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Konyak

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The hottest topic on the OFP forums these days, apart from some offtopic anti US flame war that nobody should waste time on, is Satchells sound addon beta that just came out.

This topic just got closed by BIS moderators, and that is one terrific blow to us that have been waiting for the SDK. This is the Addon board, and the subject is dead on target. This was made by Satchell using only his ability to produce and convert sound, just the same as some of us like to retexture.

Why was it shut down? Did this addon insult BIS' feelings, as it replaced a lot of their work, and in many cases improved it? I hope they can handle it, because this creativity they have stomped on is the thing that keeps games like OFP alive.

BIS really needs to make sure they have the right attitude towards their community.

If we change something, it is not out of disrespect for their work, but to tailor certain aspects to various tastes or preferrences that the community cannot expect the developers to spend time on.

I'm sure many of us would like to know what is going on.

Konyak

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Yeah, why did they lock it? We used it as a thread for suggestions to improve the addon. Would BIS rather like us to spread it out over 100 threads or so?

(Edited by Dawdler at 6:21 pm on Dec. 12, 2001)

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</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Konyak on 6:15 pm on Dec. 12, 2001

The hottest topic on the OFP forums these days, apart from some offtopic anti US flame war that nobody should waste time on, is Satchells sound addon beta that just came out.  

This topic just got closed by BIS moderators, and that is one terrific blow to us that have been waiting for the SDK.   This is the Addon board, and the subject is dead on target.  This was made by Satchell using only his ability to produce and convert sound, just the same as some of us like to retexture.  

Why was it shut down?   Did this addon insult BIS' feelings, as it replaced a lot of their work, and in many cases improved it?  I hope they can handle it, because this creativity they have stomped on is the thing that keeps games like OFP alive.  

BIS really needs to make sure they have the right attitude towards their community.  

If we change something, it is not out of disrespect for their work, but to tailor certain aspects to various tastes or preferrences that the community cannot expect the developers to spend time on.

I'm sure many of us would like to know what is going on.

Konyak

<span id='postcolor'>

Agreed.

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I´ve just read this thread after posting my own on the subject, before we all begin to speculate on this, we should wait on a Statement from BIS or CM.

They havn´t shut down subjects on Jim´s soundmod yet, that works the same way by replacing the config.bin, so i am really asking myself whats the point here..........

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Maybe they are insecure.

You know "Our games the best and no one can f**k with it attitude"

I am starting to lose my cool with this game , no feedback (Unless you can write czech) and jsut no communication regarding details on fixes, and then they go and start closing threads for no good reason.

I mean if they want more money for devlopment release (Insert 3 forbidden letters here) units to sell as a pack.

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statement? ha! we should be so lucky.

maybe they closed it cos we didnt put it so eloquently, the bit as you said "improving the sounds, not throwing out the work of BIS" (a loose quote).

a lot seemed to put that the sounds were aweful. we could do with a statement.

it would be quite funny to find out that BIS spent the biggest percentage of time next to coding on getting the sounds done, and satchell did it without such a big budget and in a relatively small amount of time, as well as having a job...

(Edited by Brass at 12:10 am on Dec. 13, 2001)

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Right, since the original topic was closed i would like to take some time to scream at Satchel here, instead

here's what satchel said to me

"

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote: from GFX707 on 6:23 am on Dec. 12, 2001

It only seems to extract using winrar

Wouldn't bother though, it screws up some things in OFP anyway like walls not falling over when you shoot them plus tanks can drive right through them

Personally I think that guy Jim's soundpack was better anyway, although any replacement sounds are appreciated

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When you are using an illegal copy of OFP, unexpected results may be possible with any addon that was made on the basis of a legal copy .

For the walls not falling in, it for sure has absolutely nothing to do with the soundmod, but a bug with HW T&L that is content of Flashpoint since it´s initial release.

When using normal 3D mode buildings/ walls etc collapse as they should.

