Taviana Island for ArmA 2!

[R0adki11 3945]

I think this post shows where or when a new release might happen: http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?142504-My-work-is-being-illegally-sold-on-World-Zombie-ru&p=2286792&viewfull=1#post2286792

[ianbanks 30]

I think this post shows where or when a new release might happen: http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?142504-My-work-is-being-illegally-sold-on-World-Zombie-ru&p=2286792&viewfull=1#post2286792

Like I said before, Taviana is now not a public addon. Martin is now on the staff of dayzorigins.com (he has the title "DayZ Origins Lead Designer" in the post you linked to), Taviana has been rebranded for them (including in-game advertising of various sites) and RipThrough Studios has been rebranded to be part of Gamers Platoon. The name of the map (in the configuration files) has gone from "Taviana" to "Taviana (DayZ: Origins)".

There are some screenshots here that show the most important changes to the map:

http://imgur.com/a/zaB9r

( ;) )

Martin is aware of the threads about this (he pointed one out when talking to a friend) so I'm not sure why he has chosen not to comment. He said the following to the project lead for one of the free public addons that uses Taviana:

[28 January 2013]

[...]

[1:29:00 PM] Brian Hicks: Are we going to be able to get our hands on the latest Taviana for DayZTaviana.com?

[1:29:25 PM] Martin: Nope

[1:29:53 PM] Brian Hicks: I know last time we spoke it was not ready, and was not supposed to be released in the 1.5.0 from DayZLand.

[1:30:07 PM] Brian Hicks: Oh, why not? Do we no longer have your permission to use Tavi?

[1:30:33 PM] Martin: You can use the public 1.0 of course

[1:30:46 PM] Martin: but since then I dont make public addon anymore

Since that conversation, Martin has also told him that he is now considering even pulling Taviana 1.0 down; "I'm starting to consider taking even version 1.0 off the BIS forums" were his words to Brian.

And also, I can't find any proper acknowledgements for any of the (many) ARMA community addons Martin has used in DayZ Origins.

[spooky lynx 73]

Sad to hear this. I hoped Taviana project will last longer.

[krycek 349]

Well it was fun while it lasted,not that I don't appreciate that Martin released the v1.0(or that he owns us anything) but like usual most of us get the end of the stick because of a few thieving pricks.I guess Tavi porting to A3 is also off.

Oh well if this shit with stealing modders work and also benefiting financially from the said work will continue,in the future we might not even have a free modding scene.See the case of Railworks Train Simulator where new trains&routes cost lots of cash and bringing the package to a few thousand bucks.

Also this Dayz stuff is starting to take a chunk from Arma games(resources,modders).Hope BI won't turn into "BI the best in zombie sims".

Edited January 30, 2013 by Krycek

[ianbanks 30]

The poster of this comment (who talked to the DayZ Origins owners, gamersplatoon.com) were apparently told that gamersplatoon.com now own the copyright for Taviana Island itself:

http://www.reddit.com/r/dayz/comments/17klzv/so_the_makers_of_dayz_origins_gamersplatoon_are/c86e29r

Which could explain why Martin won't be releasing public versions. :(

[ProfTournesol 956]

It would be nice to have a word by Martin here :)

[chrisb 196]

I can understand that, if your pocket is picked, then you retaliate if you can. I think this is the way Martin saw to get back at the ones that stole his work for commercial exploit, using it without his express perimision (picked his pocket).

I liked Taviana, but it wasn’t a favourite or anything, I have made missions for it, but it lacked performance in some areas.

I hope he benefits from his great work on it, it took a long time and a lot of hard work to make it, so he deserves to do whatever he likes with it and make from it what he can..

When a game moves from being a bit of a niche, into mainstream use, which is what is happening to Arma 2, via DayZ and the whole zombie thing, then a different approach has to be made by island/terrain makers in particular. These can be very sort after items, so if you think there can be a financial reward for your work, then it seems only fair that if you made it, you can ask for those financial rewards. It was after all a mod that started all this.

When Dayz is released as a stand alone (maybe already is, not sure), it will slow down the onset of this sort of thing, but I feel the series has turned a corner, maybe for many people, the wrong corner, but thats just the way it goes sometimes..

