn't effect you in anyway, if you don't want women in your missions then don't use them? Don't want to go on a public server and see someone being 'hilarious' by running around in their underwear? Well people are doing that already just with the male models so I fail to see how this is any different.

Considering VBS2 has had female soldier models (US soldiers, at that) for quite awhile I think the 'realism' argument is as idiotic as this 'boys club' crap.

[accapella 1]

There's girls who are stronger than most dudes.

Really IMO the reason women are thought to be always weaker than men (the physical limit differences between men and women are true but not even nearly everyone actually tries to reach their limits, meaning that if a woman works out really good she will be stronger than most men) are also societal n shit.

Not many go "Hey gurl, wanna try out boxing? Maybe start lifting irons?" to their daughter, girls are expected to pick up more feminine hobbies while boys are encouraged to start playing hockey or football and to work out.

men are also sometimes a bit freaked out about women who have muscles like Schwarzenegger junior, "no guy wants an amazon".

[scrim 1]

It isn't about to what level you train yourself, it is about the endurance and capabilities you have. Lifting weights will in no way make you more capable a soldier. Being able to carry your ruck that weighs 60kg or more and travel long distances will, and that is something that women due to simple biology are not able to do. Why do you think women and men don't compete against each other in any professional sport? It's not because they don't have huge physical differences.

If you're gonna go OT, at least go OT with something that isn't a lie.

[accapella 1]

It isn't about to what level you train yourself, it is about the endurance and capabilities you have. Lifting weights will in no way make you more capable a soldier. Being able to carry your ruck that weighs 60kg or more and travel long distances will, and that is something that women due to simple biology are not able to do. Why do you think women and men don't compete against each other in any professional sport? It's not because they don't have huge physical differences.

If you're gonna go OT, at least go OT with something that isn't a lie.

roflmao, your heart is a muscle and your cardio strenght develops with proper excercise just like muscle strenght, I was only using an example.

Ofcourse, professional athletes are the type of people who drive themselves to the limit, regular dudes in the military are not even though they are all put into relatively good shape.

edit: having looked at some numbers, the VO2 max differences between men and women aren't dizzying. you might even say women can get closer to men in endurance than in muscular mass.

Edited March 15, 2013 by Helari

[scrim 1]

http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20121026065214/www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/10B34976-75F9-47E0-B376-AED4B09FB3B3/0/women_af_summary.pdf

Yeah right, women are physically capable of the job. Now I remember why I detest this thread: It's because not only are most arguments OT, they're flat out lies. It doesn't matter if a military combat veteran makes a post based on his experience and real life facts, or if I post studies that are specifically about this very subject; The very next post will invariably be written by some "equal rights" guy who blatantly disregards the obvious truth whenever it suits him (or maybe it's just genuine ignorance, who knows), and makes fun of anyone who disagrees with him, and uses arguments such as "it's already happening" (it isn't), "I've seen a woman who beat me in arm wrestling/target shooting" (because arm strength and shooting is all a soldier will ever do).