As i don´t modified ANYTHING other than sounds for the vehicles except missile velocitys, it´s quite strange you are experiencing this, especially as wall/Building  parameters are not stored in the config.bin afaik......

I, nor 4 other people were able to recreate what you experienced.

As you don´t wrote which vehicle can go through walls, nor the place where it happened, there is no way testing your specific situation to recreate it.

Thoughts:

- Either you have messed around with the open config.cpp that came with the package, or did other hacking attempts.

- You don´t own Flashpoint for a longer time period, since the HW T&L Bug, or temporary clipping problems are new to you.

- You own an illegal copy of OFP

- You didn´t follow the installation instructions.

In either way, one thing is for sure and guaranteed , none of your issues are in relation to the soundmod if you own an legal copy of OFP and did follow the installation instructions, if this shouldn´t be the case  it´s your problem not mine ."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ok, I challenge any of you to go into OFP and place a 'FENCE rockwall' object with satchel's or jim's soundmod. Then try to shoot it with an M1A1 gun or drive through it. You drive right through and also your tank shells will go right through it too

Satchel, I don't appreciate you telling me that I have an illegal copy of OFP. That's just not nice. In fact I will take a picture of the box, CD and manual with my webcam if it means you'll drop the lousy attitude (which I severely doubt) and try to fix the bug in your addon

Now, after doing the above, uninstall Satchel's sound mod and then once again try shooting the rockwall down, driving into it with tank or setDammage 1 it and hey f**kING presto, it falls right over again. This also applies to Jim's sound mod. I doubt very much that I have FADE, because I doubt there is such a thing as temporary FADE which goes away as soon as you remove your sound mod IN WHICH CASE I WOULD HAVE YOUR MOD TO BLAME FOR TRIGGERING FADE ANYWAY YOU IMBECILE

if you are releasing this mod the least you can do is be helpful to those who are trying to install and use it. Might I also add that lots of ppl are complaining about not being able to extract the .rar file since it uses that stupid 'cubed' character in it and I found that I could only extract it using winrar and nothing else

anyway I would like to say that Jim's sound mod is better, and I'll go try to find the URL to give to you guys since most people seemed more interested in this one, which I think claims to be more realistic (and might well be) but it just doesn't sound good at all really and its creator is a rude little ass

and I would just like to mention in this edit that the walls not falling over when damage is set to 1 etc thing is nothing to do with HW T&L, since I have owned OFP since the 22nd of June and used the same settings (HW T&L on) and have always been able to knock walls down

(Edited by GFX707 at 12:42 am on Dec. 13, 2001)

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</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from GFX707 on 12:38 am on Dec. 13, 2001

Right, since the original topic was closed i would like to take some time to scream at Satchel here, instead

here's what satchel said to me

"

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote: from GFX707 on 6:23 am on Dec. 12, 2001

It only seems to extract using winrar

Wouldn't bother though, it screws up some things in OFP anyway like walls not falling over when you shoot them plus tanks can drive right through them

Personally I think that guy Jim's soundpack was better anyway, although any replacement sounds are appreciated

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When you are using an illegal copy of OFP, unexpected results may be possible with any addon that was made on the basis of a legal copy .

For the walls not falling in, it for sure has absolutely nothing to do with the soundmod, but a bug with HW T&L that is content of Flashpoint since it´s initial release.

When using normal 3D mode buildings/ walls etc collapse as they should.

As i don´t modified ANYTHING other than sounds for the vehicles except missile velocitys, it´s quite strange you are experiencing this, especially as wall/Building  parameters are not stored in the config.bin afaik......

I, nor 4 other people were able to recreate what you experienced.

As you don´t wrote which vehicle can go through walls, nor the place where it happened, there is no way testing your specific situation to recreate it.

Thoughts:

- Either you have messed around with the open config.cpp that came with the package, or did other hacking attempts.

- You don´t own Flashpoint for a longer time period, since the HW T&L Bug, or temporary clipping problems are new to you.