[krycek 349]

Well if he decided to go commercial it would have been nice for us Arma fans to still have the option to at least purchase it.I would have gladly put some coin on it.Otherwise I don't get why he asked us to report bugs and the like if he decided to make it available only to Dayz.Like I said it doesn't bother me at all that he gets money for all the work he invested in this island but seems a bit "quite not alright" he decided not to release anymore updates to Arma crowd because of that cretin with his dayz server.

[nettrucker 142]

It's his island and his decision. The whole story had an unforeseen turn I believe. Fact is that when you're an creative artist there will be always people who try to benefit financially from your work no matter in what field. Martin hasn't posted for quite a while maybe he has left the ArmA community although I find that most unlikely to be. He's most probably busy for the next time updating the DayZ version. His choice and we have to accept it. If he cut an commercial deal than he might be even forced to remove the ArmA version which would be really a shame.

[ianbanks 30]

I can understand that, if your pocket is picked, then you retaliate if you can. I think this is the way Martin saw to get back at the ones that stole his work for commercial exploit, using it without his express perimision (picked his pocket).

I don't see how becoming the abuser is a good way to handle abuse, though. -Martin-'s DayZ Origins contains Icewindo's Stalkers Units (these are actually one of the big selling points of it, people have been posting pictures of them on various forums for days without knowing they're actaully Icewindo's ports), Python.au's SUV Recolours, and lots of pre-release code from R4Z0R's team. If anyone can find even attribution for these I'd love to see it.

You've also got to understand that Martin actively encouraged an eco-system around a public Taviana, and now these people are screwed. He's said on numerous occasions that Taviana would be on ARMA III:

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?105530-Taviana-Island-for-ArmA-2!&p=2158442#post2158442

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?105530-Taviana-Island-for-ArmA-2!&p=2027811#post2027811

http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?119195-ArmA-2-island-compatibility&p=1928571#post1928571

...and you've got people doing awesome work like this in preparation for it going to ARMA III:

http://www.moddb.com/mods/taviana-life-rpg (Check out some of the video's, the Taviana specific models are incredibly detailed and well made).

But now they're boned.

Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying Martin has any responsibility to update Taviana or give it away. The abandoned projects thread is full of maps people couldn't finish. But I don't think anyone wants this community to become a source of free models and map making tools for companies either.

[...] Martin hasn't posted for quite a while maybe he has left the ArmA community although I find that most unlikely to be. [...]

He checks in to this forum practically every day; look at his profile page.

[vilas 473]

http://www.moddb.com/mods/taviana-life-rpg (Check out some of the video's, the Taviana specific models are incredibly detailed and well made).

But now they're boned.

Don't get me wrong; I'm not saying Martin has any responsibility to update Taviana or give it away. The abandoned projects thread is full of maps people couldn't finish. But I don't think anyone wants this community to become a source of free models and map making tools for companies either.

i see there my models on screens (not even know what is except those screens)

hmmm

i hope it is not another commercial project (i wrote to them to clarify it)

btw. sad things that since some time some addons/mods gone commercial but if some (post OFP) players shouted here so much "DLC wooow DLC" than it has its effect if COD-kids enter Armaversum (OFPversum), but sad anyway that addons go to payware not freeware , majority of people here (especially on the west) love addons and they are happy and have joy , which gives addonmakers wings, but sad news anyway that commercialization goes (i am still used to OFP style) ,

indeed it will be deep shit if addonmakers will have to pay for payware games based on Arma engine to check if there are their models, textures etc.

using something for freeware and using it for payware is 2 different kind of usage,

those are models which are from pack that i released as Public MLODS for addonmakers to create free content ! not exclusive payware

Martin - i tried to wrote second message but your PM box is full, add me to Skype too

Edited February 2, 2013 by vilas

[Polaris 1]

Martin I added you on Skype, I attempted to send you a PM but your inbox was full, please accept me. I would like to discuss an offer with you.

[ProfTournesol 956]

I agree with you Vilas, all this isn't good for our community spirit, always wanting to monetarize things is so lame.

[Graz 1]

It's worse then that.