- You own an illegal copy of OFP

- You didn´t follow the installation instructions.

In either way, one thing is for sure and guaranteed , none of your issues are in relation to the soundmod if you own an legal copy of OFP and did follow the installation instructions, if this shouldn´t be the case  it´s your problem not mine ."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ok, I challenge any of you to go into OFP and place a 'FENCE rockwall' object with satchel's or jim's soundmod. Then try to shoot it with an M1A1 gun or drive through it. You drive right through and also your tank shells will go right through it too

Satchel, I don't appreciate you telling me that I have an illegal copy of OFP. That's just not nice. In fact I will take a picture of the box, CD and manual with my webcam if it means you'll drop the lousy attitude (which I severely doubt) and try to fix the bug in your addon

Now, after doing the above, uninstall Satchel's sound mod and then once again try shooting the rockwall down, driving into it with tank or setDammage 1 it and hey f**kING presto, it falls right over again. This also applies to Jim's sound mod. I doubt very much that I have FADE, because I doubt there is such a thing as temporary FADE which goes away as soon as you remove your sound mod IN WHICH CASE I WOULD HAVE YOUR MOD TO BLAME FOR TRIGGERING FADE ANYWAY YOU IMBECILE

if you are releasing this mod the least you can do is be helpful to those who are trying to install and use it. Might I also add that lots of ppl are complaining about not being able to extract the .rar file since it uses that stupid 'cubed' character in it and I found that I could only extract it using winrar and nothing else

anyway I would like to say that Jim's sound mod is better, and I'll go try to find the URL to give to you guys since most people seemed more interested in this one, which I think claims to be more realistic (and might well be) but it just doesn't sound good at all really and its creator is a rude little ass

and I would just like to mention in this edit that the walls not falling over when damage is set to 1 etc thing is nothing to do with HW T&L, since I have owned OFP since the 22nd of June and used the same settings (HW T&L on) and have always been able to knock walls down

(Edited by GFX707 at 12:42 am on Dec. 13, 2001)

<span id='postcolor'>

What an angry young man you are, the only one getting totally out of line here is you, do you have any personal problems with me that you couldn´t let out for months or so...that seems to be the case, although i don´t even know you from the forums.

I´m german so my english may not be the best to get things across, what you take as "rude" is normal speach for me.

My post hasn´t been insulting in any way, it meant what it states in the section you refer too- "Thoughts"-, and was meant to circle out  possibilities, as you didn´t state how and when it actually happened, because your post mainly focused only on how bad the soundmod is in your oppinion  without any constructive input, that´s ok with me, if you don´t like don´t use, but don´t expect someone to help you when all you do is flame attempts. After all i clearly said (and it´s in the readme too) that this is an very early phase of it, meant to get feedback for improvements, because many people asked for a sample.

That you extract a .rar file with winrar should be pretty selfexplaining ?!?

Many people like the addon, even if it´s not finished and beta as it states, this is why i wanted feedback, preferably of the constructive sort, not bashing- for that you can troll yourself over to offtopic forum, until you get rid of your envious tendencies, i´m really getting to old for this crap wink.gif.

(Edited by Satchel at 3:06 am on Dec. 13, 2001)

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I don't see how I come across as envious.

Anyway, at least accept the fact that I have tested OFP without and while using your sound addon (by replacing the 'bin' directory with the original OFP one) and have found that beyond any doubt, your sound addon (and jim's sound addon, too, if it helps) cause the problem of not being able to knock over stone walls, and being able to drive through them in a tank like they weren't even there. You cannot make them fall over any way at all, which is a right pain in the arse if you want to use them as a roof for a bunker.

Anyway, I will be polite from now on, it just seemed to me as if you were being just a tad aggressive towards me. Ignore my opinion of your sound mod, and take not of the bugs that it is causing which is mainly what I was posting about. The thing that I took most offense to was your implication that I simply MUST be using an illegal copy of OFP because your mod caused me a problem, also the way you worded it. There has been a long history of OFP user mods causing problems in the game, in case you haven't noticed.

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</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from GFX707 on 2:55 am on Dec. 13, 2001

I don't see how I come across as envious.

Anyway, at least accept the fact that I have tested OFP without and while using your sound addon (by replacing the 'bin' directory with the original OFP one) and have found that beyond any doubt, your sound addon (and jim's sound addon, too, if it helps) cause the problem of not being able to knock over stone walls, and being able to drive through them in a tank like they weren't even there. You cannot make them fall over any way at all, which is a right pain in the arse if you want to use them as a roof for a bunker.

Anyway, I will be polite from now on, it just seemed to me as if you were being just a tad aggressive towards me. Ignore my opinion of your sound mod, and take not of the bugs that it is causing which is mainly what I was posting about. The thing that I took most offense to was your implication that I simply MUST be using an illegal copy of OFP because your mod caused me a problem, also the way you worded it. There has been a long history of OFP user mods causing problems in the game, in case you haven't noticed.<span id='postcolor'>

Hope we seddled this now, as it´s not easy writing in english and get the things same way across as i would do it in my native language. As for the walls not falling down/ shoot through, seems to be a misunderstanding, as you don´t wrote which walls dont fall down in your first post, so i assumed you were writing about buildings and normal walls, which i´m able to destroy with the soundmod active when shooting at, as well as drive them over. This is why i said that there is no way that your observations are caused by the addon, i tested it even with 4 people in multiplayer and it worked without problems.

I can´t find the object "FENCE RockWall", i couldn´t place it with the editor (its not in there), nor did a manual editing of the mission.sqm work out.

I´ve tried the following combos:

"FENCE RockWall"

"FENCE_RockWall"

"FENCERockWall"

everytime i get an error like "no entry in config.cpp"!

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"You know that the mice here have a sweeter taste than down by the docks" said Joe "Yeah it is because the mice at the dock always breath in smoke and exhaust so they taste like ash" said Don "Well the mice up hear sleep were we pee so what do that tell you"

"Pee is sweet" said Drunkin Joe "Sure" said Deadly Don. Don ripped Joe's leg of and beat him to unconciousness.Then he peed on Joe. The mice feasted. "Now there will be a new flavor" said Dangerous Don.

        THE END

(Edited by Cucuma at 7:13 am on Dec. 13, 2001)

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</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Cucuma on 7:11 am on Dec. 13, 2001

"You know that the mice here have a sweeter taste than down by the docks" said Joe "Yeah it is because the mice at the dock always breath in smoke and exhaust so they taste like ash" said Don "Well the mice up hear sleep were we pee so what do that tell you"

"Pee is sweet" said Drunkin Joe "Sure" said Deadly Don. Don ripped Joe's leg of and beat him to unconciousness.Then he peed on Joe. The mice feasted. "Now there will be a new flavor" said Dangerous Don.

        THE END

(Edited by Cucuma at 7:13 am on Dec. 13, 2001)

<span id='postcolor'>

Lol, i don't know what your problem is, but I'll bet it's hard to pronounce, seems to be in the category pee fetish.

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</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Satchel on 3:34 am on Dec. 13, 2001

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from GFX707 on 2:55 am on Dec. 13, 2001

I don't see how I come across as envious.

Anyway, at least accept the fact that I have tested OFP without and while using your sound addon (by replacing the 'bin' directory with the original OFP one) and have found that beyond any doubt, your sound addon (and jim's sound addon, too, if it helps) cause the problem of not being able to knock over stone walls, and being able to drive through them in a tank like they weren't even there. You cannot make them fall over any way at all, which is a right pain in the arse if you want to use them as a roof for a bunker.