I have recently become aware that in addition to icewindos units, the dayz-origins team had been using a fair amount of other peoples work, without credit and selling their services for money.

So Far:

The day/night cycle was taken from another mod (Dayz redux) without credit

Many of their 'surivor-made' units are taken from Dayz 2017, with no acknowledgement. I wouldn't be surprised if code was stolen from 2017 either (I haven't confirmed either way)

Bugfixes I created for Taviana Island have been put into the map, not released publicly and no credit is given.

Icewindo's Hazmats are being used without his permission (afaik) and no credit is given. (These may have been taken out, not %100 sure)

Some (small) Dayz Namalsk coding was taken aswell, with no credit given

What's really scummy is that someone would make this kind of thread, then turn around and support a website that is doing exactly the same stealing.

Absolutely poor form but Taviana has been a cursed, sub-par map from day 1 because of ego and greed. It's a shame, because it had such potential as a map!!!

[icewindo 29]

It's worse then that.

I have recently become aware that in addition to icewindos units, the dayz-origins team had been using a fair amount of other peoples work, without credit and selling their services for money.

So Far:

The day/night cycle was taken from another mod (Dayz redux) without credit

Many of their 'surivor-made' units are taken from Dayz 2017, with no acknowledgement. I wouldn't be surprised if code was stolen from 2017 either (I haven't confirmed either way)

Bugfixes I created for Taviana Island have been put into the map, not released publicly and no credit is given.

Icewindo's Hazmats are being used without his permission (afaik) and no credit is given. (These may have been taken out, not %100 sure)

Some (small) Dayz Namalsk coding was taken aswell, with no credit given

What's really scummy is that someone would make this kind of thread, then turn around and support a website that is doing exactly the same stealing.

Absolutely poor form but Taviana has been a cursed, sub-par map from day 1 because of ego and greed. It's a shame, because it had such potential as a map!!!

DayzOrigins

:bitch:

Didn't even know about my hazmat units being used... temporary or not...

I'm surprised to see that my post apocalypse units were not ripped though. The funny thing is that they also violate GSC Gameworlds IP (stalker units) since GSC only allowed non-commercial use of their models.

GSC is dead now ofc. but BitComposerGames (german publisher) has bought the rights for the series. I dunno if they care but I'll write them anyway.

[iceman77 18]

So their using your guys work illegally? After the huge thread about... nvm :confused:

[vilas 473]

So their using your guys work illegally? After the huge thread about... nvm :confused:

huge thread was by Martin himself, but Martin is 1 person,

DayZ is commercialized mod which will relase along with BIS (as i suppose ? having engine) standalone GAME (like Russians released super quality Iron Front instead of free mod Liberation)

and in my case there is RPG Life Taviana mod which i do not know if it is freeware or payware (if free than okay, let them use it and have fun, if it is part of DayZ and pay content than i want money)

so maybe Martin cooperating with others had no idea about all other things happening (reason is simple, lack of time, believe me , when you do huge addons it is huge time effort, so you not read forums, you not play, you simply work, and when you find something out it is cause someone reported you)

so Martin may even not know anything cause he spends 100% of his time on island hoping to be profesional developer (and work in dream-job not job which you must do to earn, if i could i would also want to work in graphic not in office)

i also had not idea till i visited 94th page of this topic (cause i wanted to see what's new in Taviana development)

i would not have any idea till i haven't seen screens : http://media.moddb.com/cache/images/mods/1/22/21598/thumb_620x2000/ArmA2OA_2012-11-09_19-16-53-89.jpg http://media.moddb.com/cache/images/mods/1/22/21598/thumb_620x2000/ArmA2OA_2012-11-12_14-10-49-83.jpg

about IceWindo's stuff i had no idea till IceWindo wrote here

everything looks different if use is commercial use, if someone takes my model and incorporates it in his mod which is free of charge it is okay and even not pisses me when it is without permission (cause it is free), but if it is incorporated in VBS, other games, pay-content than it pisses me off, like every other maker, cause it is money that someone earns on you (games are nowadays as profitable as movies ,i read article that games now earn more than Hollywood, so you can imagine what money we talk about),

so far I am waiting for response from guy from this RPG Taviana Life mod, if it is freeware or pay-ware (maybe they are not DayZ and this guy making RPG mod also has no idea that Taviana will be pay-ware in future and he started RPG mod with hope to have Taviana updates in future)