Anyway, I will be polite from now on, it just seemed to me as if you were being just a tad aggressive towards me. Ignore my opinion of your sound mod, and take not of the bugs that it is causing which is mainly what I was posting about. The thing that I took most offense to was your implication that I simply MUST be using an illegal copy of OFP because your mod caused me a problem, also the way you worded it. There has been a long history of OFP user mods causing problems in the game, in case you haven't noticed.<span id='postcolor'>

Hope we seddled this now, as it´s not easy writing in english and get the things same way across as i would do it in my native language. As for the walls not falling down/ shoot through, seems to be a misunderstanding, as you don´t wrote which walls dont fall down in your first post, so i assumed you were writing about buildings and normal walls, which i´m able to destroy with the soundmod active when shooting at, as well as drive them over. This is why i said that there is no way that your observations are caused by the addon, i tested it even with 4 people in multiplayer and it worked without problems.

I can´t find the object "FENCE RockWall", i couldn´t place it with the editor (its not in there), nor did a manual editing of the mission.sqm work out.

I´ve tried the following combos:

"FENCE RockWall"

"FENCE_RockWall"

"FENCERockWall"

everytime i get an error like "no entry in config.cpp"!

<span id='postcolor'>

It came with gunslinger's or kegetys's objects addon, pretty much everyone has either of these I believe, should be selectable in the empty---->support menus

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So you blame Satchel because his mod isnt working correctly with another mod? How rude.

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Guys,

you are screaming at each other, giving other people bad names...

And you still wonder why BIS closed the thread???

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no, we werent shouting at eachother in that one, it only seems to be in this one.

i think satchell has made a capitol mod, and its probably the other mods that are the ones responsible, as how the heck can a sound mod effect a LEGIT non-sound addon like for a wall? tis mod was made with the full game in mind, and any unofficial addons are not covered by it, so you should put up, cos i dont think satchell will go as far as to accomodate for 50-odd unlegitimate changes to the game, although he has been very helpful so far in supporting the mod

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The average life expectancy of a sensible thread on these boards is about 6 hours. That said, we are off topic. However, we seem to want to hear from BIS on this thread closing.

Since the thread has evolved into other things, I might as well comment on those.

GFX707 claims to have a legal copy, and as such has no fade problems. *Then* he mentions he has the Gunslinger addon, which has reportedly triggered Fade on many machines. I don't know how many people use Gunslingers editor upgrade, but I for one wont come near it smile.gif

I would like to contribute some constructive critisism on Satchells sound mod though.

The most serious one which isn't based on a matter of taste, is the fact that when a tank or heli or any loud vehicle is driving close by, turning your head will produce strange results. The sound travels normally from ear to ear, but at a certain point, the sound dies completely, even if the heli or tank is right next to you. Mostly this happens when you turn your head to the right of the sound. Also, if a heli is approaching, and you are a good distance away from it, you can hear it coming, but if you turn your head away from it, the sound is drastically reduced. This is unrealistic, as a sound that far away, yet that loud, has very little direction sense. Don't know if Satchell can controll this very accurately.

Another thing is the sound of guns that are perhaps 100 meters from you, firing at you.. You hardly hear any gunshots at all. I have no real life experience of this, but I have been close to guns fired, and you can hear a definate bang 3-400 meters away. At least from a shotgun smile.gif AK's and M16's may have deliberately reduced bangs smile.gif That said, firing most of the guns seems rather dull as well. They hardly produce any sense of power, and the volume of the sound is very low, and very crisp. No base.

Finally, the clank clank clank of the tanks sounds a bit strange, more like a jackhammer in slo-mo. Handgranade is also very weak sounding. I have lit more impressive explosives on New Years Eve that are wrapped in paper and kids play with them smile.gif

Ok, this all sounds bad, I know, but it is all in the right direction, and I really want this sound pack to be as good as it can be, just like OFP in general. So now Satchell finds himself in BIS' shoes, and he get's pestered with nuances like these smile.gif But I know this is a beta and I know he has the patience and ability to perfect this undertaking.. I hope my observations help toward that.