Edited February 4, 2013 by vilas

[Polaris 1]

As a developer I think it's really disappointing that Martin has apparently decided to leave all the developers who have taken the time and effort to develop for his map stuck with a map that has lots of little bugs that accumulate to make the map simply not live up to its potential. Obviously he has had some issues with a couple of people using his work for monetary gain without his permission, which is awful and I feel for him, but developers have spent a lot of time developing for his map and without them no one would be playing on it or using it and many of them spent a long time finding and reporting bugs to help him as well and he decides to treat them like this. It's not very mature or professional in my opinion. Obviously it's his creation to do with as he wishes but I for one will lose quite a lot of respect for him if he does decide to leave the map in it's current state and develop for the apparently questionable modification he is currently developing for.

Life Project RPG (http://www.lifeprojectrpg.com) uses it, we loved the atmosphere of the map, we thought it was perfect for our modification. Our modification is completely free, we don't even accept donations. I've been trying to get in contact with Martin to have a discussion but it's proving quite difficult unfortunately.

[ianbanks 30]

Vilas,

I mentioned RPG Life Taviana just as an example of an addon that required Taviana. I do not think they are using your work for commercial purposes. Nothing I have read about them makes me think they are commercial.

However, it may be good to talk to them anyhow about your models because when addons get merged/aggregated in to big packages it is easy to accidentally (or deliberately some times) make it look like the person merging did all the hard work, or forget that the newly created work must also respect the licences of the addons it includes or uses.

[vilas 473]

i talked with Martin today on Skype, i told him to clarify issues from this topic but as far as i understood there is little of misunderstandings regarding Taviana and DayZ,

cause there is one website which is confusing people that DayZ is pay-ware while it is free ware and it can be downloaded at no costs,

Martin said he is very very busy with other work so he had no time to clarify misunderstandings here, i said he must clarify cause some misunderstandings leading people into wrong direction (me myself thought that mods related to DayZ are pay-content etc. but seems that he develops freeware content) but let Martin clean and clarify here himself (cause he is over-worked with DayZ upcoming patch/update so much that he had even no time for clearing issues here)

assuming: as far as i understood Martin today, he still develops freeware content , he develops addons for free still among DayZ Origns mod, but there are website which are misleading people confusing it is pay-ware , i hope he will find time soon to clarify it before all gone bad ,

guys from RPG Life Taviana so far not answered to and Martin said he and DayZ Origns has nothing to do with this RPG Life Taviana which was shown above

sorry to playing here advocatus ;)

[flv*venom* 83]

Howdy, does anybody know what this means for 'Taviana for Arma 2' ?

will the island still be available for download in the future? Will it be taken down because it's now part of some Day Z mod?

Sorry to ask this but I really don't care about all that zombie / horror mambo jambo, Taviana was / is the island with the most authentic feeling for creating cold war uprising scenarios, and it would be sad news if it will disappear...

[krycek 349]

Well if you talked with him Vilas,would be nice for Martin to come here and just drop a line and clarify if Taviana would have more updates for Arma2 or is it Dayz exclusive.Also if he still considering porting it to A3.

[Jastreb 69]

AFAIK Martin created this map FOR FREE for use with Arma2. Nobody can take this map and make it WHATEVER exclusive especially not ****** dayz.

But its not why I came here. If anyone have Warfare and such missions created for this lovely map let me know. If not lets port some.

[ianbanks 30]

Vilas,

That is correct, there is no one selling DayZmod itself (except for DayZ Bounty and World Zombie.ru). No one would buy it anyway, since standalone is coming out and there are many other free versions.

The issue with DayZ (in general) is companies have been making private versions and renting servers, withholding the .bikey files so that no one else can run the same version. They also use maps in their marketing as cross promotion for their other products. This is why map makers like Icebreakr have had to talk to the companies in the past.

[Polaris 1]

I simply want a fixed version of Taviana, that's all, not new content but simply a fixed version of the map. Leaving the map in it's current state will mean modifications simply have to stop using the map which will be seriously disappointing.