Good luck Satchell,

Konyak

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right, since you are all so vehemently refusing to believe me I will say once again, nice and simple

I have tested this bug both with satchels addon installed and without. When I remove the sound mod

(by deleting the bin directory and replacing it with the original)

I DO NOT GET SUCH PROBLEMS. Gunslinger's addon installed or not.

However, as soon as I replace satchel's mod, the problem occurs again.

NOW HOW MUCH SIMPLER THAN THAT DOES IT COME, PEOPLE....? There you have probably the most simple and precise test I could have done. Like I said, read the post again if you didn't catch that

Once again gunslinger's addon was installed during both of the tests. I did this over and over, same problem. So don't go saying I have FADE or an illegal copy.

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Ok people,

on one hand i´m pretty much pissed at BIS simply closing the initial thread without having a cause to do so or giving any statement on that - on the other hand i´m not making the soundmod for BIS but for every single one of you, the community, and i won´t let you stand in the rain with unfinished beta phase gear.

So work will continue, even if BIS puts in the most insane encryption on files in the next patch, i honestly don´t care anymore because some talented head will hopefully be able crack it. If it shouldn´t be cracked i will continue to play OFP 1.30, even if patch 2.00 would be nearing it´s completion- if BIS doesn´t reconsider to provide an open editable config.bin and shifts the security measures over to the main Flashpoint.exe, that should be responsible for checking the users setup in Multiplayer games.

As for cheating concerns with an open config.cpp,

most games i know of and own can be edited in their aspects; sounds, graphics, weapon parameters and although this is possible, by no means its easier to cheat in Multiplayer because it´s a server thing with weapon.cfg´s a.e., should this be your main concern...only Flashpoint is this insanely restrictive.

If i would edit Ghost Recon weapon parameters in the respective open- and mod friendly config files, it wouldn´t work out in multiplayer when logging in as client, simple as that. So why doesn´t Flashpoint work the same way by giving at least an unencryptet config.bin, i simply can´t understand that.

BIS doesn´t support this effort as i understand, so be it, but instead of closing down threads and denying information on modding aspects or releasing further tools for editing, they should preferably concentrate on doing their part, that is first and foremost fixing the game.

My intentions are not to screw up OFP, or perverting the concept behind the game, but to give it a new aspect that helps keeping it alive, because i´m interested in OFP.

Thank you all for your support and feedback so far, it´s appreciated. smile.gif

P.S.:

New MP3´s of new weapon sounds later this day, along with the config.cpp fix for those people having problems installing the Beta mod.

(Edited by Satchel at 1:58 pm on Dec. 14, 2001)

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i hope you copyright it, you know, "these" corporate pigs can do anything...

im sure it wouldnt cost too much, if anything...

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Here is a small fix for those having trouble hearing the new sounds of the CCIÅ‚AudioSFX pakage at all.

This problem was caused by an character in the .pbo file name and config.cpp, the ł doesn´t seem to work on all systems, thus invalidating all references from the config.cpp to the audiofile container.

To install and fix this issue simply overwrite the existing config.cpp with this one, and rename the CCIÅ‚AudioSFX.pbo in your addons folder to CCI3AudioSFX.pbo. Should work now.

Remember the project is still Beta.

Download fix

(Edited by Satchel at 3:36 am on Dec. 15, 2001)

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how's it going satchell? done anything new? how about you and jim, anything happened?

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Personally I thought OFP's default sounds were shamefully pathetic. I've been waiting since day 1 for someone to release a sound pack.

Good work Satchel, it's amazing how much atmosphere new (and more realistic) sounds can add to the game. Battles actually SOUND like battles now.

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So where do we find the sound mod?

I personally don't find anything wrong with the sounds in ofp, but if you say u got better ones I'd love to give em a listen to.

I love noise.

PS I tried the link to your fix, didn't work for me though.

(Edited by amos m at 2:33 pm on Dec. 19, 2001)

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